So, I'll ask this....

K: you said in the thread that Tim should.... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Read the gospel, look for forgiveness (the same kind that God gives you through Jesus's death), and see if you can find compassion to restore your marriage.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Boy, I've been thinking about that a lot! I think the thing that SCARES me the most about God's kind of forgiveness is that if this whole ow/oc thing were happening to God,He would be able to forgive, and forgive, and forgive. That means, if the spouse does it AGAIN, that God would forgive them. I'm not sure I could ever forgive again and again and again. Although, each time you have triggers or some other mental episode, you literally have to forgive the spouse again (if not verbally at least in your heart).

And because God is able to forgive and separate us from our sins as far as the east is from the west, God is kinda saying to us that we have to be okay with the future being just what it is. There are no promises in marriage so God is saying - if I act as if it never happened and you do it again, then I forgive again. WOW!

I am still confused as to how I forgive without saying "it's okay that you did this to me, to us, to ow, to oc, to your family, it's okay that you took away birth rights from your current only son, it's okay that you lied for years, it's okay that you slept with another woman with the body that God designed for me', etc. etc. etc....

I read consistently and I just have never felt so abandoned by God. I read the scriptures to see is God telling me to stay. I read to find some peace (which isn't coming - I'm waiting for that joy in the morning). I struggle with my Christianity and the contact/no contact thing. I wonder if I'm such a good Christian then why can't I have contact with ow/oc?

Maybe I'm expecting too much too quickly. Maybe I'm still looking for that magic to happen.

I know for sure that I love my Husband. I don't know for sure the depth of his remorse, I don't know his sincerity for sure (I can only goes on what he tells me) and I don't know if I know all the details of the affair and I don't know if I need to. I do know that God knows. See, we hardly really have to tell God anything because he already knows it all. He knows before we ask.

Just my thoughts and these days who knows what they're worth!

A

angelia,
Books that have helped me (maybe at your local library?):

Calm Surrender: Walking the Hard Road of Forgiveness by Kent Nerburn

When Forgiveness Doesn't Make Sense by Robert Jeffress

Making Sense Out of Suffering by Peter Kreeft

The Railway Man by Eric Lomax (a personal story of forgiveness by a British man who, tortured during capture by Japanese during WWII, was in old age, befriended by one of his repentent torturers)

I know you don't want to hear this, but it's still early...

May God grant you peace,
J

Jenny: I went on-line and have a hold on every one of those books. Somewhere on this website should be a MUST READ selection of books.

And yes.....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know you don't want to hear this, but it's still early... </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"><img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Why isn't it over YET!!!?

luv ya!!!
Angelia

angelia,

On the main Marriagebuilders Discussion Forum Home Page there is a link General Welcome for New Builders
Within this link there is a wealth of info regarding infidelity and recovery. One of the links within that post is Suggested Books There is a section on this website for suggested books. I don't know if you've seen this before but you might find it helpful. Also, look for some of these books at your local library. Mine carries many of them.

<small>[ January 28, 2003, 09:36 PM: Message edited by: Nerlycrzy ]</small>

angelia,

I'm sorry but-- LOL. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hang in there. There is no "going back"... only learning to live a different reality.

God be with you,
J
in recovery 4.5y,
visited "hell" one too many times-- LOL

great books Jenny

another one is entitled "Absolute Surrender" by a guy from the late 1800's named Andrew ??? something.... sorry on last name. but it's a great one.

K is right about studying and meditating on the new testament, but the old is God's word just the same, and both are very relevant. As the wisest man ever to live; Soloman said in Ecclesiastes, "what has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun." ECC 1:9 then, in his glorious and perfect finale of this book, he hits us with this HUGE passage, "Now all has been heard; here is the conclusion of the matter: FEAR GOD and keep his commandments, for this is the whole duty of man." Ecc.12:13 wow what an ending. the fear I had for him was lacking miserably to put it very mildly. God is benevolant, and we seem to all enjoy the love part of him and I put the benevolance of God on the far back burner, when it should have been as prevolant as all the other qualities he has. He is forgiving, but he'll certainly whip ya if you get outa line. He sure has whipped me plenty, but I deserved every one of 'em and I'll gladly take more if it brings me as close to God or closer than I am now.

Jesus quoted the old about a gazzilion times to make his point or to add credibillity to his statements. Jesus also said(in the new testament), "But I will show you whom you should fear: Fear him who, after the killing of the body, has the power to throw you into hell. Yes, I tell you, fear Him." Luke 12:5.

seems Christ wants us to Love God 1st then love man 2nd and all the while fear his judgement; thinking about that before we act.

peace
tim

Andrew Murray?

Also wanted to note here that this is what Dr.Harley's principles are for--if you can both subscribe to the suggestions, it should help your communication, understanding how to meet each other's emotional needs, policy of joint agreement, radical honesty, etc., all designed to help affair-proof the marriage! angelia are you reading up on your Harley??? There is so much knowlege to gain on this website! Check out the notable posts and threads in JUST FOUND OUT too, very insightful stuff!

Yes ma'am. I've read SAA, His needs/Her Needs, Fall In Love/Stay in Love, and Love Busters.

not to be sarcastic, but aren't I a little past the affair proofing of my marriage? Or do you mean in the future?

BTDT, I haven't even decided yet as to whether I'm staying or not much less worrying about how to affair proof it for the future. I'm taking one day at a time. I'm wanting to see how my H acts in the future. I'm really only working on me for now - I guess that sounded selfish but I am. I'm reading, chatting with you good people and praying.

BTDT, I used to read the threads on just found out but truthfully it's too painful. I sometimes even have a hard time reading the ones on this board. For me, it's all so new and still oh so painful and I just can't stand reading the sorrow filled stories on these boards. They depress me - not that I need much help in that area - but they don't encourage me much. I find myself wallowing in more self-pity the more I read some of the postings.

BTDT, my H is not reading anything unless I put it smack in front of him. He is being accountable for his time, his money and his whereabouts. He is not offering to go to counseling, offering to go to church,or offering to pray. That frustrates me but I suppose God will deal with him in His own way.

I don't know all that I need to know for recovery but I do pray for peace. And, what I've found is that each of these books have things I can take away - things I can ponder on and things that hopefully will lead me slowly but surely down the forgiveness path. Whether we stay together or not I know that I need to forgive.

Angelia

yes ....Andrew Murray.... great call BTDT. are you a black belt??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

peace
tim