Hi, Gem,
You brought up the subject of the repercussions of D-Day on my then 16 year old son and that is something that no one but you has ever thought to understand.
D-DAY for him: First of all he comes in at 430 pm to find his daddy here at home when his daddy works until 7 pm. He finds his daddy sitting on a footstool looking at his mom, who is in total hysterics on the couch. All I can say is that it is okay, no one died. But he is too freaked out to not need to know, and too mature not to be told. So I told my husband on his way out to make sure that he told him just what was going on since he was the one that caused it all. They stepped outside and the next thing I knew, my 16 year old son who I hadn't seen shed a tear in years, was running through the room, latching on to me with everything he had and in gasping sobs. His dad had worked long hours for a very long time, and he seldom saw him in recent years for much quality time together in comparison to when he was young, but it was still HIS DAD that had done this terrible immoral thing. And all he saw was instant divorce, and the end of life like he knew it. Then the anger set in and through the tears, he stood outside for 30 solid minutes and threw a baseball at our wooden patio fence, saying over and over again, "I don't have a sister", and a few choice other words he shouldn't have been saying. Then he came in and sat quietly on the couch with me for the next 3 hours, no lights, no TV. I pulled it together enough during this time to let the 7 year old son turn on a video, get him some supper and pretend that Mom just didn't feel good tonight and to please stay in his room. My husband came back home at 10 pm; he'd just sat at work and wondered what he'd done and what was going to happen, but the minute he turned the door knob at home, the 16 year old fled to his room, said he didn't want to look at him. Over the next two days, things gradually came to light for my son that we were going to try to keep things together, but he voiced to me alone that he would NEVER accept this OC in his life. And afterall, how could I blame him? He said to him that his daddy hadn't just screwed around on his mother, he'd shunned his unborn child in doing it. Which was the crux of all the 16 year old's pain. He was made to think his dad didn't want him by that one admission of being a cheater. Maybe if I hadn't been pregnant, and it was just against me, then he would have felt differently. But in the end, he wanted his family intact so badly that he ended up spending hours with me and my husband, just mediating question after question while we all 3 tried to sort through how to handle the rest of our lives. But we got through it those first 3 months and even though there were some very bad scenes and some fits thrown, the 16 year old ended up being able to convince his daddy that he needed to show some loyalty to his "REAL" family and decide that he couldn't have it both ways after all these years, especially with this OC who was a COMPLETE stranger. So although I was open to contact with the teenage daughter, my son vetoed it at every step and in retrospect, I am glad that I didn't force him to meet with her since the OW pulled out the stops and refused to allow it in the end. The thing that is the worst thing about all of this is that the OW/OC still live in our hometown. The OW graduated HS with a couple of people that my husband knows very well, people, who to our knowledge, have no knowledge of all of this. But if we had not been forced to leave that town for economic reasons, all this would have come down on our heads and my 16 year old son would probably have already known this "sister" and not even known she was his "sister" since they are only 8 months apart. So on that thread, I am so thankful to Almighty God that he protected my baby from that kind of shame, because NOT ONE of his friends in his life now knows a thing about any of this, and he said he seldom thinks about it now that it has been so long. I just know that the OC will be 18 in December and I hope that she hasn't watched enough Maury shows to get the idea that she needs to take matters into her own hands and come here on her own. I am really sick to my stomach thinking that I will feel like my son and I will have to have our guards up about this for the rest of our lives. As to the younger son, like I said in the other post, I truly hope this stays buried for many, many years to come and his daddy, who is the light of his life, doesn't have to come tumbling off that pedestal he has him so high on.

Deltamoon,
OH!! My goodness! What an ordeal huh? I can't stand to remember my son back then but I know the old timers here remember.

Our son reacted much the way yours did. Alas ow lives a few minutes from here and ALL of us see her at least one time a week. Kinda like walking over those land mines waiting and hoping you won't be next!

Our sons have similar reactions to oc's.

My son says he doesn't have a brother too!

He says oc is ow's children's sibling, not his ever!

My son called me from work on d-day and knew his Father moved out a few minutes after telling me, because his Father decided that too without my knowledge....he moved into his own place.

I said to our son I'd be ok and by the time he came home from work I was a crying snotty-nosed mess!

He came in and just held me and we both cried for a long time. He said he hated what dad had done and he was going to punch out ow. See, we knew her.

I explained how that wouldn't change anything. His 21st birthday was a few days away.

On that day my sister and neice, my son and hid then girlfriend, and a few of his buddies celebrated his birthday at ChiChi's. I remember his dad dropping off money for dinner for all of us and being hurt as to why he wasn't invited.(?)

I remember Christmas songs playing and me being in a surreal surrounding. I remember seeing a rainbow in the winter sky when we arrived there and crying.

It was the worst birthday I ever spent with my son!

He fell into a deep depression a month later and was hospitalized and my H BLAMED me for taking him in! My son begged my sister to have me take him in and he hadn't stopped crying for 3 days!

At the time my H was counseling with our former parish priest and that priest (who was a fraud and his trial is upcoming in 2004) was telling my H to see the unborn child! That we'd get used to it! H was counseling with ow there as she was a member of our church too.

My son begged my H in one session to just come back to Mom and him and let the rest fall where it should, in the gutter. (his words)

My H made no attempt at that time to sever any ties or return to our home and our son just sank!!

Long story short, I plan B'd and was getting ready to file for divorce to save myself and our son from further damage.

H returned home unprompted and well... the rest is history.

Recovery is harder with an oc.

We are doing just fine thankyou.

I am hoping you guys are too, Deltamoon.

Recovery can't be complete without two willing participants.

I sure hope you find a way to deal with the ghosts of the past!

Hey, oc is a year younger than our granddaughter.

Son and DIL are moving towns away to be sure the two never meet up in school! ugh....

Glad to have met you Deltamoon.

Sorry we met under these circumstances.

Know things can get so much better IF YOU LET GO OF THE PAST..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

love
Debi

<small>[ October 10, 2003, 10:00 PM: Message edited by: gemini1 ]</small>

How could our husbands not have realized the havoc they would wreak on everyone's life by having the affair, let alone the consequences of the OC?
I can remember that D-Day night when my husband came home like it was yesterday because I was truly shocked that he did come home. His whole world of the deadly reality of secrets of the past had just come crashing down on him as much as it had us and he seemed totally amazed that I was in such a state of pain. I guess we had gone on with our lives with such little disregard to each other for the past couple of years prior to D-day that he honestly thought I wouldn't be hurt by what I had just found out, file for a divorce and move on with MY life. And I, too, was kind of shocked by my reaction, because sometimes it takes a lightening bolt to jolt people to their senses and let them know that pride does cometh before the fall. But my stars, what a fall......But I did have too much pride, some of my regional upbringing about how the man is to be the first to make the moves, and if he wasn't acting like he loved me, why should I act like I loved him? And it ended up that both of us loved each other very much, we just stopped showing it, and it probably snowballed into that from some stupid little comment one day that one of us took MAJOR offense to and never mentioned. As to my son and how he deals with all this now......well, he went off to college 3 months ago, only an hour away, but it might as well been to Timbuktu to me. In someways I guess I felt like I only stayed after D-Day because HE wanted me to, not his dad wanting to work things out, not me wanting to work things out, but the ultimate "mom" sacrifice for doing what her child wants/needs. So when he pulled away and his room was empty, I thought for a couple of weeks that my world was all over again and I backslid bigtime. But then I realized that I didn't stay just because my son wanted me to; I stayed because deep, deep down inside I truly love my husband, lots more than I knew I was capable of. Did he destroy my life with this affair and OC? Yes, for a time, he did. Did he forever alter the way our son views him as a man? Yes, again. But I know what you said was true.....my son will grow into a wonderful man someday and although the pain of D-Day will be in the back of his mind, he formed strong opinions of how to NOT treat his wife and children and he ended up becoming a man that D-Day night, whether he realized it or not. And I look back with a tremendous sense of pride in him and who is he, even if our Jerry Springer saga helped to create him. And his daddy tries and tries to bond with him more and more on some level when he comes home on weekends, and our son has met him halfway, even though I know he still harbors some resentment toward the times that his daddy tried to incorporate the OC into our lives. And no, our son does not know about the SECOND one time affair in 2001; I chose to keep that private after he'd been through so much dealing with the initial one. I didn't want him to burn a bridge with his daddy that he'd never walk over again, plus I didn't want that for my husband, either. My husband was already dealing with enough shame and hate toward what he had done with just me knowing it. He often said that he really thought sometimes that I would kill him in his sleep and that he felt that our son and I hated him so much that our son would see nothing wrong in helping me. And although killing him never crossed my mind, I often thought of the old Willie Nelson story where his wife sewed the top sheet to the bottom sheet and beat him (while he was passed out drunk) with a broomstick or something while he was trapped and couldn't get out......HAHAHA??????

I again thank you for being here to talk to; I have felt really good the past days after starting to post here. Maybe at some point, I will feel qualified enough to post a little to some newbies and let them know that with enough love and effort, they too can have a marriage on the mend and one better than they thought possible, even through the devastation and rubble.

Talk to you again soon,
Deltamoon

Deltamoon,
I love Willie Nelson!

Especially the song "You were always on my mind"

Hey! I like all kinds of music from Nellie and 50 cent to Eagles to Beatles (ultimate in music) to Willie Nelson and Dean Martin and Etta James ohhhh the list is endless!!!

I am happy your son is well... and in school.

You know what?
You are plain wonderful and amazing to have overcome such a huge void. I know it'll never be the same....~sigh~

But the renewed love can sometimes surpass the old one. You have been given a gift and I hope when you and your H cuddle you'll realize it.

I'm tired and must get some rest but will talk later.

Much love from a woman who understands you...

Your blessings are right before your eyes....

love
Debi

Hey, Gem, our taste in music is almost identical!!
My 18 year old's friends think I am a 44 year old nutcase sometimes when they come in and find me listening to 3 Doors Down and the next CD ends up being Busta......HAHA. Then at night I LOVE saxaphone jazz......nothing else better to unwind to and go somewhere else in your head.....a snifter of brandy or a glass of red wine, stars overhead.....much recovery has occured in a setting just as that!!

And yeah, I think I am doing pretty good these past few weeks. Sometimes I think I have meltdowns because I feel out of control of a situaion - you know, that stupid "human" trait to want to continue to punish someone for doing you wrong. I figure if I still have ANY pain, he should share in the misery for a few minutes, mean as that is. But I suddenly realized how very stupid that behaviour was; maybe, just maybe, my husband doesn't think about all this as much as I do. Maybe he doesn't think about it hardly at all and I just assume since it consumed every minute of my thoughts, he was going through the same thing. So everytime I backslide, bring it all up, it does make him think about it. So maybe if I just keep my big mouth shut, neither one of us will end up thinking about it. But then on the other hand, I am paranoid to think that once I take that stance and get in a comfortable position, let my guard down, quit looking over my shoulder for the OW to suddenly jump out of the bushes again, that she will do exactly that and I will be unprepared. But maybe if that ever happens, which most of me seriously doubts it will, my husband will be the one to be prepared to handle it properly this time, since he knows what we have is worth fighting for.
I just hope and pray that my paranoia is all in MY mind and that one day I will overcome the insecurities that I have about "competing" with the unknown and I will believe my husband and all the efforts I know he is putting into the marriage now.
As to my college age son, he would come unhinged if ANYTHING about OW/OC cropped back up in our lives. I think he actually got through to his dad the night he told him that he would NEVER have any contact with OC, regardless of what we thought was best. He questioned why I would want a reminder of the affair sitting across the table from me at dinner, which I questioned also, but I was willing to incorporate her into our lives on some level; that is until I found out that something more was going on than just the OC. Then he asked his dad the best line ever......"if you are the one that peed on the carpet, why do our noses have to be rubbed in it???" Which was his way of saying that he didn't want to be punished for something he had no part of and seeing the OC would have been rubbing his nose in the entire situation. That one comment, hysterical as it is now, sure set the tone of how my husband viewed what he had done to our son and his image of his daddy's actions. Out of the mouths of babes.....a child will guide us......that is oh so true!

Blessings to you for understanding my plight and being there to hash this all out with. I know now that my recovery might have been hastened had I had the strength to post on here way back when, but at that time, I wasn't sure if my husband had ended up telling OW that I had found this site for guidance in our marriage and she might be lurking around to see if I posted. I know now that he didn't tell her anything about anything like that, so I cut off my nose to spite my face.
Some more hindsight!

Take care.
Deltamoon

Our children will have nothing to do with oc either. Over the years, they have been asked and they have always said "no way". They do not consider oc at all.

H hates it when OW flares up and the laywers are needed. Kids give him looks of disgust for the drama of it all. Once,when I asked if maybe they would want to meet oc, they about exploded and were very very angry. Quite vocal and had some choice words for all involved.

The children of the marriage deserve respect and should no be forced to suffer due to the actions of their parent who caused this mess.

Deltamoon your son's analogy of the pee on the carpet is a good way to help others understand just what all of WS family go through when a child is born of an affair.

It is so true that they did the deed and expect the rest of the family to just forgive and allow the op/oc continued intrusion in a fragile situation....like as if to say, ok /I'm sorry, now lets all play nice and swallow hard and accept this abnormal thing for the rest of our days.

More often than not it continues with bad feelings all around.

My H has said he truly doesn't think much of that time in his life except for an occasional sad feeling when something reminds him of those past days.

What has helped me to get to the point I'm at is I know in my gut he's not lying.

Also the ruckus that ow/her family has put on my H/our family has made him have such dislike for ow.... She really has put us through so much post affair as if she's intitled to something more than CS /health ins! That is just our case though. Her actions have shown my H just what kind of spoiled brat we had to deal with.

Like LynnG and you and your family, it is so much easier not to have to deal with ANYTHING or ANYONE any more. It makes for a quicker return to normal life living. After all, the A took on it's own life and without knowing what was up, caused much disruption in daily life.

My H also says he hates who he was and is relieved it's over. Greatful to God to have been given a chance to be with me/us again and would have been so lost if things did not turn out as they did.

You know what they say? Be careful what you wish for....Hmmmm....

Deltamoon try to keep quiet about things as long as your life is going smooth. Do not allow thoughts of what may happen spoil your days of the here and now. None of us are promised another day on earth so try to live yours with more prayers for peace of mind and not paranoia of something that may not come to fruition, ok?

Keep the communication lines open between you and your H. Draw up a POJA in case and it will make you feel safe each time you hear the truth about things rather that AFTER something happens.

When and if your H wants to talk, act as his best friend and not his enemy. Don't take the "poor me" thing too far or it will destroy love!

Ok. Time to start dinner....

Oh, yeah, count your blessings not your heartaches!

love
Debi