<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:29 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

Oh Tina, bless your heart.

I personally have not experienced this. Something just drew me to this board, and here I found some of the most compassionate and strong women I have ever met.

I am sure it took alot of courage for you to tell your husband no. Seems to me that you are getting some courage back and taking back your life. This is a very proud moment for you.

I for one think you absolutely did the right thing. I also think that once the holidays hit, he is going to have a very dark cloud hanging over his head. He will be with someone else's family, people he probably doesn't really know all that well. He is going to look around trying to find you and your children, familularity, and you won't be there. I think this is going to effect him in a negative way.

You go with your children and enjoy them, your family, and yourself. Stay strong with your decision, I think in the end, it'll be the one that brings your husband back down to earth.

Best Wishes for You and Your Family,

Melissa

TINA!!!!!!!
I know that was a HUGE step to take!

Although I'm sorry you won't be at the restaurant for a celebration dinner, I'm sure you'll be missed!

Happy Birthday to your wonderful D and I hope the day isn't too uncomfortable for your S.

I remember 2 years ago. S came with me to my parents leaving his dad alone.

Tina I was also a mess that day, thinking what the hell did I have to be thankful for?

When I think back, I had so very much to thank God for, my healthy parents, my comforting sister and her family, my dear sweet son who was about to drop off into a deep depression, and my life!
Literally.....my life....I wasn't dead though I felt I was.

You can do this.

You still have life.

Melissa said some great things to think about.

Although not there to hold your hand, I am with you in spirit and through prayer, Tina.

You've simply had enough sorrow and probably still will but you are a step closer to becoming a whole person again no matter what may happen.

Bless you Tina.

love
Debi

Thank you Gem, and Melissa for your kind words and support.

Thank you both again for your prayers and kind words.

Tina

<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:30 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

Dear Tina,

I think you did exactly the right thing and I join Mshermi and Gem in applauding you. You have suffered so much throughout your H's OW drama. You deserve to have some peace.

Right now it must feel like your world is turning upside down. Traditions that you held for years are now giving way to different types of traditions. I will pray for you to be able to look at this transition as an adventure -- an opportunity to discover the inner you -- the happy you.

Our society is so built on being a couple and being a family, it is hard not to feel out of sync when a marriage has problems and H and W separate. But right now, everything should be about you and your future. You are not a yo-yo and you should not support your H in his cakeman routine (having his cake and eating it too!).

Your H has not been forced to think about his situation because from where he was sitting he had everything. Maybe holidays on the outside of his family will force him to review the situation. Try to relax. Try to enjoy the happiness around you. Take comfort in the small things and concentrate on what you have to be thankful for. I am sure you will find much more than you could imagine.

Much love to you this Thanksgiving. Much strength to get through this difficult time. You are stronger than you know. You are just beginning to find that out. God bless you and your family,

love,
heavenly

Thankyou Heavenly, It is so nice to see you post.
I am very thankful for the little things. I talked to my mom today, and she sounded very upbeat. This has been a very difficult year for her healthwise.
My kids will be with me.

<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:31 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

Tina, I am so proud of you. You did the absolute right thing. YOur H cannot actually believe he will be part of family with you and then go to OW and be part of her family. The only one who would benefit from this would be him, not you.

YOur H and his OW sound so much like mine. Neither one felt I had healed enough or quick enough for their tastes.Guess whose fault that was? My H and OW. They both sneaked around, conducting visits, lying to me and hassling me.

I talked to Steve Harley this week, and upon hearing what my H has been doing, he said " he hasn't done what he needs for you to feel safe to start the healing." Not to finish it, but to even start to heal.When a H enters into therapy obstensively to work on marriage, but he continues somehow to have contact with OW or OC without wife's support, he is creating havoc in the healing of the marrige.

You are not responsible for lack of progress in your healing, but your H is. Heck, he continued A and had sex with OW. What the heck-so he goes to her. Let him. things full time may not be so wonderful for him.

I wish you the best Thanksgiving.Be happy you have daughter and son who support you. YOur H does not have that.

Thanks UW,
We both have said our H's are so much alike.
I also never felt safe, the constant contact, and H's inability to create a united front. He never wanted to hurt the OW.

I woke up quite early this morning with doubts again that I am making the wrong decision. I keep thinking to myself, what will it hurt to have H with us. I keep telling myself NO. Maybe if it wasn't our D's birthday it might have been an easier decision. I think back 23 years ago today. Our first C was born. I now think that we might possibly not ever celebrate this event as a family again. It hurts so much.

I hate how cold H is towards me. I wonder if he truely hates me, or is it his way of distancing himself from me. That is the thought that runs through my mind constantly.

I wonder how can he go and celebrate TG with the OW and her family and not feel that it is hurting his children. Does he think this is acceptable because our C are adults and he will be spending time with them alone tonight? Am I just being selfish wanting him to spend the day home alone? I even told him yesterday that if he was alone in the afternoon I would like to see him. I suggested going to a movie. Why do I do this to myself? I know he won't stop over.

I just have been so obsessive over this whole process the past 1 1/2 weeks. I sense the end is near and I am hanging on by the tips of my fingers to any trace of hope for reconcilliation.

Tina

<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:32 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

Tina,
You did the right thing by keeping H at a distance. It sounds like he is not truthful to himself let alone you and your C. He will probably put on a good show for OW and her family, but inside he will probably miss the traditions he had with his family and you. Too bad he is such a fool and doesn't see what he has with you until it is too late. The grass always looks greener on the other side, but I have heard that it is not that way at all. The problems he claims to have in your relationship will eventually show up in this one, only maybe at a different pace or in a different way, but they will show up all the same. My H had an affair for 5 yrs. with OW and she was married also, but would not leave her H for him and she also had younger C. He is 52, she is 43 and I am 50. We have been M for 31 yrs. also. I was devastated, but of course I was to blame for the A as I spurned him and did not make him feel like a man. He never once told me he had this problem, but that justifies his A. It is now over and I just found out 6 mos. ago. It finally took me calling her H and letting him know she had been f****** my H for 5 yrs. She decided that she would cherish the memories and bid him goodbye. She never had any intention on leaving her H for my H and my H knew that for a long time, just couldn't give her up as he was in love with her he said. I don't think she really knew everything I knew about her and he kept her in the dark about me and me about her. Why did I stay with him you ask? I wonder myself even though I love him very deeply and he has hurt me deeply, but I feel there is really some good inside him and he deserves another chance to make a go at our M. My daughter pieced it together and asked me flat out if he was cheating. He took her finding out better than I expected and they have forged yet a new relationship between them and she told him she thought I was a very strong person as she would have tossed him out on his A right away. She does realize that I love him very deeply, but she is worried that he is only fooling me because the OW is gone and was gone before my D found out. Thank god as she was worried she might know OW and run into her someday without realizing who she actually was, but I told her not to worry she would not know her. I did so much sleuthing about this OW that I am sorry for some of the things I know. She was here in my home and in my bed. I am sure that if my daughter knew she would probably kill my H. When two people having an A really want to be together they will go anyway and do anything to be together. I just think is is so stupid that my H thought she would leave her H and be with him and when she didn't after all those years I can't believe he hung around. Was he hoping she would change her mind? What a joke...and he was the butt of it all that time. She probably had more than just him on the string at some point or other during this time, but one will never know. I did email her also and asked just what she hoped to gain from relationship with him and why did she keep it ongoing if she never intended to be with him and after I found out. She has not read it yet as she must be gone for TG and I hope she emails me back an answer. I asked if she really intended to stay out of his life forever or do I have to look over my shoulder every day and hope she doesn't ever appear. I told my H already that if I find out he has seen, emailed, talked or had any contact this time I was leaving and I would not look back again.
So I guess it sounds like you maybe are better off without your H if he cannot make up his mind. I spent 6 mos. waiting for mine to make up his and it finally took me making the move to let her H know about the A. I am not proud, but I did what I felt I had to do and I am not going to look back and second guess my actions. I am happy I brought turmoil into her home as she did to mine and I hope her H can forgive her for her stupidness.
Good Luck and you will be OK. Remember time heals all wounds, just some take more time than others. I know that already and am working on my healing.

Thanks for the reply Wantto,
I hope things do work out for you and your H. These long time Affairs are tough to get over.

In the beginning almost the first year H was trying his best to work it out, but as I have said, I did not get over the betrayl quick enough for him. He wanted this marriage to work, so he thought. But the constant negotiations with OW about V with OC, and my insistance of NC with OW was too much for him. He never wanted to give up his friendship with her.

Tina

<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:34 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

Tina,
You did the right thing. Either your H will come to his senses or he won't; being in PlanB sounds like your best bet. You are protecting yourself and your kids from more hurt and letting H see the consequences of his choices. If he is such a fool as to convince himself the XOW is the way to go, God be his judge. It doesn't make your hurt any easier, but better to part with your dignity than as a jellyfish, as you call it.

I'm sorry for your pain.
Prayers,
J

Dear Tina...

Well, the jury's in and all agree you did the right thing. YOU did NOT "seal your fate"....Husband sealed his long ago and you are simply creating boundaries that will protect you and your children from further "back and forth, push-pull" that is very distressing/destructive for all involved. It is a modified Plan B in a way. Good for you with this show of strength...I bet it surprises your Husband a lot and his Respect-o-meter is rising for you, even if he isn't around. You can bet you are on his mind anyway.

Stand firm on this and watch your own self respect rise along with an increase in your strength. You are going through the toughest thing you have ever gone through and it is scary and it is weird and it makes us feel disjointed and makes life feel unrealistic and unfamilar...that is what makes us hang onto bad situations and causes us to accept things that are toxic to our own personal recovery. But, you are starting to fight this "injustice" in your life and I bet in some ways it must give you a small measure of satisfaction so far (I hope) to feel that you have a little control of the outcome of your life.

Your Husband will find that not having access to you and the house and be included in family gatherings distressing while giving you the opportunity to take a deep breath and search for other ways to make your life whole once again. We all fight this because it is so unpleasant for us, too. We want what we had and think by doing nothing, by not making any demands, we will get it back by osmosis or something when all it really does is allow the Wayward to play both sides of the fence. You can't allow him to do this to you and your kids.

It might seem he has made his decision but regardless of what he is doing, whatever "relationship" he has with OW isn't going to last. This kind of thing has about a 2% success rate and he doesn't sound like a candidate for success in the least...he seems to be a casualty just waiting to happen. He WILL crash and burn in this realtionship built on lies, deceit, selfishness, devastation and unhappiness. It's a very, very shaky and crumbling foundation not much better than quicksand. He will soon be so miserable he will long for the halcyon days and nights with you. And OW will freak knowing he lives in regret, thinking of you.

It's all [censored], and it is all difficult and we find ourselves wracked with doubt whether or not we are doing the right thing. And maybe the ONLY positive thing you have right now is a gain in respect from him and your own self-respect, but it is a lot and at least it is moving forward.

Pray for God's will. I know it is scary because sometimes we are afraid of God's will because if it includes not being with Spouse, we tend to turn our backs on the one power that will eventually sustain us. God understands this and knows what you are going through, but He also wants what is best for you and will move things aoround in our lives according to His great plan. For some reason, this is what is supposed to be happening right now in your life, for whatever reason. God brought you here to gain insight, strength and knowledge from others who have been where you are now and find the tools you need to make these changes.

My wish for you is to wake up some morning and say to yourself, "And I wanted him? I was willing to settle for a life of misery with a man with TWO OC's?" and bounce out of bed and into life, slightly sad for loosing what you thought you had and all the years together, but glad that you are beautiful and still young and have another chance at happiness.

Tina, I am really, really proud of you. And I don't mean that in a patronizing way at all. I know how difficult it was for you to make this stand. I know it scares you and makes you think that this is the end of the end by your hand, but it isn't. For you, it is just the beginning.

Love

Catnip =^^=

<small>[ November 29, 2002, 10:26 AM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>

Catnip,
Thank you for the encouragement.

Tina

<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:35 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Tina71:
<strong>he told me, I guess to make me feel guilty about not including him yesterday, was that since I would not let him come to TG meal with us, why shouldn't he go with her.

=^^= That was manipulative of him...and unkind. He is transferring the blame to you because he is too cowardly to own it.

So I do feel really crappy about my decision. Like I pushed him to her.

=^^= You did not do the wrong thing and you did not push him to her at all. Your decision was the right one despite the fact you feel crappy about it. It was the only decision you could have made under the circumstances. He would have gone to her anyway because he planned on being there anyway before or after he was with you. He left you in the middle of yard clean up....he would have left to go to her relative's house, too.

Tonight H and children are going to dinner. I don't like not being included.

=^^= I know. I am so sorry.

Our D is very angry, our son is very hurt. It is tough trying to balance both of their feelings.

=^^= You are not responsible for your children's feelings on this. He is. He is the one who has brought all this down on all of you. All you can do is comfort them.

What a long weekend!

=^^= Well, today is Monday and the beginning of a new week. The TG holiday is over and I imagine most of us are relieved. What happened over the rest of the weekend?

There are better days ahead, Tina, even though you can't see it now. Life is very tough and lonely for you right now, making you very vulnerable but it is just a stage that we all go through during this horrible period in the process of all of this. The pain and hurt these selfish people bring into our lives and into our children's lives is incredible, but not insurmountable...even if it feels like it. Hang tough and keep praying and stay busy, Tina, as busy as you can.

Do you think you'll be going to see your Mom soon? A change of venue might help for a few days and give you a new perspective.

Love

Catnip =^^=

</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Catnip, thanks for keeping an eye on me.

Tina

<small>[ December 08, 2002, 10:36 PM: Message edited by: Tina71 ]</small>

Tina, don't have much time to reply, but wanted to post.

don't go to meet with H. Go without him, but don't go with him. I don't see how that helps you. Get a good lawyer, do not do the lawyer thing with a joint lawyer. YOur H needs to see the ramifications of his actions on you as well, HIs actions are hurting tons of people, look at how your kids feel. He is selfish. Get some backbone and do not be with him. He will have to earn his right to be with you, if only on friendly terms. Please, please, call steve Harley and see him. I think he could help you.

Will write more later.