<small>[ December 21, 2003, 07:18 PM: Message edited by: twilight ]</small>

No, you should not send the bill to her. It's immature and hurtful. Besides, it's you're bill and you're responsible for it.

You may be trying to punish him for his wrong, but when you do that you hurt her, the innocent party in this mess. I beg you to mark it up as an expensive, hard lesson and go on.

Yeah... you know what, I've got a better idea. Why don't you just accept that you did a really stupid thing by getting involved with a married man, and accept the $500 as your penalty for having contributed so much misery to his wife's life. Even if you're stuck paying it, I'd say you got off light. It's a lot lighter penalty than you deserve.

She's already discovered that she's spent several years married to a selfish pr*ck. Don't look at it as a phone bill... instead, it's $500 well spent on some basic lessons in morality. Clearly you needed those lessons.

"Knowing what is right and not doing it is the worst cowardice."
-- Confucius

Rdog,

LOL, that is what I was trying to say...the nice way : )

Dear Twilight~

I think you've come far enough that you should already know the answer. You are not a stupid woman, how do YOU think she would react?...She's gonna jump for joy? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Surely you know the phone records and bill would rub salt in her wounds, especially given the calls were after D-day.

I'm with the others, chalk it up to an expensive lesson learned. In the scheme of things, it's actually pretty cheap in comparison...

Remember, no contact means NO CONTACT, and that includes his wife.

Please show this woman respect and goodwill, and stay out of her face.

For the practical matter of paying off the bill...contact the phone co. and make payment arrangements with them. I'm sure they will be willing to work with you.

Then...go and ENJOY your little one, and her first Christmas, counting your blessings, instead of your woes! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Take good care.

~autumnday

<small>[ December 21, 2003, 07:19 PM: Message edited by: twilight ]</small>

Twilight,

You have been hurt in this mess as much as his W. He told you things and he told her things. He lied to her, he lied to you.

Did you really expect him to stop lying to either of you right away?

It took over a year for my FWH to completely stop his lying to me. As for what he told OW, I don't know for sure. I believe, and I am placing a lot of faith in him, that he stopped all contact with her when he told me he did and any contact made he told me about or I was included in on the contact.

I know it stings to sit there with bills piling up and bill collectors calling, we are still dealing with that side of life, when he promised you support in those areas.

$500 is a rather hefty price to pay, no denying that. You seem to be a strong willed woman and I am sure you can handle getting through this mess without causing more pain to the BW.

Keep your head up, Twilight. Rise above his lies. Handle the situation with dignity. Don't give him the opportunity to lie to you anymore. Let his wife deal with him. And let God deal out any "extra" punishment.

Enjoy Hope's first Christmas. It’s a special time. I was able enjoy Lil Bit's first Christmas with her and I cannot wait to enjoy Baby Mac's!

*edited because I can neither spell nor keep my thoughts in order!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> *

<small>[ December 12, 2003, 10:49 AM: Message edited by: Stacia_Lee ]</small>

I guess I am one of the few BS that would want to know, no matter how hurtful. The policy of honesty is a good point to start.

How I wish my OW would have had the good sense to contact me, way back when. I believe that the longer a person is taken for a fool, the worse the pain and damage.

This is only my opinion. I am surprised that so many BW's on this board would choose not to know.

My marriage never began to heal until I found out. How can a marriage survive, if still living with deceit?

You have to make a decision you will be comfortable with.

Good luck!
ember

It's not that I wouldn't want to know, but I would definately not want to be told by the OW. I think your first immediate instinct would be is she just being vendictive? Is she wanting to continue driving a wedge? When in all honesty maybe the OW is simply wanting to show you, you still have a liar on your hands.

If that is truely the case, I might be able to even handle the OW contacting me directly face to face, but I am a quiet type person (Some might flip out completely), but I want facial contact to be able to read the intentions of the OW.

I truely believe though, the wife will find out in her time that he is still playing her. Some times the BS need that time of denial to build our strengh to deal with the stituations.

OK, your original post didn't indicate that you had a child by that pr*ck, so I'll modify my response a bit. You haven't gotten off light.

However, the rest still stands. You knew that you were getting involved with a married "man" (I use that word in its most generous sense), and that means that you made a conscious decision to hurt his wife. You may not have intended to hurt her, but you knew that would be the result. In criminal law, that's the same as intending to hurt her. You sow the wind, you reap the whirlwind.

If support is an issue, then take him to court. But I don't think you're doing his wife any favours by making yourself more a part of her life than you have already. She now knows he's a lying pig so she probably has her guard up. Concentrate on your own life without dragging her into it. The last thing she needs is a reminder of the fact that there's a living, breathing symbol of her husband's betrayal out there. Leave her be.

Go ahead, show them to her. Mail them. But it isn't going to help you at all.

You are responsible for the bill, you can forget getting the money. You made the call.

But I can tell you what I think is happening in their lives. Each time they are dealing with this, it is bringing them closer. I know it doesn't make much sense to you, but it does. Sure he lied to both of you. But when he had to actully make stand, he chose her. Trust me, no woman is going to stay with a man who has done this to her if he isn't going out his way to make it up to her. He is loving her up and rebuilding the marriage. So, if/when you send this phone bill saying he promised to pay for this, you come across to her as greedy. Petty and manipulative. She will laugh at you and see it as a form of manipulation. He will be worried that she is upset. You think she is going to go ballistic and make his life a hell? They are in this together. Had he wanted out of his marriage he would have left. Lord knows it would have been alot easier then to have to fix this mess.

On a note of caution, you all have attorneys right? How fast do you want the OFP papers on you? They will be showing the attorney your email, letter, etc. Count on it. And considering you are out of the country, this type of OFP, could hinder your entrance into the USA. Not to mention that they own the condo you live in, and he/she can sell it to a friend for $1.00 tomorrow and you will be out.

Let it go. Go enjoy the holidays and let the laywers handle the details. Do you really want the State Department dragged into this? The USA is not looking to kindly on foreign people harassing it's citizens. And while Canada has historically been a friendly neighbor, there are tensions to their non-support of the war in Iraq. France is not the only country that is having difficulty with mounds of red tape getting goods into this country. Canada has also felt a cold shoulder, do you want your court needs mired in red tape? Harrassment charges against an American Citizen by a Foreigner will cause you alot of grief.

Just enjoy your daughter and move on. And for the record, your court fights are going to be long and drawn out. Some you will win, others you will lose. Get a grip and forget about it. That is what you pay the laywer for.

You can say that you care about the BS and her husband lying to her but if you cared why were you still talking to him? You knew he was deceiving his wife back then and you were a part of it.

If you did do that, you for sure would not get the bill paid by him. I know you said you just wanted to at the moment so it's best that you changed your mind.

Yes, the BS would want to know when her H was lying but NOT from you! She wants her H to be honest w/ her, NOT you. It would only make you look bad and you would start to look like a "typical" OW, lying, vindictive, only out for the $$$.

This would do nothing but intentionally inflict pain onto BS. It's not her fault he didn't pay the bill. If you wanted to try to manipulate someone to pay the bill, then contact him about it, or even better have your lawyer add it to the arrears of the CS or something. Or you can sue him for the $$ w/a lawyer.

But I would agree w/ everyone else to just leave well enough alone and move on. Just take it as a loss instead of trying to settle the score. I'm sure it will be just one of many unfair financial circumstances that you may find yourself in w/ this situation, from your POV.

Sounds like you are only considering sending her the bills, because MM didn't pay you as promised.

Sounds like spite to me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> You can say that you care about the BS and her husband lying to her but if you cared why were you still talking to him? You knew he was deceiving his wife back then and you were a part of it.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Excellent point, ktbunch. It takes two to tango, twilight, and you spent an awfully long time with him on the phone when you knew he was supposed to be NC/LC with you. Do you honestly think that his wife will say, "hey, she suddenly grew a conscience, so I'm only mad at H, not at her too"?

You clearly don't care about his wife and are only contemplating sending her the phone bill because you're vindictive and want to hurt him. It won't get the bill paid, and it'll only make them both (and him especially) intransigent. Don't waste your time or cheapen yourself further.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by twilight:
<strong>

oh and for anyone who thinks $500 is all I have paid for this mess you are truly blinded by hatred for the OW. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Hmmm....hatred for the OW...and "blinded" by it.

Twilight, when people are telling you their POV or revealing harsh truths to you, that does not necessarily translate automatically into "blind hatred for OW".

You are repectful here and basically a good kid and dealing with a lot of crap. While we understand this, don't get mad at us for telling you what we think when you come here to ask for our take on a certain subject. No one is trying to hurt you or embarrass you. Remember, you came here and asked for opinions.

Now, do you want to talk to ME about how much my H's OW has cost ME??? Personally?

In this hideous situation, we all get fuqued; but for Betrayeds, we end up dishing out thousands and thousands every month in CS...and it isn't even our kid! And the kid belongs to a virtual stranger who we never even knew about yet we end up suffering financially for what seems to be forever...and we didn't even do anything wrong. We didn't hurt the OW...she threw the first punch when she slept with a married man, and threw the second punch when she let herself get pregnant in this day and age of endless birth control. Then the demands come and the accusations and guilting...like any of this is our responsiblity.

So, if anyone is hard pressed to bemoan your $500, I think you would be able to udnerstand this. I would rather pay $500 ONCE than $1500 every single month for 18 years, be dragged into court for money judgments on fake arrears, pay attorneys to do what should be a given according to the law, and suffer the increible damages to our marriages, our homes, our families, our children etc, etc.

I don't mean to be hard on you, Twilight...not in the least. I just want you to compare your one time phone bill of calls to a man who is otherwise occupied with a wife and kids...(calls that should never have been made no matter what he said), to those of us paying outrageous child support simply because we are staying in our marriages at a great financial hardship to us for something we had no say in and nothing to do with.

I hope Hope is doing well and getting better day by day and that you will have a great Christmas in spite of the hardships you are enduring. I know it's been a frightening time for you these past few months and I hope the tide will turn for you soon.

Good luck and God bless.

Cat =^^=

<small>[ December 17, 2003, 11:15 PM: Message edited by: catnip ]</small>