I just opened a card sent to H from a female I never heard of, sending lots of love and similar comments...

Don't know if I'm facing another Dday or XOW is so desperate as to get her friends to mess with us... wondering if I should believe whatever answer I get from my H...

After 4 years of recovery, I shouldn't still be dealing with this.

Wiped out,
Jenny <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

What would you think of this card?

It's a cartoon happy thanksgiving card, then she writes:

"So shoot me--I was in a silly mood when I was looking at cards today! LOL [laugh out loud or lots of love?] Kisses and wishes! Love you!--Name"

H says she is the coordinator for a group sending care packages to the deployed troops; he is her point of contact, that he's never seen her or done anything.

Opinions? (Also, why to our home address?!)

I'm so tired of this #$&*

<small>[ December 06, 2002, 01:46 AM: Message edited by: Jenny ]</small>

Hi Jenny,

I'm sorry to say, but I too think this is too personal. What does your H think about this card???
Mostly because he says he hasn't even seen her???

Try to talk to him again and try to make the conversation "calm" and "comfortable". Just express your feelings and don't accuse him of anything.
You might even decide to write a card back to her.
Signed : " Jenny and Husband"

I once was in a simular situation. No card but something simular. My H didn't understand why I felt uncomfortable. I then explained it to him. I think I did a good job getting the point over to him.

My H is a very friendly and very easy-going man. (well this has changed quit abit) Woman seemed to feel attracted to him, due to his friendlyness. Many saw this as a chance to start something. He would get gifts from many of our customers. (90% woman)
Somehow I could tell just by the gifts if the woman had any other thoughts besides just being friendly. It also told me alot about how they communicated with my H.
He really got to understand this after his affair. He then realized that by not setting boundaries he was keeping a little door of hope open for some woman that (maybe) thought a little more.

Seldom is this kinda thing truely naive and harmless from the side of a woman. (well this is my opinion) If a woman knows that a man is happily "MARRIED" and sees no chance, I don't think she would send such a card. It would be embarrassing because I know the man has a wife, so why would I send a lovy-dovy joking card?
If their relationship is truely only business, why would I even send a card and why to a personal address??? And if I would send one, I'd include the greetings for his "unknown" wife! This way I would not be causing any confusion.
But this is only my opinion. I truely don't think this card is appropriate and I think it is too personal mostly if he has never seen her!!!!

bb

Dear Jenny

I am so sorry about that card. Jenny. It seems so highly inappropriate. "KIsses & wishes"????
"Love you"???? And he's never seen her????

I don't believe it.

This lit me up when I read it. If I had never met my contact, I certainly wouldn't be sending any cards out unless it was to my contact and his spouse and in a very general way. I am so sorry, Jenny, but I don't believe your husband. The card was way too familiar and cute-sy.

Has he been by himself a lot lately...away from you? I do understand how lonely one can get in the military away from spouse and being susceptible to trouble, but he's had a kind of "aversion therapy" and I can't imagine anyone putting themselves in a position like that again. When is he getting out?

Blondblossom had a great idea by sending a return card and signing it Jenny and Spouse. I would even attach a note saying since you have never met, it would be nice to do so and please come to our home and have dinner with the family.

Are the points of contact in seperate locations? Has your husband been distant or euphoric? What has HE been like lately? Any signs?

This could also be from someone who has a crush on him and is sending out signals. Sending this to his home address could be a way of alerting you, too.

Jenny, I will keep you close to me in prayer. In the meantime, find out everything you can and don't let anyone minimize this or blow it off until you know for sure what is or is not going on. Hopefully, it is nothing and no big deal and just some woman who has misread signals.

Love to you

Catnip =^^=

Jenny, not much more for me to add. I agree with the others that you need to talk to him, and be honest about all you are feeling. You need to explain why this hurts/bothers you, what feelings it is triggering for you. He may not understand the intensity of it since it is 4 years into recovery. Oftentimes my H will say ..."But it is three years after the fact,"...I not so sure they can understand how raw theemotions can still feel.
It sounds as if you two have been able to communicate, and I would just pull out those ways to get thru this. It does sound fishy, but as Catnip said, it could be a crush starting up trouble and God is giving you and him a chance to recognize it and nip it in the bud.
Let us know how you are. Hugs and prayers.
NGU

Thank you for your replies!!!!!! Now I feel my feelings aren't off the wall and this IS inappropriate.

H: "I haven't done anything. I'm not intending on doing anything. ...I don't know what else to say. I haven't seen it, didn't write it, didn't ask for it."
------------------------------

I'll try to clarify something: Letter came from XOW's state. H nor I have been there in 4 years; we're stationed overseas. H was with me for 3 years, deployed to Afghanistan most of this year (still deployed).

Unless he's lying and she is active duty, they could not have met in person. I can easily imagine blondblossom's take on it, because H does not usually "get it" when a woman is flirting with him. He is in a position to be a point of contact for a group like he describes, but what made her think she could talk like that....?!

What to do? What to believe?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Jenny:
<strong>

I'll try to clarify something: Letter came from XOW's state.

=^^= It must be XOW then, playing games.

Unless he's lying and she is active duty, they could not have met in person.

=^^= What are the odds he has met someone from XOW's state? Not likely. Seems like a set up to me. Someone is bored, that's all, I hope.

He is in a position to be a point of contact for a group like he describes, but what made her think she could talk like that....?!

=^^= Misread signals? Mistaking general friendliness as interest?

What to do? What to believe?

=^^= Just be really alert and believe nothing without proof. Trust you instincts.
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">God bless

Love
Catnip =^^=

Hmmm... I think I would reseal the entire card and return to sender without a reply.

You and your H are getting along, right? He's treating you great, right? Do you believe him?

Then I would blow it/her off. She can keep her kisses and wishes, silly moods, laughs and love to her dang self! This is right before the holidays and you're right, you DON'T need this...

Hmmm... Maybe you could even write on the envelope "NO LONGER AT THIS ADDRESS." See what happens???

Jenny,

I happen to think it is X-OW. If it is from OW's state, she or one of her sick friends probably sent it to make you upset. I doubt that a contact would send it to his home address when she would know that he is currently deployed elsewhere. I think it was deliberately sent to your house to upset you. Otherwise it would have been to where H is deployed, right?

Didn't you say that you and H are no longer contacting XOW about OC because of all her silly games?? I am sure that is it. Trust your instincts though. I have learned to trust mine!

I hope that it is all a stupid joke from OW. I like the idea of returning it to sender that BTDT had. Or, you could mail it back to XOW!!

Was there a name on the return address? A first and last name? A return address? I would try to find out if there is such a person, that might help to see if such a person even exists. Since how could XOW know the coordinators first and last name... You could use infospace.com or something, or the states online white pages???

My prayers for you that it is all evil XOW's doing.

Love,

HG

Dear Jenny,

My vote goes to xOW! I agree with others that it is too coincidental that the card comes from her state and too many things don't add up.

The contact would have known to send the card directly to your H. The fact that it was sent to your home seems intended to annoy you.

I agree that your H's answer is less than satisfying. It would drive me crazy when my H would say "I can't explain why someone wrote something in a card -- I didn't write it!" Actually, that is quite true, but certainly not what you want to hear.

It used to make me think that he was distancing himself because he wanted to sweep an incident under the rug. Probably the same feeling that it gave you.

But Happy_Girl was dead right -- trust your feelings. You know whether your H is sounding strange or defensive. If you did not detect the feelings in him, disregard the card. I love the idea of sending back a card with Mr. & Mrs. Jenny's names. Even add a "happy family" photo -- the kind you send around at Christmas time.

If it is the xOW, she will choke!

I know how awful these doubts can be, and they never seem to end even when you think you have conquered them. Stay strong, I am sure it will turn out to be a really dirty trick. Just stay vigilant and keep your ears to the ground for changes in your H.

Keeping you in my prayers, and wishing you peace and strength,
love,
heavenly

Oh SWELL.

H admits they've been emailing "a few times a week" and he "did not set the boundaries he should've". He has no idea how she got our home address and will cut off contact.

Thank you for your support. I don't have any one I want to discuss this with in "real life"...

I'm so disappointed in him. We were doing so good. What am I suppose to think?
J

Oh, Jenny,

I can feel your disappointment. Don't they learn anything? E-mailing a couple times a week? What was he thinking of.

I know you are probably more upset about the evasion of the truth than you are about the e-mail contact. It would have seemed much more innocent if he had come out and told you about the e-mailing from the beginning.

Your H may very well have some of my H's tendencies. By his own admission, my H has a problem with flirtation. He loves the idea that women are attracted to him and the attention they give him. With ex-OW it went farther than it should because he happened to find a woman who was aggressively pursuing him. This e-mailing business can be the start of trouble.

Your H is in a difficult spot -- he is deployed, away from his family, bored and lonely, in dangerous conditions. Probably was just some harmless fun... Maybe you can make him understand that this harmless fun could have turned ugly and could have threatened your peace and happy home.

Sorry you have to deal with this. The OC situation is tough enough, but then when you have to worry about future betrayals, it sure can get you down.

Have your heart-to-heart talk. Try to keep calm and not LB. And, if you are satisfied that's all there is to it, then let it rest and move on. But make sure you both have an agreement on how unacceptable this type of behaviour is and how damaging this is to your sense of trust in him.

God's grace be with you to help you and your H re-establish the proper guidelines that will enable your marriage to continue growing in understanding and trust.

love,
heavenly

Just a bump up for self-pity.

I have no idea if H will email me again before I go to bed and of course I'm stewing over this mess.

He's bringing up the same issues that came up 4 years ago... De-sha-stinking-VU

It's like there's been no progress, just a 4y hiatis. I'm sure the 1y deployment hasn't helped, but I really don't know what to make of this or where to turn next...

heavenly,
thank you for your email.

I need a lifeline. I'm torn up and no where to turn.

It's not that what happened was so serious--not emotional, not physical--but still so inappropriate and still the same complaints from H that I heard 4y ago...

despite reassurances in the meantime that I was doing just great! I am not a MIND READER!! I cannot overcome his passive-aggressive I'm-needy-but-not-gonna-tell-you problem all on my lonesome, esp. during an 11mo separation!!!

... how am I suppose to planA/show-love whatever this when I'm so mad and disappointed that he screwed it up again?!

Jenny...Who is he e-mailing? XOW or someone else?

How devastating....I don't know what to say. This is so upsetting...it's like they have amnesia and can't remember the horror of it all...

I am so sorry, Jen...you know you are in my prayers, Jen.

Catnip =^^=

catnip,
Thank you. It's not XOW but another woman in the same state--there's a return address on the card she sent.

He's bringing up hurts I (unknowningly) caused him in the last year that he resented but didn't tell me... (that's what happened re: his A w/XOW--not sharing lovebusters or needs). He admits it's not my fault... Okay, so is he fatally flawed? I really wonder.

<small>[ December 07, 2002, 07:49 AM: Message edited by: Jenny ]</small>

Jenny, I am sorry for this hurt.
I understand where you are at.

I just found out my H had some contact with OW and bought some things she needed.

Without my knowledge, and all the while claiming he was not having any contact with her.

It doesn't matter to me that I don't believe he is sexual with her.

The betrayal is still the same. He is concealing contact with her, as your H did with emails, and why? Because he knows it is wrong and I will be angry and hurt. ANd why? Because it is damaging to us.

It has caused me to seriously question again my thoughts on divorce. I cannot live with a man so seriously flawed that he puts our marriage in harm's way repeatedly and thinks so little of me and our family to do this.

that is what hurts. I know my H needs some serious counseling to heal what is flawed within him. And I don't see him volunteering for this.

Until he does,and works through this stuff, I don't want to be around.

Would your H agree to some counseling for himself?

<small>[ December 07, 2002, 01:23 PM: Message edited by: unhappy wife ]</small>

jenny,

i am so sorry. i was truly hoping it was XOW playing games with you. i think you really need to talk with your husband. didn't he learn anything?? i know she is far away, but still...why take the chance?

you are right that you shouldn't have to guess when he has problems etc. he needs to tell you. it isn't fair for him to now say well "you did this, etc". i think he should tell this woman that they can no longer talk, that he is a married man and it is over. someone else should become the point of contact.

my prayers for you that you can get past this current betrayal. i know it wasn't physical or emotional or an affair, but he admits he didn't set boundaries. that is not right. does she even know he is married??

love,

HG

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Jenny:
<strong>It's not XOW but another woman in the same state--there's a return address on the card she sent.

=^^= What a coincidence! The same state. Has he been back there without you and met someone there unbeknownst to you? Are you going to write to her or anything? I would, but then, that's my MO...

He's bringing up hurts I (unknowningly) caused him in the last year that he resented but didn't tell me... (that's what happened re: his A w/XOW--not sharing lovebusters or needs). He admits it's not my fault... Okay, so is he fatally flawed? I really wonder.

=^^- Hmmmm...now I am starting to wonder about Bipolar...I can't see him doing this and then again, I can. I wonder if men that do these things are just so susceptible to flattery because they are feeling so bad about themselves that any woman's attention would turn their heads. It is a lot of work to be constantly adoring the spouse to meet his needs when we are so needy of the same things ourselves, and not getting much of it. It is almost like I have to accept the fact that most men are just "that way"??? I've been fighting that theory since day one.

I've noticed that with all the stress and strains of life, especially now with all the issues we are faced with, that the romance is difficult to keep alive. We manage to be very loving most of the time, but the events of the past four years hace certainly taken its toll on us. We are both exhausted and depressed, dealing with negative financial issues and Bipolar's complete dissatisfaction with his work and lack thereof. We are stuck in a rut and if we make it out of this, we have something pretty wonderful that came at a tremendous cost to us...if it does not work out for us, then I worked very hard for a lot of years for nothing more than life lessons I really didn't need.

I think if this happened to me, I would write my husband a long letter telling him how I feel and how I feel about him and about my hopes and dreams. I'd also periodically send him romantic and sexy cards just to remind him how he makes me feel or how he still makes me crazy when the lights go dim.

Jenny...when is the bull coming home so you can take it by the horns?
</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Jenny you said </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">H admits they've been emailing "a few times a week" and he "did not set the boundaries he should've". He has no idea how she got our home address and will cut off contact.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">and my mind flashed back to a few months back when I found out H went over to xOW's house to say "goodbye" when she was moving out of the state, and tneh had talked on the phone a few times too.

Oh the horror of it. It felt like a major major set back.

The actions are ego driven. Bottom line. And I like to liken them to children that need to be "reminded" that sometimes their "innocent" behavior is hurtful to us. They know this deep down inside already, but have to be reminded.

Talk it out with H and figure out what his motivations truely were. What he wanted to gain. Remind him that it's your job to fulfill those needs and yours alone.

I like Cat's suggestion of cards and reminders to stroke his ego. Men NEED that even though they don't like to admit it.

I'm the first to admit sometimes I slack off due to pressures at work, home and church. So I slap myself into shape and get back on the program.

Remember, we are all here for you,
Z.