my h was teaching our oldest daughter how to drive. my daughter got in trouble for something and her dad got on her case, in turn she back talked him. he refused to finish teaching her to drive until she apologize to him. I spoke with my D and she said why should she apologize to him when he hasn't apologize to her regarding the A. she also stated she hated the OW and at times want to go to her house and cause bodily harm. I told her i didn't know she was having these feeling and her and her dad needed to talk. when i told my H he became angry and said this is why he didn't want them to know and he will NEVER apologize to her because he has nothing to apologize to her for. I am sooooo angry right now that I could kill this man while he sleeps. adice please.<p>Ps lync i do not want to forgive OW--and i'm having a whole lot of trouble forgiving H. I just wanted to know why most can forgive h and not OP.

Sounds like it is time for a family meeting. At least sit down with your daughter and husband and try to come to an agreement together and try to resolve some of their resentment toward each other.<p>How you guys all work this out could affect your daughter's future relationships!!!

Hi Lemon..I can understand your aggrevation. What I've never understood though, is why adults TELL their children about these extremely PRIVATE issues? I never ONCE told my son anything about what his father did - it's not his business. It was OUR business as a couple. Unless the kids found out through the "grapevine" or witnessed the A firsthand, there is no reason on this earth that they should even know about it. As you can see, it's caused nothing but trouble and not one good thing has come of it...<p>While I certainly don't condone affairs, at the same time your husband shouldn't have to be defending himself to your daughter and apologizing for his behavior. He's right - the kids should NOT have known a thing about it - that's between you and he. What was the objective in telling the kids? To shame him? To punish him? To make him feel that he has to defend himself to everyone in the family? I just will never understand why kids have to brought into such intensely private situations. The only purpose this has served is to drive a wedge between the kids and dad and now the kids may have problems in future relationships because their outlook has now been somewhat skewed by this whole situation. Again I ask, what possible good can come from sharing such private information with them?<p>My ex-husband was a notorious cheater and that was my problem, not my son's. If I had told him what his father had done, he'd probably hate him right now and totally disrespect him. Well, he doesn't know a thing and they have a great relationship and I want it to stay that way - just because his dad wasn't a good husband doesn't mean my son can't have a good father. You have to look at the BIG picture and see how this is going to affect everyone in the long run. <p>I wish you luck and the best advice I can offer is NOT to include your children anymore in your private marital business - it is harmful, not helpful.

I respectfully, but strongly disagree with Hope. I think that family secrets are deadly, deadly toxic poison and I doubt that many of them are truly secret. My shrink said one time, "There is nothing wrong with sweeping things under the carpet. That is unless you want everyone in your family to stop tripping." I truly believe that on some level there is no such thing as a family secret.<p>I don't think that kids need all the gory details, but I think that they need age-appropriate information on important family issues--who is struggling with addiction, who committed suicide, who has mental illness issues, who has had an affair and what mom and dad are doing to get past it.<p>In a family with large issues such as these that are not open, any illusion of family happiness is, IMO, just that, an illusion. The definition of a dysfunctional family is a family that hides from, rather than deals with, their pain. From the outside, they often appear to be the most perfect families living an Ozzie and Harriet like existence that is not reality.<p>I think your daughter has full right to be pissed at her father. What he did was not only a betrayl of her mother, but a betrayl of his role as father. If he can find it in himself to admit his wrongdoing and face her anger, she will resolve it. Nothing takes away anger like a truly humble apology and what a good lesson to teach her--even good people do some awful things. The important thing in life is not to be perfect (no excuse for not trying your best though) and when you do screw up, to do your best to make ammends to those that you have hurt. If he has no humility about what he has done to his wife and his children, I would want to know why. <p>Why do I believe this? I grew up in a family full of huge secrets (many of them about me), I worked on the issue of family secrets in therapy for many years, and I truly believe what John Bradshaw had to say in his book on Family Secrets and toxic shame. Oh yes, the Harley do not believe that the POJA applies to parents and children, but strongly believe that keeping such things secret is damaging to the parent/child relationship in the long run.<p>MJ

Hope, I disagree with you regarding disclosure. I would never want my children to have such infornmation told to them by a stranger. I told my H had it just been an A i probably could have kept is a secret. But we are talking about another C here and although i don't like it, this OC needs her father as much as mine do. Also Hope, I AM NOT A LIAR. I could not look my children in the face knowing what I knew. And another thing, the A didn't just affect me, it affected my ENTIRE family. He did alot of things because the OW had a secret on him that could/have distroyed his family. I certainly didn't want her to have that power of me by threatenting to tell my children. My OW lives approx. 6 blocks from my home. It was imperative that I tell them before someone else did.<p>MaryJane, i totally agree with you, if my h had came forward early on (my H kept secret for 4 years)he wouldn't have the problems he has with our D. You are correct in how we work things out, because i found a letter she wrote to him and she said she understood people make mistakes and she truly hopes it was a mistake--now work on making mommy happy. the funny thing is she never gave it to her dad and i don't think is my place. I'm also sorry i told my H what my daughter said because he said this is the straw that broke......now his girls will hate him forever and we should begin to separate because he can't deal with this anymore. As always, just like the A...it comes back to me.

Dear lemon,
It sounds as though everyone in this situation is hurting terribly. If your h has to confront your d and apologize, that will mean confronting his own weaknesses and mistakes and admitting that he is human.
Is your family in counseling? Separately or together?
I agree that you needed to tell your children especially since they are older. They could be devastated if confronted outside of the home without prior knowledge.
How were they told? Was your h involved in the disclosure? I only ask because it seems as though he wants to avoid the whole issue.
I wish I had some advice for you, but all I can say is to keep the lines of communication open. If your d can't talk with her dad, she needs to talk with someone. You are the next best thing. But, please, be cautious what you say to her. If you and your h are trying to work things out, you need your d to know that the marriage comes first along with the family and there are no sides here.<p>Good luck!

tryinsainthood, it is unfortunate the way my D was told. I am ashamed about that. my h and i got into a hugh arguement and he left. i was drunk -- yes drunk i had been drinking alot since dday. i was crying uncontrollably and i called both of my girls together and told them why i had not been myself and i'm sorry they had to see me this way. i then called H and told him i told them. he came over (remember he left) and told them it was true, he made a mistake and he was taking care of the OC because it was the right thing to do and then he left to stay with his mother. no we are not in family counseling--my girls said "mom that's your thing". i am the only one who goes to counselling. i don't know whether it good to try to work things out because the house is full of tension and anger. i'm just totally lost and i don't know what to do or what i want to do. [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]