Let me say after reading the responses that I needed a little come uppance. My writings came across shallow when I wrote the blow job line. I shouldn't have done that. Yes I agree that sex is emotional and that is why I started with the point of affairs starting out with emotion. The point I was trying to make is men need affirmation as well, we are not robots so when we get a hot young thing pumping are shallow egos, we are SUCKERS. I WAS 100 PERCENT WRONG for what I did and make no excuse. What my wife did in my eyes and opinion was as I said, made time for everyone but me and the OW filled a void I hadn't felt in a LONG LONG time. The reason I say get past the pain and move forward is negative thinking does no good. The "get over it" is a common male mentality because we are fixers. I have learned to be careful with that. I am being much more blunt here than I would ever imagine with my wife, but I wish another party would convey this to her. Finally, YES, I have a personality flaw that I'm working on and with Gods grace and forgiveness my marriage will become stronger.
Somebody questioned visitation. OW is bitter and wife still not prepared for formal visitation. That is the PAIN I have to bear. As they say "I made the bed so lay in it". I'm not looking for sympathy. I simply tried to provoke thoughts because it seems this forum is full of bitter wives and your thoughts help me. I can say things to you, provoke response and learn how you think without stepping on these landmines with my wife. SORRY if I offended anyone.<p>
With all due respect I believe so many of you need to face reality and move past the pain. You have choices in life. You can dwell on your misfortunes or learn from them and become better people. I am 100 percent guilty of having an affair and unfortunately produced a child from said affair. My wife and I are working very hard to rebuild our relationship. It's very true that I made the wrong choice in life by breaking my vows of marriage. The funny part of my dilema is we feel that because of this we will be stronger. We always try to keep things in a positive light. That can be quite difficult at times but there is always something there. Ladies, there are a variety of reasons that men cheat but the bottom line is we have needs as well and it usually ends up in a sexual affair but it almost always starts EMOTIONALLY. My wifes attention were every place but with me. Sex was a chore as she had no interest and she was quite the prude even when things were going well. Pretty much missionary and no oral sex. Listen, if you don't want your man to cheat. Perform oral sex often. I guarentee it. My girlfriend and I had sex like animals. We were completely uninhibited. Any position, oral, toys, public places and so on. I thought the passion we had can never be matched by my wife. Until we talked openly, obviously not details, but simply to let go and enjoy each other. Your husbands will never admit it but sex with the other woman will always be better until you let go of the past and try different things and stop dwelling in the past. For my part I have learned to listen and look into my wifes eyes. I no longer try to fix but simply stand by her side and support her. I made the worst mistake one can make in marriage but please know that us men don't get there alone. Take your responsibility and fix yourselves and the rest will take care of itself.<p>Baby is 2 years and announced to my wife a year ago. Limited time in his life. OW very bitter that I'm still married. Oh well !!!<p>[ May 15, 2002: Message edited by: husbandsside ]<p>[ May 15, 2002: Message edited by: husbandsside ]</p>

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by husbandsside:
<strong>With all due respect I believe so many of you need to face reality and move past the pain. You have choices in life. You can dwell on your misfortunes or learn from them and become better people. I am 100 percent guilty of having an affair and unfortunately produced a child from said affair. My wife and I are working very hard to rebuild our relationship. It's very true that I made the wrong choice in life by breaking my vows of marriage. The funny part of my dilema is we feel that because of this we will be stronger. We always try to keep things in a positive light. That can be quite difficult at times but there is always something there. Ladies, there are a variety of reasons that men cheat but the bottom line is we have needs as well and it usually ends up in a sexual affair but it almost always starts EMOTIONALLY. My wifes attention were every place but with me. Sex was a chore as she had no interest and she was quite the prude even when things were going well. Pretty much missionary and no oral sex. Listen, if you don't want your man to cheat. Perform oral sex often. I guarentee it. My girlfriend and I had sex like animals. We were completely uninhibited. Any position, oral, toys, public places and so on. I thought the passion we had can never be matched by my wife. Until we talked openly, obviously not details, but simply to let go and enjoy each other. Your husbands will never admit it but sex with the other woman will always be better until you let go of the past and try different things and stop dwelling in the past. For my part I have learned to listen and look into my wifes eyes. I no longer try to fix but simply stand by her side and support her. I made the worst mistake one can make in marriage but please know that us men don't get there alone. Take your responsibility and fix yourselves and the rest will take care of itself.<p>Baby is 2 years and announced to my wife a year ago. Limited time in his life. OW very bitter that I'm still married. Oh well !!!</strong><hr></blockquote><p>Husbandside:<p>Thanks for the intersting and refreshing view. These are sensitive matters no matter if one is the WS, BS, OM/OW. I always like to hear from the WS from time to time, it lends a different perspective around here. <p>Best of luck on your path to happiness.

HS,<p>Thanks for your point of view. My H and I have/had sex 3 to 4 times a week during (unbeknownst to me) and after the affair. There were certain things that I wouldn't do. He was and is now again my best friend we talked through out the entire affair. He told me exOW was an easy piece of A-- without any headaches. I filed for a D and was ready to served his butt within three days of finding out about everything. The only way I would give him a second chance was to work on the friendship because at that point I didn't want him in my life. I blamed him completely not exOW until she turned psycho and attacked me. I just wanted you to know that there are woman who concentrate on themselves. And if their marriage is to be they use this as a learning experience. I have and my marriage is better. But just because I wouldn't do certain things sexually is not a reason to cheat. I wasn't a prude but I also wasn't a freak and my H admits no man wants a hoe for a house wife. Men cheat with woman that will allow them to do anything to them but they won't marry them. I can assure you 50 to 60% of the woman on this board have and always had great sex lives. People cheat for various reasons. In my H case she catered to him. He could spit in her face she would smile and say thank you do you want something to drink or eat. <p>I made twice as much money as he did and I made him feel like I didn't need him he thought a man was supposed to be catered too. Since I married young I admit that I did feel this way. I was never going to rely on a man. But being young I enjoyed sex and I have never said no to my H. You can say sex was the reason why you cheated but you can't say all men will cheat if you don't give them a blow job or let them do ****. (I'm sorry to be so graphic but that's crap.) I'm not attacking you only letting you know most women here have a life outside of their H's and we take pride in who we are and we do our best to keep our mates satisfied. If my H got into an accident and it ended our sex life I guess it's O.K. for me to have an affair? No, I'm suppose to stick by his side. <p>I'm sorry I'm rambling but it pisses me off that men think we should kiss their behinds and do any and everything for them or that gives them the right to cheat. I can guarantee you while you were out cheating there was someone or ones who were looking at your wife and hitting on her. That's exactly what happened to my H, his so call friends were the first ones that tried to hit on me and tell me he didn't deserve a woman like me. <p>Especially after D-day. I told my H since you weren't taking care of home your friends thought I was fair game. If I had been weak minded and fell for their games we both could have had ex's or OC's. The same thing that attracts you to your wife is attractive to other men too no matter what her shape or size is. Remember that and work on you. And all things will be O.K.<p>Be glad that you like my H, realized you would have lost the best thing that happened to you. (Your wife) I'm glad you realized your mistake and you're putting your marriage first. <p>
Unsure<p>PS-If I came off as a man hater I'm not, I'm actually in love with my H and we learned a lot from OUR mistakes good luck with your marriage.<p>[ May 15, 2002: Message edited by: UNSure919400 ]</p>

Husbandsside<p>Another man&#8217;s viewpoint<p>I probably shouldn&#8217;t comment because I am not familiar with your total situation and there are others who are much more knowledgeable and eloquent than I am, but this raised my hackles and I cannot let this go.
I would hope that the sexual scenarios that you mentioned are a very minor reason for remaining in your marriage. I am not a prude by any means but to base a marriage on oral sex is ridiculous. What about other variations? Where do you draw the line? If you fanaticized about menage a trois (sp.?) and your wife refused would this give you the right to have an affair? I think not! The sex was not the problem, you were. It sounds to me like you are still in the "get over it" phase so many WS's remain in for so long. I feel that there is still much ground you have to cover with your W.
I get the feeling that you may not have come to terms with the real reason that you felt you needed someone outside of your marriage. The sexual deviation was just a convenient excuse and your wife deserves better than that. It wasn&#8217;t her fault! Oral sex has not kept me in my marriage and I don&#8217;t feel that I am alone. <p>
I am glad that you have chosen to remain with your W and wish you continued success.<p>God Bless<p>ULA

HUSBANDSSIDE,
Take your responsibility and fix yourselves and the rest will take care of itself.<p>I am sorry, we all have things we need to do different or fix, But frankly to base your entire marriage on the fact that she wouldnt give you oral, repulses me. And I am not a prude. But you did not cheat on your wife just for the simple reason she did not perform the way you wanted her.
I can rememebr doing all those things for my husband, perfect little wife, and you know what.. he and his alcohol and women were more important than his wife and his family..
Untill he was able to fix those issues we couldnt make a marriage, unfortunately those issues just as you think.. eventually led me to someone else, so I would be careful to base your whole marriage on something so trivial

Warning, the following is very graphic. Don't read further if you are offended by such things.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by husbandsside:
<strong>Your husbands will never admit it but sex with the other woman will always be better until you let go of the past and try different things and stop dwelling in the past. </strong><hr></blockquote><p>Wow! you must be really bad at sex to leave your wife so cold. Hmmmmmm? Don't like it when I make assumptions about your sex life or abilities to perform? Then don't make assumptions about mine. Don't apply the problems in your marriage to mine and I won't apply mine to yours. OK?<p>Sex wasn't our issue. I give BJs that would make your head spin and I do it frequently and with great relish. Outside: in the woods, on our boat, in the car, in every conceivable place that did not put us at high risk of immediate arrest. Anything that two legally-of-age and consenting adults can do was available as long as both of us were in agreement. I have a strong sex drive and I consider it a great gift from God to bring to a marriage.<p>He was on a massive ego trip. He started making enough money to make anyone's head spin, driving a Porsche, taking incredible trips. Everything in the world told him that he was a huge success and deserved anything he coveted. He became corrputed. Threw away his morals with both hands, and that is not just a reflection of his affair but how he conducted his life and what he thought was important. He lost his reverence for God, family and things that last and replaced them with shallow self-worship and gratification. <p>Some young girl started feeding that already massive ego and voila! an affair. It turned out that she was unstable and didn't actually want just the good time with a wealthy man that she said claimed was her only goal. She couldn't live without him; he was her whole world; what would she do without him? (This was not her first affair with a married man. It seems to be a pattern for her. When she was 18, she played her own part in the destruction of her parents' friends' marriage. He was 43 years old! She filed his divorce papers for him because, her words, "He didn't have to b*lls to do it himself." Can you imagine an 18-year-old girl running a 43-year-old man's life. What a pitiful, pitiful scene.) <p>My H got sucked in, felt responsible and guilty. He also had feelings of love for her. I am not surprised that his feelings followed where his genitals led. After all, that is how we fell in love.<p>H has said that is wasn't about the sex. Who knows, he could be lying. Apparently you know him better than I do. He has told me I am far more sexually giving, easily brought to pleasure, adventerous, spontaneous. She had difficulty reaching orgasm and he felt frustrated in their sexual relationship. Oh and BTW, she hated giving oral sex.<p>I was his only lover before her. Maybe he needed to know that sex didn't get any better than what we had. I, on the other hand, had not applied my Christian values to my pre-marriage sex life and had quite a bit of experience. I knew that the sexual compability that we had was quite unusual. We used to set aside weekends for sex marathons. Every 6 months we tried to break our own record of intercourse (with climax for both) of 8 times in 24 hours. We achieved 8 times over and over again but it appears that that was his limit. I wanted more, but he was unable to comply. Hmmmm....maybe I should have gotten some on the side. Doesn't seem like he was sex starved to me.<p>I will assume my part in the breakdown of the marriage. I was gaining weight. I am now very overweight but I was not when his affair began 9 years ago. Then I had 30 pounds to lose. Certainly enough to make me less attractive to him but not an insurmountable problem especially given that he wanted a food partner and a slim wife and he sabatoged any weight loss efforts on my part by complaining that I no longer wanted to go out and eat as often or that my cooking had changed. <p>He withdrew from our marriage, filled his life with his affair, his cars, money, $300 ties and $3,000 suits, his nights in the bars, his sports, his golf and his pursuit of money, money, money, success and power. I took to filling my life with too much food and too little exercise. Boy if he had one unmet need, I had three or four of my top five and I had to deal with a husband who was not practicing any self-control over his angry outburst and seemed to enjoy engaging in temper tantrums. I had at least as many reasons to engage in an affair and despite my weight issue, I had the opportunity with one man I found myself very attracted to. <p>I am working diligently on my weight (almost 45 pounds lost) and he is working on getting his priorities straight and repairing his marriage and his relationships with his family. <p>He is now fat and is now earning 1/2 what I do and about 1/4 of what he used to. Not meeting my need for Financial Support, but I am willing to put up with it for a while longer as we continue to focus on us and our new children. So, some of my needs aren't being met still. Do I have a right to an affair?<p>Your excuse sickened me. You may be mouthing the right words about your responsibility for your affair, but you still appear to be trying to worm your way out of that full blame. "Affairs don't happen because your spouse is not meeting your needs; they happen because you fail to protect yourself from your own weaknesses." Steve Harley<p>Also to paraphrase Steve Harley again: An affair is usually the action of the most selfish spouse who is giving the least to the marriage.<p>I hope you do rebuild your marriage and I hope you have a happy life with your wife and that all of your needs (and hers) are met. Please come back and post often but don't project your own issues onto me and my marriage which you know nothing about.<p>[ May 15, 2002: Message edited by: MaryJanes ]</p>

Sounds like you still have this fantasy that what you did was justified, and you still aren't willing to take responsiblity for your own choice.<p>I guess the next time your wife is tired and won't do what you want, you'll think it's ok to cheat. <p>With your attitude you are lucky you still have a marriage, and if your wife read what you wrote you probably wouldn't. I feel very sorry for you wife. <p>You are the example of the of a typical cheater blaming everything on everybody except where it really goes on your own selfcenteredness. <p>No one caused you to break your marriage vows, disrespect your marraige, and become dishonest and throw away your integrity except that you chose to do it.

Most of the men who cheat, I believe, are not real men. They are just mindless children with an itch.<p>My Grandfather who died a couple years ago at 92 used to lament the decline of the integrity and essence of the REAL masculine male...a man who was strong and proud and protective of his wife, family, Church and community, who believed in and worshiped God, who took pride in who he was, who mocked and felt disgust at the smarmy, weasel-y cheaters...no one respected these loosers.<p>My husband cheated for a number of reasons and none of them had anything to do with me...but it said a lot about him and his immaturity, self absorption, childishness, his alcoholism, his bipolar disorder and a bunch of other things. While he was playing with OW, he blamed me and actually made up a bunch of stuff about me to justify his actions, which I believe is what most cheating men do...blame the wife.<p>Not only was sex frequent, it was sensuous, passionate, sexy, loving, soul connecting and exciting. He told me so over and over and marveled about it ...so imagine my shock at his sudden rejection of me for someone else.<p>I read your post and thought "This guy has no remorse."<p>Your girlfriend might have performed for you like a circus clown because she had no self respect or she was desperate to have a guy, any guy, and settled for you because of her low self worth...or maybe she got off on successfully pulling a married guy away from his wife for a temporary false feeling of superiority. Meanwhile, your wife is having thoughts, like most of us, of having our own affair because the husband has made us feel so worthless and made our marraige feel so undervalued, why bother? What's the harm? It's already tainted and destroyed...all bets are off.<p>I would worry, with your current attitude, of what is really going on in your wife's head. Just like you say the sex is always going to be better with the OW if the wife refuses to engage in your sex fantasies (since this is the be all and end all for you...the lame reason why you cheated) trust me when I tell you she will never love you or trust you like she once did. The damage you did has cooled her off to you considerably. She might just be staying with you through force of habit, the history you share, the children you have together, the families you have in common, but the trust and love she once felt will forever be tainted and not valued as it once was because of your betrayal and gross violation of your marriage vows to her and before God. It will stay that way until you have true remorse, profound regret, work diligently on your marriage and focus, focus and focus on her and the marriage and make it about her and not all about you. If and when you are successful at making her feel as though she is the only woman on the planet and once you have completely purged any thoughts of the OW from your mind, and once you become ill at the remotest thought of the other woman, do not expect your wife to feel that deep devotion for you she once had, and expect her to be even more vulnerable to an afffair than ever before.<p>It is all up to you how the rest of your life unfolds...it is up to you to make reparations. And for God's sake, don't ever tell her how hot you thought sex was with the OW or you will surely seal your fate....you will ruin what could be an exciting and satisfying sex life with your wife and she will hate you, resent you and probably eventually leave you for some guy who thinks she is the hottest, sexiest thing he has ever seen.

Well, you have heard from the other side as I was sure you would. It took guts to say what you were thinking and you aren't wrong for making us go here.
Catnip sure has a way with words and her perspective from the BS side of thing couldn't have been said any better. I don't know about you man, but as a fws I needed to hear that. I could blame by H for our routine sex life and in my own head I've thought if only my H could do what OM can.. I have come to believe that although sex is physical, a good deal of it is emotional. When we are all wrapped up in the OP emotionally, even so-so sex is awesome. It sounds like you very much emotionally cut off from your wife and I'm sure that played a part in your great sex with OP. They say sex happens in the brain. I used to think that was nuts but not so much now.<p>You have done the right thing to tell you wife what you want and need, giving her a chance to meet your sexual needs. But you need to reconnect emotionally to ever reach the passionate level that I know you had with OP.

hmmmmmm??<p>You betrayed your honor and integrity for a BJ? Wondering ... about this philosophy ....A man is as good as his word .... and...A wife is as good as her BJs?<p>How utterly sad [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img] <p>I hope you have "fixed yourself" and made more honorable priorities important to you.<p>Good luck ... keep yourself honest and true.<p>Pepper [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img]

Let me just say...AMEN!!! Thanks to all of you for sticking up for the BS. I won't even get into my own thoughts about all of this, but I will say that the damage the WS does to the BS is enough to last a lifetime and the last thing that we need to hear is that we are not taking our own responsibility for the reason for the affair. Take a look in the mirror for once!!!! [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img]

Maybe I am missing something - but I re-read husbandside's post and I don't see why everyone is getting so upset.<p>Bottom line - those are his opinions and he is entitled to them. There must be some grain of truth in his post to warrant the "pushing of so many buttons".<p>We don't have many husband opinions here. I wonder - is that because we have treated the other men who were brave enough to post here like that?<p>In any event, Husbandside, I would like to know how you feel about the OC, OW and visitation. I think that would help me and my H a lot.

I agree completely pfp. When us WS say something that others do not like or understand this is the reaction. I admire him for his guts and his honestly. The truth is that we have affairs for reasons. They may be selfish. They may be wrong. But we generally have them because of ourselves not our spouses. If someone asked my H about our sex life, I'm sure he'd say it was great too. Its all perception and if you don't know your spouse is in some deep fog or trance, your perception is not the same as the waywards perception of the relationship. We all have needs, sex is one of them. Good, passionate, toe curling sex. But there are a bunch more and husbandside did say A's generally start out filling emotional voids. I concur with him, that is how my A started.
When it became sexual, look out because it was better than just good. In part because we were good together, but more so because of the emotional energy which was off the charts.
It would help alot of bs if they listeined alittle bit more to us WS. We aren't all freaking wacko's.

This is one thread that I've had to read and reread , and each time I have a different take on it. Husbandside for the most part has made some very strong and valid points, but I FEEL ( my opinion) that he's cheapened his case by stating if we want to keep our men by giving them blow jobs often? If that's the basis for Doc remaining commited to me...the OW is more than welcome to him.<p>
<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by husbandsside:
<strong> Your husbands will never admit it but sex with the other woman will always be better until you let go of the past and try different things and stop dwelling in the past.</strong><hr></blockquote><p>What is so better about a cheap half hour sexual encounter during a lunchbreak that leaves you guilt stricken and causes you to lose your sobriety?

OK---as a man, I'll make a couple comments.<p>What I see from husbandsside is a pretty self-absorbed wayward spouse who hasn't really come to grips with marital recovery yet. He's blaming someone else (his wife) for the problems. There is a "grain of truth" in there---usually (but not always) an affair can stem from the poor state of the marriage, which is usually both parties fault. So from that standpoint (and MB counseling techniques), one of the first things a betrayed spouse is asked to do is to "fix the behaviors" in a Plan A.<p>But for the most part, I see very little to admire here. It seems to be a run-by posting, driven to stir up emotions. There's hardly any worthwhile advice here. It's certainly not presented in an "MB" way.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>The truth is that we have affairs for reasons.<hr></blockquote><p>Yup. But I've never actually heard a good reason for an affair[/b]<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>They may be selfish.<hr></blockquote><p>NO. They ARE SELFISH. I like the way Dr. Harley phrases it best---they are the most cruel, self-indulgent act that you can commit in a marriage.<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>They may be wrong.<hr></blockquote><p>They ARE WRONG. When on earth has an affair been "right", from a moral, ethical sense?<p> <blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>But we generally have them because of ourselves not our spouses.<hr></blockquote><p>I think that this is fundamentally true, but there's no doubt that unhappiness in a marriage (even if you're not getting your daily requirement of BJ's) can "lead" to an affair. But there's still no excuse for having one.<p>My wife cheated on me. Because she was unhappy. Lonely. She had lost her job and became a SAHM with very little outlets for admiration and appreciation. There was no doubt that although I was a very "dedicated" husband, I was off the mark in meeting her EN's. And lovebusting. But she did choose to have an affair. She did end up pregnant.<p>You know what---we've recovered for the most part. I'm a much better (not perfect) husband to her, and she does have "loving" feelings towards me. But she damaged herself so deeply through her affair that she hasn't fully recovered yet. I look at poor neglected husbandsside---he wasn't getting all the sex he needed. Poor guy---no wonder he had to cheat.<p>I haven't had sex with my wife for over 5 years. None, not even a little BJ. I could whine about this and find some poor woman to listen to me. She'd think I'm such a great guy for being so dedicated---and you know where that leads to.<p>The bottom line is that YOU are responsible for having an affair. YOU are responsible for protecting yourself from an affair---especially if you are vulnerable to one. There are rules, behaviors and guidelines to follow. For example:<p>1. I have no close female friends, even though I work with several women.<p>2. I never discuss marital problems with members of the opposite sex.<p>3. I'm completely open and honest to my wife, as well as being accountable for my time.<p>4. I'm continually working on our marriage. I want to be in the "romantic love" area---which for me will mean that we do have sex. I'm not there yet. But that doesn't relieve me of the responsibility for creating an environment in the marriage in which this can fluorish. My wife does have problems that she needs to work on---but that doesn't relieve me from the responsibility of removing any other roadblocks.<p>There---that's another opinion from the male side.

k
you and i have not agreed on a lot of things, but i would like to say this is the first time I have heard a mans take on things where he truly understood all points of the marriage and its breakdown.
I worked in a male domminated work place and have heard many points of view, but yours truly hit the nail on the head.
thanks

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>this is the first time I have heard a mans take on things where he truly understood all points of the marriage and its breakdown<hr></blockquote><p>Yeah, but it sucks to have to learn it by first hand experience. The main reason that I participate on this board is to help others before they get to this point---or to guide them to professionals like Steve and Jenn if their situation is too complicated to be able to solve by DIY work and our group of enthusiastic MB'ers here.

I agree and wish none of us were here, but you just told all the men reading some well needed advice and you will help others while you have learned to help your self. <p> Sometimes we have trouble understanding those things from our spouse

Once again I find myself shaking my head at myself at the thought that I am actually going to respond to a post such as this. BUT.... here goes......<p>I am a BS and I am a FWS w/an OC. So lets take a brief look at both of these scenarios that have taken place in my life, as an example. <p>My H was in the military. He was gone over seas when I had a miscarriage. He was devastated when we lost our baby just as I was. A few days after he found out about the miscarriage, he had a one night stand. Yeah, there was some sexual need there, seeing how he had been over seas for a month and half already, even though he would be coming back home in just 3 weeks. Ask my husband why he had his one night stand and he will tell you, he needed someone to talk to, and couldnt talk to me since I wasnt there, and he needed to be held and shown affection, which he couldnt because we were thousands of miles apart, so he turned to someone who filled those needs for that night, for that moment. I needed to be held and to have someone to talk to, I was going through the same things he was, but I didnt turn to someone else for the temporary momentary comfort either. Was this the right thing to do? NO. Does he own it though? Yes he does... he sees his own mistakes.<p>Years and years later in our marriage, my EN were not being met in any way shape or form and he didnt seem to care that they werent. The sex life was great, always has been. But emotionally, I was living in a huge void of nothing. I end up starting a new job, working side by side with a man that I get along with like I've known him all my life. I gripe about my unfullfilled marriage to him, he gripes about his unfullfilled marriage to me. Then one day he kisses me. We both agree, that cant ever happen again. But it does. And more then that transpires. Now I have a full on affair going on. We tried to end it 3 times but it wasnt ending. The last time I ended it, I told him my fears were that I would end up pregnant or something, and there is no explaining that one away. So I did good, and we were not together anymore. Then I found out I was pregnant anyway. My husband is her daddy no matter what.I do not get CS from OM and he has seen her one time only ever in her life and there is no contact whatsoever now. Was what I did right? NO. But do I OWN it? You better believe I do!<p>Now look at those situations... why did I end up in the affair I was in? Because he met me EMOTIONAL needs that my husband at the time did not care to meet even though he knew he was not meeting them and the OM stopped the pain I was in, even if only temporarily. Why did my H have the one night stand he had? Because he needed that EMOTIONAL comfort at a time of great pain for him. Yes in both instances, the EN crossed over in to SF, but it was the EMOTIONAL side of the SF in each case... it was the continuation of the EMOTIONAL need that each of us had.<p>Our sex life has always been more then awesome. H*ll, there was even a point, one of the worst points in our relationship when I told him that we didnt have anything else in common but the sex. <p>Do you see what I am getting at here?? "Give your man bj's and you'll keep him happy and by your side"... something to that effect... What you said just basically kind of blew me away. <p>Seeing how our sex life has ALWAYS been awesome, with plenty of everything that each of us desires, then please do explain to me Husbandside how each of us ended up having an affair, based upon YOUR way of thinking. <p>Ask my husband and he will flat out tell you, I'm about as kinky as they get. So is he. So hince, a perfect union in bed. We have tried and done just about everything there is to do. Yet each of us still had an affair, due to emotional needs, not SF needs. We both failed to give emotional needs and we both failed to takes the steps needed to GET our emotional needs met. Thats the bottom line. <p>The whole concept of the "June Cleaver by day, a nymph by night" thing is about as arcahic as it gets in my opinion. And to state, just give him a BJ and you'll keep him happy, seems to me to be an easy scape goat for you to place your blame. <p>There comes a time when we all have to OWN what we do in our lives, be it good or bad. You didnt have an affair because your wife didnt care to give you BJ's.. you did it for your own selfish wants. <p>You are on the right track, so I really dont want to deter you from that, but let my final words to be this:<p>"Look a little deeper, and stop placing the blame on your wife for YOUR actions. You will never really go forward with anything until you OWN and face up to what YOU yourself have done."<p>Best of luck to you and your wife..........<p>[ May 20, 2002: Message edited by: AnnLovesCharlie ]</p>

<blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by prayingforpeace:
[QB]Maybe I am missing something - but I re-read husbandside's post and I don't see why everyone is getting so upset.<p>Bottom line - those are his opinions and he is entitled to them. There must be some grain of truth in his post to warrant the "pushing of so many buttons".<p>We don't have many husband opinions here. I wonder - is that because we have treated the other men who were brave enough to post here like that?<p>QB]<hr></blockquote><p>I think if anyone is upset it is because if they have been betrayed, they don't like having a Wayward put the blame on his Betrayed...it just pisses us off. Especially for something that seems to be so without substance. The misguided need to be guided.<p>Of course, he is entitled to his opinion. And he posted them. But, it is a contoversial subject and reactions should be expected...anyone thinking a reaction is not worthy of his comments is naive. <p>And he did push buttons, which is OK...it is OK to push buttons here...a lot of good healthy debate and clarity and understanding comes from button pushing. Button pushing is not a bad thing. Why does everyone get so upset when they say something controversial and they get a reaction I feel they should expect? My buttons get pushed constantly but this is a way for me to reevaluate my thinking or make a stand on my opinion.<p>If Waywards don't post their thoughts and feelings here because they are afraid of getting a negative response, then they are just being chicken [censored]. Big deal. The anononymity of this site protects everyone from knowing anyone's true identity anyway, so what is there to loose? What's there to be afraid of? <p>Anyone should be able to say anything they choose, as long as they stay relatively respectful and adhere to the policies of this site...even husbandsside! Especially for husbandsside. His points and opinions are indeed valid and his right to post them are absolutely OK...but it is also our right and our duty to point out how we feel and what we think in response and if anyone gets scared away because of that, then they are candy a$$ lightweights.<p>hahaha<p>Just my not so humble opinion. so there.