Well, I'm sure this caught a few eyes. Let me first say that I am not going back to xOM. He does not want me anymore at this point in his life anyway.

I can honestly say that I have tried my best. I have taken the advice I have gotten from this forum and tried to implement it into the rebuilding of my marriage. Sometimes it made things good for a while but it never lasted too long. My H has no interest in the MB principals or any of the books that I have bought. Even though I have asked him repeatedly if he would like to talk about anything, anything at all, that I would answer all his questions, he still doesn't want to talk. He agrees that things are not good and that we need to do something. Seperation is about the only thing we haven't tried so this is our last shot.

It all came to a head about 3 weeks ago. We had just gotten back from a week long vacation with my sister and her family. We got back late on a Saturday. On Sunday I had all the unpacking to do and about 5 loads of laundry to do. I had to go grocery shopping since there was nothing in the house. H fixed a leak under the kitchen sink (45 minutes) then sat in front of a baseball game for 3 hrs and then took a 2 hr nap. As I was running around trying to get things done he could see that I was growing increasingly upset. He said to me "I hope you're not going to try and get this all done in one day". Well he didn't have to worry about that because I had to put all of it on hold to mow the lawn when xOM came to pick up D for a visit. It took me about 3 days to get all caught up. I have come right out and admitted to him that yes, I know I do not appreciate the things that he does do because I am too busy being upset about the things that he doesn't do. He however will not admit that he doesn't appreciate me or that he takes me for granted. This is what led me to my decision to move out. I am hoping that being apart for a while may make us both learn to appreciate each other again. I am however going into this with no expectations at all. I don't know what this will bring for me.
I have an apartment and will be moving in a few weeks. H and I have actually been getting along much better since this decision. I think we both know that this may be our last hope. He will help me move and get settled in. Then we will see what happens.

<small>[ July 23, 2002, 07:56 AM: Message edited by: want it back ]</small>

want it back

I think you would be amazed how much he sees when you are no longer there.. Men are funny that way.. they dont think they have to do anything till they see you are moving on and all of a sudden a light comes on..
You never know it may make things better for you and Husband .. You may both find you need each other and if you dont.. you know you tried. Just do what is best for your kids.
And of course for you.

I do understand your frustrations at having to do every thing under the sun, My husband and I have had that convo for 18 years.. and the man still does not get it.. till he sees me frustrated, then he jumps up and say.. oh let me help honey... lol Mind you that comes close to the end of what I am doing.

Good luck in your apt. and know that there will be some bad days as well as good days, just hang in there. Your kids will have an adjustment to make and that wont be easy for them..so remember to be patient.

WIB,

I had mixed feelings reading your post. I want to say that it takes alot of courage to do what you have decided and not stay in a relatinship that is making you so unhappy. You have my admiration for standing up and changing what isn't working. On the other hand, I am sorry that it isn't working out with your H. It takes 2 people to make a relationship work, maybe the seperation will act as a wake up call.
I understand completely how you feel about being taken for granted. We all do it it seems at one time or another and when we risk loosing the people we love, we realize nothing worth having is worth loosing to complacency. Hopefully your H will see it once you are no longer there to take care of all the things you normally do.
My H takes care of the lawn, takes out garbage, keeps the garage organized, and does some of the errands. He would do anything not to have to clean a toilet,empty the dishwasher, or heaven forbid, cook a meal. I used to get annoyed butI have come to realize after alot of arguments, that it can work this way. But it has to be give and take on both our parts. Our return from vacation was alot like yours, I did all the packing and all the unpacking. Many years ago, you know what I did? I bought my H a big, fancy clothes hamper all his own. I wash his clothes sometimes but it's not my job anymore. He ran out of underwear and asked me about it. I directed him to his overloaded hamper and ever since, he took it upon himself to inventory his own undergarmets and wash when needed. It was like training an old dog a new trick. It took some time but he finally accepted it and is now great at doing the laundry. He looks for things to wash if you can belive it. He is in all our hampers now. (there is hope)
I don't mean to say that all of the problems you are having with H are related to domestic chores, but I do know that affair or not, the tasks of daily living can take over your life and wreck havoc on your M. A big problem for us is communication too, my H doesn't want to talk about anything unpleasant, avoids emotions like the plaque, and will not confront feelings, his or mine. It makes it hard to fix what's broken if you don't acknowledge it.

I hope that your life and marraige work out the way that you want them to. Good luck in your apt. and do the best you can for your kids and yourself. Momof5 is right, if the M can't be saved, at least you know you tried.

WIB

Sometimes stepping back from the situation allows all parties involved to re examine what it is we truly want. I hope you find the answers you're looking for. Your a strong woman and however this turns out you'll be ok....

Hugs and best wishes

docs girl
I hope the move went well.

WIB

Every one is right, sometimes when you seperate, every one involved becomes nicer, because they are scared of what they might lose.. I know my hubby did, we were apart two years, so never say never, just concentrate on making your self and the children hapy and maybe you and husband will be able to think about what you want.

WIB,

I am sorry that you have had to take it to this next level, but if only one person is embracing the principles of this site, it often happens. From what I do remember of your relationship w/your H, he has been more interested in the TV and sports than with spending time with you or helping out around the house, right? As Mo5 and CM have said, this may be his wake up call! He may realize that all of a sudden, the house is awfully empty, and messy, if he doesn't do any of the cleaning that you are always doing!

One question, are you going about this as Plan B? Or are you just going to play it by ear? You may want to have some sort of plan/time limit as to what and how long you are going to do this. Otherwise, things will never be resolved, either way, you'll just sit there in limbo.

I wish you the best of luck, and hope that you do post again!

Love,

Tigger

Haha. It struck me funny that Cmiranda's husband has become obsessive complusive about hampers...everyone's. So, one can bring a horse to water...and he will drink sometimes.

When I read your post it made me feel so sad that you had worked so hard on the marriage and were met with luke warm responses from your hsuband as far as the MB books, principles, et al. But, at the same time I knew you had done everything you knew how to save the marriage and you did it well. The most telling thing was where you said that you were too aggravated about what he wasn't doing to appreciate what he was doing.

Marriage is such hard work and compromising with people who have different priorities than we do is tough under the best of circumstances. Bipolar's indifference to a messy room is something I have had to learn to live with along with his lack of urgency to finish some projects. Some of his habits are grating to me as I am sure some of mine are annoying to him. I hate how he is a pack rat and pulls old magazines out of his closet, brings them into the livingroom, pages through a few, then leaves them scattered all over the tables and floor, then walks away to get a cup of coffee, while dropping his socks onto the floor. Very casual guy...

I don't mean to be whipping around a lot of topics, but your post reminded me of when Bipolar and I were separated last winter and he was living with our son and I was living with my girlfriend because we came back from up north sooner than we intended to and our house had been leased out. The marriage had been a struggle for all that time since the A in 1998. Our recovery was shytty and Bipolar's illness and attitude and medication problems took its toll on us. We both vascillated about the unmarraige and I was pretty resolved to the fact we were pretty much all done, and very OK with it.

One day around Christmas things started to change. He suddenly realized how indifferent I had become and he began to reassess my value to him and his feelings for me. Instead of seeing me as a source of his guilt/remorse, he began to see me as he did before when we were first married. He realized I hadn't changed at all and yet had changed entirely...the 'changed' part made me interesting to him and made him desire me and the marriage all the more while the 'not changed' part made him nostalgic for what we had, knowing this was a once in a lifetime thing.

We gradually recommitted ourselves to each other and finally moved into together again in April and the actual "ceremony" of beginning anew sort of wiped away some of the bad past.

The best thing about my husband now is his incredible awareness and gratitude. It is absolutely inspiring. And it is so satisfying for me to come back from the brink of the abyss of indifference enveloped in this higher plane of love and commitment, that I find myself 'almost' grateful for some of the things that happened to bring us through this journey to where we are now.

Part of the reason why some of the trust issues are successfully being resolved is Bipolar's consistency. We never had that before because he was always all over the place and I could never draw a bead on him. While he will never do the mundane household stuff I want, and will forever be following him around with a clothes basket picking up his socks and t-shirts, he is enthusiastic about us and our life together and is teaching me that his priorities are the ones that are of value...chores are important but they can wait if it means cuddling up on the sofa together watching movies.

I guess all this is about "hope" and my desire for you and your husband to take this time, this separation, to re-evaluate what is really meaningful and valuable to the two of you. I'll be thinking of you and keeping you in my prayers, WIB. I know God's will be done.

Love

Catnip =^^=

<small>[ July 23, 2002, 11:53 AM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

Mof, Thanks for the well wishes and support. I know you have been in this spot before and you give me inspiration.

CM, Thanks for the well wishes. I am going to make my kids and myself the top priorities for a while.

DG, I'm so glad to see you're still around. I think what you said is very true.

Tigger, I am just going to play it by ear. H and I are both in agreement on this move. It will either make a difference or it won't. I guess I won't know how much time will have to go by until it goes by. Thank you too for the well wishes.

Catnip, Ahhhh...MEN., I know my H and all his brothers were coddled by thier mother, and he has pretty much been coddled by me too. He does admit that may be true. I also have grown accustomed to his indifference about many things and it is probably the lack of "gratitude and awareness" that bother me most. He also is constanly trying to make me feel as if there is something wrong with me and that my standards are just too high and impossible to live with. I am NOT a neat freak. I repeat, NOT a neat freak!!! It isn't even just the chores. It's the bill paying, the shopping, the kids appointments, the homework, the school events etc, etc. Anyway, thanks for the prayers. I also am hoping for the best.

WIB,

I am very sorry to hear of this change in your marriage. I do hope that the separation has the desired affect on you and your H. I guess as the only male responding to you so far, I would like to point out a couple of things that Catnip mentioned.

Priorities! They are usually different and because two people don't have the same ones doesn't mean that there isn't care and affection, and even love.

I found it interesting that you didn't listen to your H when you got back. He knew what you were going to do, and he knew you would work yourself into exhaustion to do it. He didn't want to do it for his own reasons, perhaps tired, doubt it was laziness as you have said he does work hard. So he suggests that you slow down and relax which you didn't. He made his suggestion, you rejected it, and he was the villian.

I am not trying to get on your case. What I am pointing out, is that he may have cared more than you think and offered his solution. You rejected it. You then get mad and discouraged because he then didn't jump up and help you do what he clearly did not want to do or have you do at the moment.

A possible solution to this would have been to say: "Alright I won't do it all now, but how do I accomplish what needs to be done for the whole family? Can you help or offer a soluation?"

Why am I saying this now? Because as you two are separated you will very likely have a fair amount of contact because of the children. If you develop the skills to include him in your decisions, not just "expect" that he value what you value and when you value it, it just might change the dynamic.

I would also remind you that while I am a big fan of MB, and do like reading, someone that doesn't is not automatically a villian. WIB, there is more going on here than just the dishes and the dirty clothes that you and the ladies here love to complain about. You need to find out what is really bothering you, deep down. I suspect I know what is bothering your H deep down, and he needs to address it.

However it is unlikely that either of you will until certain truths are realy admitted by the both of you. Perhaps the time apart, where He isn't the focus of your inner turmoil, and you are not the focus of his prolbems wil help. However, it won't if you don't address you feelings and voice them to him. I really doubt that doing the dishes or 3 loads of laundary is the issue, is it??

WIB, please give this some serious thought. I realize your marriage is under a lot of strain, and an 11 mo old baby doesn't help, neither does 2 boys almost teenageres. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> But, realize your H is under strain as well, and very likely not the same sources of it as you.

I wish you the best of luck in this, and I would encourage you to speak with your H daily not withdraw into your fortress where a man of his verbal and social skills cannot reach you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

God Bless,

JL

JL,
Hello there. First, We had just got back from a week of lying on the beach and relaxing, I don't think that he was overly tired or anything like that. He just does not do those things period. I guess if I saw my H getting upset about something he was doing or saw that if I gave him a little help that it would make him happier then I would do it. I wouldn't just sit there and tell him to chill. I would try to help.

As far as whatever his problem is...I have no idea because try as I might to get him to talk to me he will not. I can't make him. Maybe this will give him the time to think things through for himself. I;'m sure that if and when he is ever ready to talk to me then he will.

As for now, we are getting along very well and I expect that to continue after I move. I feel no anger towards him, I just can't keep going the way we're going. Something had to give and I guess it was me.

Just an afterthought. I don't know if you noticed in my post that I admitted to not appreciating the things he does do and I hoped that this move would allow BOTH of us to learn how to appreciate each other. I am not pinning this entirely on him.