I have no idea what has happened here today, or what caused it, but Babstr's thread went WAY off topic, and it just went to the crapper from there! Just because things have been quite calm doesn't mean that we need to start the same old arguments! If you could go back to the beginning, I could almost guarantee that the arguments were the same, by the same people! <p>We've all, myself included, taken the bait, whether intentionally put out there for the taking or not, and now let's just stop this and get back to helping, not hurting! Everyone here knows who's to blame in the messes we find ourselves in, so we don't need others constantly reminding those who are venting! Take on the age old saying, "If you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all" when we are addressing eachother! <p>Use this place for what it is here for, a place to get help, support, a shoulder to cry on, vent, share our experiences.......Not as a place to attack those who've been in this mess for years, or those new to our site! I hate to see the anger towards eachother when there is so much more we could do for each other. Think before you speak/type of how you would feel if someone were saying this to you!<p>And one more thing, no matter what side of this story you are on, there will always be someone looking from the other side, and may have some annimosity for those in your particular position. Don't take what they say as attacking you, unless they direct it straight at you! That's where all this garbage started today! <p>I don't believe that anyone here is pointing fingers at anyone, and if you are, just remember that when you point a finger at someone, there are at least 3 more pointed back at yourself! Kinda goes along with the verse about being worried about the speck of dust in someone else's eye when you have a 2 x 4 in your own! No one is perfect, and never will be, on this earth!<p>Ok, I am stepping off my soap box now. <p>Tigger

tigger,<p>I feel bad that I even posted. I haven't come very often to the site because of this. I truly never thought it would get off on a tangent. I did feel like I was trying over and over to say that I wasn't blaming anyone. Just that it hurt to have the child support agency start a review out of the blue, and what I was going to do. <p>babstr.

Babs,<p>Hey, it's not your fault! You were asking an honest question. I only wish that I'd had some advice for you. I hope that you did receive some through all the garbage. Keep yourself and the soon to be new baby happy and calm as much as you can!<p>Love,<p>Tigger

Babstr<p>Don't you dare stop posting and don't you dare feel guilty for the "lively debate"!<p>Stuff like this is bound to happen occasionally, mostly coming from new people who either aren't working the Harley principles or don't accept or understand them yet, or renegade OW's looking to pick a fight or make trouble or sometimes just misguided members looking for justification...and then there are those of us, like me, who can't let remarks go unchallenged.<p>Tigger<p>I agree that sometimes and often these threads become upsetting and unproductive, but it is unrealistic to think it isn't going to happen again. I guess the best thing for all of us to do is to say our piece and not let the [censored] get you down. When you get a room full of people, you're going to get a lot of differing opinions...it's OK, really.<p>I think things will settle down now for a while, but you can bet your last bag of cat litter it is going to happen again, probably soon. Gird your loins for battle, tape your paws for the mit and be prepared for anything.

Alright.... I agree... time for a time out! Now everyone gather around together... time for one great big huge ((((((((((((GROUP HUG))))))))))))))) [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]