My wife and I have "birdnested" for the sake of the kids since Dec 2001 in order to sort out our issues and pursue joint counseling and couples communication classes through HMO. Mistakenly thought it was doing some good,...she's been plotting all along.

After the kids told me, very casually that OM had been to the house a few times, I called wife and said we needed to talk. She broke the news and broke down claiming I would never want to speak to her again.

In my mind, I have plan A'd for the last 1.5 yrs and now this. I called Dr. Laura yesterday and asked her, after hearing the news about wife's pregnancy 4 mos away, what course of action I should pursue with the kids. Her response was full custody in that I cannot afford to let the kids to have access to her on a 50/50 basis.

I'm now in a state of limbo where I am getting my ducks in a row, meeting with attorneys and assessing costs.

Does anyone know of a father in this predicament and what success they may have had with pursuing full custody?

The birdnesting arrangement is a major obstacle and I have proposed, for now, that I remain in the house to add stability to the kids' lives.

I'm desperate for guidance, praying daily and yet, I know of no one who has been through anything like this,....

Peace to all of you who are hurting,...and to those who can offer help of any kind.

B4andafter,

first of all can I have some info on your sitution.Wife had Affair and your now in recovery and wife started affair all over again?? Is she pregnant by you or OM?? How many children do the two of you have? Sorry i just didn't know your whole story. It is so sad when someone decides to have that affair bcz the domino effect it has on the kids and the rest of the family is horrible!! We as adults don't want to get the kids involved but let's face it they hear,they see, they listen, they know and they too hurt from it.We may be able to recover from it but never completely heal and that's really sad.Hope tomorrow is better for you
Jill

B4andAfter,

My wife had an affair after we had two kids. I ended up counseling with Steve Harley here at MarriageBuilders (something I highly recommend---888-639-1639), and did a directed, coached Plan A, and eventually moved into Plan B (I left the house). My wife ended up pregnant by the OM. That was over five years ago---the marriage was restored, and that wonderful child is now 4.5 years old. We have no contact with the OM.

However, I'm not sure what you're asking. It appears that you're interested in divorcing and gaining full (physical) custody of your children. Your lawyers can best answer that question, but I think it highly unlikely that you will win a court fight, unless your wife is judged an unfit mother. Unfit usually encompasses drug use, felony convictions, and child molestations and abuse. Having an affair doesn't even make the first cut.

So, I believe that if you want physical custody of the kids---you'll need to get your wife to agree to it, legally. If she's feeling especially guilty about all this, you may be successful.

Your other option is to attempt to save the marriage. That's why the phone number for the Harley's is listed---I would call them immediately and get into a plan with a professional coach. You may have a window of opportunity here. If you are willing to attempt it, you may be successful. You will probably lose any chance you have to gain sole custody of the kids (although I believe that option is less than 10% likely). If you ended up reconciling and then divorcing after the child was born, and assume that your wife gets physical custody (and you're on the hook for child support)---your actual liability for the OC wouldn't be much more than that for your other children, assuming that you have at least two already.

Lots of things to think about. I'm sorry that you're in this situation---it's not fun. But you can be successful in dealing with it.

Lots of practical insights here, thank you.

I have talked to Dr. Harley a couple of times and he described the feelings associated with doing Plan A. I have read numerous posts on these boards about Dobson's Love Must Be Tough but I now believe the window has closed on that. I have a pretty firm grasp of all of the concepts but WW dismisses them for being religiously-based, as her actions have spurred a blame-God philosophy that clearly shows me how far gone she is. We all used to attend church together and pledged to raise the kids in a Christ-centered home.

I have worked through this scenario countless times in my mind. Being a child of divorce myself, I am the one who knows, first-hand, how devastating divorce can be.

As far as details go, WW and I have two kids, ages 6 and 9. After our 6 yr old son was born, WW went through period of post-partum funk, weight loss and career affirmation (travel, bonuses, etc.). Even after a doctor offered meds, she took them intermitently and was abusing alcohol while we birdnested with the kids. As is typical with guilty consciences, she sought out to destroy me with her family and they have steadily distanced themselves from me without any basis. I am the adored uncle in the family and still, unless I initiate contact, there is none from them, as they live out the phrase, "Blood is thicker than water."

From what I have read about passive dependency in Peck's "Road Less Traveled" and borderline personality disorder, it fits. Essentially, she has chosen another life and had to get to this extreme point to force me to divorce her (I believe).

Now, as it characteristic of WW hindsight, she is crying and lamenting every night about what a terrible "thing" (singular) she has done and she will do anything. Well, this is the 6th time this scenario has played out before,....discovery, confrontation, acknowledgment, promises, backsliding, secrets, etc. While my behavior has appeared noble to some, in terms of trying to keep the door open, others have observed that I have a problem with taking the necessary action for her actions. Yes, regrettably, the kids are caught up in this but for me it was past the point of no return when she allowed him into our home and got the kids to lie for her about him being there. I suppose it can be worse but is it really wise for me to see how, while I have abandoned every last shred of self-esteem in all this?

I know that each situation is different and warrants special attention to a plan. She is not interested in it and as recently as yesterday, still tries to introduce ways that I may have caused this or forced this affair on her (?) so as to alleviate her guilt but for a moment or two.

Yes, I am angry, and frankly, insulted by her recent offer to have her "accomplice" and twin-sister (who has been close to me but kept all of her sister's secrets) offer to adopt the baby if that meant staying together. It begs the question: where was she when her sister was screwing some other guy?

I have proposed counseling with the Harleys countless times, I have asked her to check-out their books, see how she might be helped by it and see what we can do to repair the damage,...time after time, it falls on deaf ears and is dismissed.

I caught wind that she was still seeing OM, is pregant by OM and that I needed to be prepared. So, in effect, I am trying to explore all options and chart a course for the future.

If God is going to soften her heart, she is not making it any easier for Him. Besides the infidelity and prior emotional affairs she kept hidden from me, she is toxic to the kids and certainly calls into question what maternal fitness really means.

Thanks for letting me rant and I certainly welcome any feedback that can help bring healing to this unforunate set of circumstances.

Married 3/92
Girl 9, Boy 6
D-Day 12/20/2000 (learned they were more than friends)
Separation/birdnesting 12/28/2001
Continued assurances that I could trust her
5/21/03 WW spills beans, confirms ongoing affair, miscarried twin 1, still carrying twin 2, due in October

This has happened 6 times before and now she is going to have the OM's baby? If anyone deserved to have a divorce it is you. If she is toxic to your children and emotional well being then you must protect your children. Six times is unbelievable. Clearly it is a pattern of behavior and a huge character defect that will occur time and again. Do not allow yourself to be the doorprize and safety net for her affairs. Clearly she has no respect for you and could care less about the pain and humiliation she has inflicted upon you. Protect yourself and your children and find a future life that is healthy, productive and loving for you and your children. It is overtime for you to move on. I wish you luck.

Keep your two children in mind because even if you do decide to divorce her, you will still have to be in contact with her. You may feel great to no longer have the title and responsibilities of being her husband, BUT you better be ready to trade one set of problems for another, all because of the children. For example, if you divorce her and she gets custody of the kids (which is more than likely due to their ages), she can have a BF move in with her and the kids and there is nothing you can do about it, can you handle it? . Another example will be what if she starts to deny you visitation with your children and you take her to court, can you handle it?, and the list goes on and on, and on. All I'm telling you is that you better be prepared for this very likely scenarios that will come after you divorce her.