Hi everyone, I have not posted in months, but I have been reading the posts for comfort. I have a question for all BS. Why do we always (me included) look for fault in the other party and not our lying, cheating spouse. For those who don't know me, I was betrayed by my H. We have been married for 18 years. In July 2001 I found out by accident he had a 2/1/2 year old daughter who lived less than a mile away. I called this women every dirty, nasty name I could think of. She has not had the paternity test done as far as I know. I finally broke down and told my children and they seem to be handling it well. But you know what I learned after all this time. I could care less if it his baby or not... it will not take from the fact that he had an affair and he lied and he had unprotected sex. If she is a nasty, lying whore it doesn't make me feel good, it just says my H whom I loved and respected laid with a lying, nasty whore. So again, why should I forgive him and not her. She didn' promise to love me? Tell me please, why forgive him and not her?

LP,<p>In order for me to move forward I had to forgive both for the affair. Any anger that I had towards exOW was redirected at my H. He was the one that got me in this situation. I agree with you exOW didn't owe me anything she didn't make vows to me but my H did. I forgave them both for the affair and I'm trying to move forward, now I'm working at forgiving exOW for the fatal attraction crap/antics she's pulled and continues to pull since D-day. <p>
Unsure<p>[ February 26, 2002: Message edited by: UNSure919400 ]</p>

[img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Wow... that's an interesting question.<p>One BS will say that knowing the WS's A was a ONS made BS feel terrible because WS was out there just for sex. Another BS will say that WS was emotionally involved and it was terrible because A was difficult to end (WS in withdrawal). Sometimes OPs get blamed because they were BEST FRIENDS with BS... Sometimes OPs get blamed so that BS can see WS in a light that will enable them to forgive WS and try to move on.<p>Maybe it's kind of like when our kids mess up and disappoint us. We love them no matter what and we give them so much grace even tho we could just strangle them. Maybe OPs just get less grace than WS because BS loves WS so much... It's so much easier to hate OPs... And I haven't even mentioned the OPs who are hoping the WS will leave the BS and marry OP! [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <p>Still, it's a very good question you ask because forgiving the OP might be the first giant step in moving forward with your own recovery from the betrayal. Forgiving OP releases God's Hand to be able to deal with the OP (or whomever hurt you, for that matter). Until we forgive, the matter remains in OUR hands...

Dear LemonPie,<p>I hope I don't sound like a PollyAnna here, because I will tell you that forgiving might be the most difficult thing that we are called to do.<p>I have forgiven our exOW for a couple of reasons. 1. God said to, I believe Him, I am going to do it. <p>2. I believe that most of what we are commanded to do is not intended to make us uncomfortable, but in the long run is for our own good. <p>Although exOW has apologized to me for her part in this, and both of them admit that in the beginning of their relationship she was the aggressor, refusing to forgive her would keep me tied to her. It would distract me from my greatest responsibility--my marriage and my children.<p>3. No matter what she did, no matter what, my H was the one who had the vows. He was the one that broke the vows.<p>I read elsewhere on MBers an example. Suppose you are a partner in a business. You contrive to let someone else into the store so that they can rob the store of its treasures. Well, you are guilty of breaking the covenant with your business partner, but that doesn't mean that the robber isn't still guilty of robbery. I do not believe that the OW is innocent in all of this. I also do not believe that she is MORE guilty than my H who betrayed his vows AND robbed us of our marital treasures.<p>MJ

Wow Lemonpie
I do remember your posts months ago and they were FULL of anger toward the OW. You seem like you want to forgive her in order to move on. I think that's a good idea.

in my case, I have forgiven the OW on the phone the night she called me and she told me she neither asked for nor wanted my forgiveness which showed me the type of *person* she is.<p>I have forgiven her as I have forgiven my Husband, but the anger and the resentment that are there has nothing to do with forgiving.<p>These are real emotions that only time can heal and move on from.<p>From reviewing the facts of our particular case, I can see where my OW is a serious threat and problem to us...she was before we were married and she is now after we are married.<p>I dont' have to let her actions rule my life anymore, but I'm working towards to being a united team with my Husband.<p>I have more issues to work out with my H then I ever do with OW, who I perceive to be an emotionally unstable woman, with low self esteem. I do what I can do best for her and that is pray.<p>My faith is what keeps me going.<p>Good to see you again, Lemonpie...<p>Twiisty

Like BtDt said, there are many reasons we might hate the XOW. Meanwhile, our spouse live with us, have a history with us, often have children with us, make (if they're smart!) an effort to win back our hearts and heal our marriage. Obviously, there are more reasons to forgive a wandering spouse than the person who helped them break their marriage vows! <p>On the other hand, there are reasons for forgiving the XOP... Forgiveness, I would like to point out, has different meanings and definitions to different people. But I do think we have to come to some kind of peace with the XOP issue (even just privately) in order to move on.<p>Good luck,
J

Lemonpie,<p>Good question. I don't post much, but this topic caught my eye and my attention. I forgave my husband because he asked to be forgiven. He apologized to me, and told me how sorry he was and has only done things to show me that ever since. He constantly shows me everyday that he loves me and that our marriage is important to him. He will still bring up our sorry he is out of the blue and how he was so stupid to risk our marriage, etc. I know he is sorry and that is why I forgave him. <p>I kind of see it like how I see things with God. I must ask Him for forgiveness and be truly sorry for what I did.<p>On the other hand, OW has never said sorry. She has never once asked my H how I took things, she has never worried about our marriage. She has never tried to tell me sorry, and I don't believe she even cares. She had the nerve to tell my H she still loves him. Please... She doesn't have any concerns for me or my marriage, yet I worry about her daughter and have struggled with how her daughter has no father. <p>Simply put, she is a much easier target. I can't be mad at my H anymore because I forgave him, I love him and he has proven to me he that our marriage is important to him. OW has given me no reason to like her, or feel sorry for or or even forgive her for that matter. Though I don't feel I haven't forgiven her either. <p>Just my 2 cents. I just had to post my thoughts.
Hello to everyone!! Miss you all!<p>happy_girl<p>5 years into recovery!!

Happy Girl! Great to "see" you! Great answer too.<p>I hope your schooling and pregnancy are going great!! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

Catnip =^^=<p>[ March 03, 2002: Message edited by: catnip ]</p>

Hello,
I just wanted to say if the OW called and asked for forgiveness and seem very sorry for what she did then I would fogive.
Maybe I will forgive her someday. I have not yet forgiven my H yet either for what he has put me through. Especially, sine I was at risk of miscarrying. He knew what he was doing.<p>In my case I was also pregnant at the same time I was 3 1/2 months pregnant at the time and at risk of losing my son. I was bleeding on and off and I went into preterm labor at 30 weeks and put on bedrest but did she ever call and ask how I was doing? No. she did not care but I do know that she was upset that my H never called her and ask her how she was doing and never went to the dr. appointments. Maybe that is why he asked to see the baby at the hospital she said no and has refused a paternity test.<p>Dawn<p>[ February 28, 2002: Message edited by: Dawn71 ]</p>

LOL! LOL! Sorry, but everyone here keeps telling me that there are two sides to every story so I have tried to staighten out my act and tried to be much more understanding about things that I do not even understand. How come that doesn't apply to everyone here. But this I can say from experience and this is a subject I definately understand. In an affair it is NEVER one person who decides what will happen. It does take TWO to tango. The H is just as capable of walking away before anything happens(as I was but did not) so please, the blame in an affair lies equally with the two who are having or have had one.<p>[ February 28, 2002: Message edited by: want it back ]</p>

Catnip =^^=<p>[ March 03, 2002: Message edited by: catnip ]</p>

I know I am going to get a lot of flak for this but I hope everyone will keep in mind that I am not condoning, merely trying to explain what I believe is at the root of the OP actions. I also am NOT making any blanket statements and I DO realize every situation is different but this was pretty much my situation and I'm sure it is not out of the ordinary. First of all I technically was not the OW since the man I was involved with was not married nor did he have children. He was in essence the OM. I feel I was close enough to the situation(obviously) to understand some of the things he went through. During our affair I told this man how unhappy I was with my marriage, my husband, my life. I told him that I no longer loved my husband nor did I want to be married to him. I'm sure it was not too hard for him to convince himself that it was not he who was ruining this marriage because it was for all intent purposes already dead. (Explaining, not condoning). As the affair went on I told him it was him that I loved and him that I wanted to be with, him that I wanted a life with. At the times I said these things I honestly thought I meant them. Then one day I wake up and see that everything is all wrong. No, this is not what I want. I do love my husband, I do want this marriage to work, I have been so stupid. So now I have to tell this man sorry, but I don't love you after all and I'm ending this, goodbye!! He is human so of course he is hurt and of course he does not understand and in essence I have done the same thing to him as I had done to my H. At this point I think it probably is reasonable to see some erratic behavior from him. Grasping at straws, hoping that I will change my mind and yes even being desperate enough to try and sabotage any reconciliation between my H and I. After all, I did tell him that I loved HIM.( not condoning, just understandable). What I don't think is understandable or acceptable is the prolnged actions of this type. Once it is made clear that it is over then the OP needs to move on as mine did. I realize this is more of a long term A type of thing obviously not a 1 night stand, but it seems that many of the affairs mentioned on here have been long term. Once again, not meant to condone anyones actions just trying to explain. But I've got my helmet on so send in the flak!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

Want it back....LMAO!!!!! I got your back girlfriend. So much here is hurt, sadness, anger...it's nice when something makes you chuckle.It makes me feel more normal<p>On the forgiveness topic of OW...I really don't like her, I dont want to forgive her..but I have to otherwise the anger and resentment I feel for her will remain all consumming. Doc says I need to direct my anger towards him...he's the one that betreyed me. And he's right, she made no promises to me.<p>Peace!<p> [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]<p>[ February 28, 2002: Message edited by: DocsGirl ]</p>

catnip and jenny,<p>hi back! things are going great with pregnancy, school and marriage. we just had our 6 year anniversary, time flies... hubby is getting more excited about the baby and being a daddy, and so am i. i am half way there, yeah!!<p>so this is what ya'll put up with now. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] miss the good old days. not when we all agreed, but when there weren't people here who obviously have nothing else in mind but stirring up trouble. they never contribute helpfully, just to try to start a fight. but how sad to have nothing else better to do in life than cause trouble and pain. i guess i should feel sorry for them.<p>anyway, hope all is well with you two. see you around later! [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]

<p>[ March 03, 2002: Message edited by: catnip ]</p>

Well, we must not forget that wayward spouses have also been known to LIE to get what they want, too.<p>They discuss their marital problems with OPs which is a huge mistake, and they lie...<p>If a wayward spouse is bent on being such, then they will move on to the next OP who agrees to give them whatever they need.<p>But since we are not discussing WS's here, let me just add that it wouldn't even matter if the OP apologized, if a BS is bent on being bitter regarding the irreparable damage OP has contributed toward BS's marriage, then no apology in the world will change the BS's feelings.<p>If OP apologizes, it won't change what damage has been done. If OP apologizes, it won't give back whatever the marriage had before the OP, not to mention the OC.<p>I don't believe an apology is ever really needed as long as forgiveness is there. Cuz then, at least you can move on with your life and recovery. This goes for anyone of us who has ever been deeply hurt or betrayed in any way.

Docsgirl, I'm so glad you LYAO!! It has been medically proven that laughing and even just smiling releases all kinds of good endorphins!! I hope you find time in your day everyday to allow yourself to feel good. I am however still dissappointed that it is apparent that some folks on here get away with certain things that other folks get pounded on for doing. Like making blanket statements. I was reprimanded more than once by many people for doing so and try very hard not to do it anymore.<p> catnip wrote
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>I am sure my thoughts ARE scary for all OW womankind <hr></blockquote>
Now that was a blanket statement and she didn't even mean it. I can tell by her posts to OB1 that she seems to have respect for her and I'm sure there are more OW out there who have the same class as OB1 has. My point being that it really is not fair that certain people don't have to abide by the so called rules of respect that were brought to my attention and that it breeds resentment. No wonder there is so much cat fighting going on here. If you notice in my last post I went through the extra pains to make sure I didn't step on anyones toes, at least I tried not to. I am not in the position to say whether the OP deserves anyones forgivness but I thought sharing my experience might give some insight to those who are wondering how the OP could do the things they've done. I, being one half of the affair, accept my complete half of the blame. I could very easily say that I was vulnerable and that he saw this and took advantage of it but that would be a lie and I don't lie anymore.<p>[ March 01, 2002: Message edited by: want it back ]</p>

Catnip =^^=<p>[ March 03, 2002: Message edited by: catnip ]</p>