I have a couple of questions regarding child support.

Did anyone go with H to the hearing? I think I know what the opinion may be around here but figured I'd ask anyway. Does anyone think I should go to the hearing w/H or that this would just hurt too much to be there?

I have never seen OW (once but she was a friend of SIL and it was a couple years ago so I have no real recollection). The hearing will take place a couple doors from my job ... Probably a bad idea that I should just forget about, right? I have not one fear whatsoever of he and she having anything between them in my absence, that is not a concern at all. Its just hard for me to sit back and wait for it to be over and wonder how many details H is leaving out that would concern me. (Men can be great for condensing stories to one sentence and forgetting other things that should be of interest!)

Also, do you think that it is absoutely necessary to bring a lawyer? Think they'll try to skin H without one? I said I would not get involved but how can I not-- H will probably muck things up and wind up paying double! I have many lawyer friends and will not be able to talk to any of them or get free counsel as I usually can so that stinks. H has no objection to paying and his intention is not to try to figure out a way to lie and deceive so he cheats OC out of support... but the OW is already claiming she does not have any income and H said she had a full time job. Most likely she is doing this now so her income is nothing.

My H does not have a support order for my 2 stepchildren anymore because we take such good care of them and provide amicably whatever they need and spend so much time with them. I think we can still prove via an out of court agreement (document which I can draw up and have notarized) that we pay loads of money for the two of them each month.

Did I mention how terrible this is? Maybe once or twice <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I have gone with and attended every single one of H hearings. I could not imagine NOT going. The first time was hard, having to see OW for first time and all. We spoke to her @ that time to ask about OC. (she said, "Nice to meet you" to me,the nerve!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> ) But we never talk to her any other time now.

I don't know what state your in but in CA you have to file an INCOME NAD EXPENSE declaration and somewhere on there it asks if you pay any other CS or alimony from any other relationship.

H can tell the judge that OW has a job and they will make her and H both "swear in" so if she lies that will be perjury. I have been told that sometimes it is better for MM if OW claims no income because then they can get H for daycare costs too. I don't know if its better or not but if there is daycare they will make H pay half PLUS the regular CS, they will not deduct it from the CS.

To prepare yourself, I would expect the worst possible case scenario and then add even more to it. That way you will not be disappointed.

H can also try to claim a "hardship" for his other children living @ home.

Without a lawyer the DA or whoever is in charge of prosecuting CS cases in your state, will most likely try to "steamroll" your H. Remember H is only a representative of "deadbeats" everywhere.

This has just been my experience in CA.

I would try as hard as possible to talk to your lawyer friends. Call in any favors or play the sympathy card, whatever, at least to get advice about what to expect and how to prepare yourselves.

Let me know how it goes. We have another CS hearing next week so I'm right there with ya'.

KT, let me just tell you that I have been reading everything on here, past and present, and your posts have been one of the sole most helpful and strength-giving to me.

You are a blessing to this site- and no matter how many may disagree with much of what you say, you are an instrumental force here. There is another woman on SI.com who was one of the sole sources for giving me hope in the beginning. It is amazing what a God send a stranger on a message board can be.

Thank you is all I can say.

You do not go into a court without a good attorney, well versed in the law. YOU GET AN ATTORNEY.

Example: Medical coverage for oc. OW and MM are each responsible for 50% of the medical. Not 80%, not 60%, 50%. So, you are sitting in court, and the judge informs your h that he has to provide medical insurance. Ok. You are now paying in excess of 50%.....get it. These little things happen all the time.

OW has a job. She needs daycare. She wants mm to pay for daycare. HOWEVER, she works 5 hours a day. Yet she is going to have child in daycare for 8????? NOPE. You would be liable for 2.5 hours of daycare. PLUS you will have rights to check the daycare center, and their records so they are not ripping you off. PLUS you can make sure that child is in a County approved care center, that keeps proper records. We made sure that oc was not at granmas with us paying.

Birth bills. if the birth was $10,000 MM would only be responsible for $5,000 Even if the ow had no insurance, whatever, she is still responsible for 50%.

It is much easier for the courts to just rush this through. Then you realize you are paying for the ONLY policy on this child, you are paying for more then 50% of the childcare, etc. SO a good attorney will look out for you from the get go.

Our ow actually thought that we would have to pay all the child care, since she was going back to work?????????? AHHHH NO. She had to pay half. The care provider was contacted by our attorney and told that records will be checked, her employers were notified that her time at work was going to be checked via court order. They were notified from the get go. If ow took a vacation we were not going to be paying that portion. Stuff like that.

These ow want a free ride. Don't give it to them.

FIGHT. Personally, I would rather pay a laywer to make sure we are not getting ripped off then pay the ow for anything. BE CAREFULL.

50% is 50%

I agree, KT you are a God send to me also! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Finding this board & other women to talk to, especially you, is definitely an example of how God puts people in place to help you through your journey.

You are such a blessing! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Thank you Lynn. Did you go to any of the proceedings or all of them with H?

I think I won't go. The lawyer- yes we will definitely do that. We at least have the next 2 months to make payments into him before the actual hearing.

Also ladies-- does H order the DNA test now or at this particular hearing? When does this happen? In my state the party who initiates the DNA has to pay for it if he is proven to be the father- did any of you experience this, and if so, I wonder when it has to be paid to the Court, as I know it costs at least $800.00. I will bet it is H's but just in case.

And Lynn, you are also an awesome force around here- don't want to forget you cause I read all of your posts too and they are super informative and helpful! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by LynnG:
<strong> You do not go into a court without a good attorney, well versed in the law. YOU GET AN ATTORNEY.

Example: Medical coverage for oc. OW and MM are each responsible for 50% of the medical. Not 80%, not 60%, 50%. So, you are sitting in court, and the judge informs your h that he has to provide medical insurance. Ok. You are now paying in excess of 50%.....get it. These little things happen all the time.

These ow want a free ride. Don't give it to them.

50% is 50% </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">LynnG. YOu are so right! You make such good points, thanks for reminding me!

Is the insurance thing like that for every state? I wonder. Here the DA said H had to put OC on his insurance and then the parents had to split the co-payments 50/50. Technically the order says that whoever has health insurance provided at little or no cost through their employer had to provide the child with coverage. Well, H job insurance is NOT at little or no cost and the DCSS sent letter to H job saying he HAD to provide health insurance no matter what! ??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> ???

Our lawyer told us we should call and talk to them...blah blah blah, not to let them bully us! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> (I thought that was what we hired her for!)

It was over $400 for the whole family, which we could not afford @ this time so only OC has health insurance all these months since H can go to jail for not providing for OC!
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YES YES YES, hire an attorney...a GOOD one. I think you get what you pay for. AND I think male attorneys are naturally more agressive (except if they are the DA prosecuting you) so I would say look for a male one.

Don't hesitate one minute for the DNA, no matter what the cost.

I have also read that it is a good idea to attend hearings before hand and watch to familiarize yourself with the courts and proceedings but if you have a good lawyer they should be preparing you for what to expect also.

Well please tell me this one!! My H is on my health insurance. I know our questionnaire that came with the CS papers asks for "all insurance policies MAINTAINED by Defendant" Well, I maintain it and it comes right from my paycheck.

I guess he will list none because he technically does not pay for it, I do. If I added the child to mine it would be extremely cheap, however, I will NOT call my office manager to make a change in coverage for baby!! I'd rather have H pay more than do something humiliating like that.

I went to every hearing, every meeting, especially when we were in front of the judge.

You need to fight for things. Dig into the law and use it. 50% is 50%. No way should the BW have to supply insurance for the oc. Hence the separation papers.

If the policy is through you, then technically your husband has no policy on his kids. So how does she get something from nothing?

LEARN THE LAW. DIG DIG DIG. The courts just love to blow by these cases. However, with a qualified attorney, his briefs alone to the court can save you money. Once again, using the insurance example. If the oc is getting child support, the child as presumed to be taken care of financially. As we get to the insurance, the ow is required to provide her share of the coverage. 50%. You think they can make the father buy a special policy for the oc? Guess what,they can force the ow to do the same. Get it? THAT is where a good laywer, nice library and a good staff will help out.

Our oc actully has better insurance with us then his mother. Ours pays 100% of our share of the bills. Had we not fought, that woman would haven never had to pay for an insurance policy.


I'm glad to help out here. I do not like to see people allow emotions to rule their hearts at such a traumatic time. Take care of business first then heal.

I also went to all court appearances with my H...
He was given Joint Physical Custdody w/51% of each week. Because of the close ratio of time, there was no Child Support ordered..

OW began needing childcare... we provided that in our home.. no DC costs... No cost to OW...
Documented the time...
OW began giving up more and more of "Her Time" and we continued to document.

When we went to court to modify custody, we had no attorney... I wish we had had one.. but our attorney went to work for DCS without informing us ...
BUT, because of the amount of Documentation that we were able to provide the Referee(didn't have a Judge) it showed him what OW was all about. He was surprised at the amount of time that H had agreed to allow OW to have Lil Bit...

We now are going to be dealing with the "other side" of the Child Support coin. H has had Primary Custody of Lil Bit since November, but OW has yet to offer to pay anything in lieu of CS... even though the Referee told her she was responsible to pay CS...

I agree with LynnG... We need to get a new one so that we can iron out all the loose details that need to be addressed... ie. Insurance and such...

Good luck.
Stacia

I tried to go with my H into the CS hearing at Domestic Relations but I was not permitted. Only our attorney and my H and the OW and her attorney were allowed. They specifically stated in all the p/w we received only parties directly involved, apparently being the W is not "directly"involved in my state. My attorney said that only the bio parents are allowed, reguardless, so I had to wait outside and hope that my H told me the truth.

I intended to go into the courtroom or anywhere else I was allowed because I wanted OW or whomever to know that hubby and I were together on the decisions. I wanted them to know that our relationship might go through tough times, but we were standing tall and supporting each other. But I also was not allowed into the hearings. I would like to think that it helped somewhat that I could sit (even outside waiting) with dignity and show ow that we were together still. We drove 750 miles several times to go to court. It was put off several times. Once her atty quit. Once was a no-show. Once we went to court, but judge threw it out because we had not petitioned ow's husband also. One thing after another. We went to request paternity testing and to request visitation. I worked hard at the paperwork (we had no lawyer). Finally the case was heard. And we were finally awarded half custody (but ended up getting the kids full-time because ow basically walked away; in two years we have had no contact with her.) Now if I had been the judge, I would have wanted to know a little about the family I was placing the kids with. Even if it was only going to be part-time. I would have said hey betrayed spouse how do you feel about contact with these other children? But nope, nobody said a word to me. Husband came out of the judge's chambers and said "I'm a father". I was shocked to say the least since we had not even had dna testing done and were only asking for visitation, but... Next thing I know we had two toddlers living in our home. It was hard to get used to...

Now two years later, hubby has abandoned me and our new baby and taken the kids with him. I'd give about anything to have the kids back.

I opted to not go to the Child Support Negotiations (what a crock...no negotiating, more like demands) with my h. I was originally going to go to show a united front and make sure she knew we were together, but I changed my mind. I'm having enough trouble with the movies in my head and simply do not want to put a face on her or the child. I saw a picture of OW & OC about a year ago but can't remember their faces (thought it was his friend and her baby, not his too). I was tortured over the first meeting. It was the first time the two of them had seen each other since before D-day, but I could tell he was tortured by it. In fact I realized letting him go by himself was the best thing I could have done. For most of our marriage I have cleaned up the messes. Well this one is resting squarely on his shoulders. For the second meeting (when he got the DNA results---which in TX are much cheaper if you wait and have them ordered by the attorney general's office...you only pay if it is positive and in our case it's under $150 vs. close to $500 had we done it ourselves), I again did not go, but this time I got smart and suggested he call ahead and ask that they be placed in separate offices which they did do. I have also not attended the meetings at his lawyers office, I write down my questions and send them with my h. So far I'm happy with this arrangement.

Add me to the list of people that have gone to every single hearing.
As far as paying a lawyer. I would rather pay a lawyer a thousand dollars than pay that woman one single penny that I did not have to.

***We made sure that oc was not at granmas with us paying. ***

A few weeks after the original cs order was put in place we got a call telling us the order had been modified to cover child care expense and hubby's half was $70.00 per week . Now trust me, in this area the VERY BEST child care only runs $65.00. We did a little digging and found out oc was staying with granma during the day.
Our attorney demanded receipts proving that OW was paying granma. OW was in a no win situation. If she insisted she WAS paying granma and granma was not listing this income on her taxes she was in deep sh#t with the IRS. Turns out ow was not paying granma and ow had to pay us back EVERY dime of that money because it was desiginated for daycare cost.
It was the greatest feeling. Hubby and I used that money to take a very nice cruise. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

<small>[ March 10, 2004, 03:27 PM: Message edited by: Jtigger ]</small>

Thank you all for your responses. I have decided there is NO WAY I want to go to the hearing. I would rather choke on a chicken bone right now than have to see OW or OC... just not ready for that. I don't want to see her face in my nightmares now that I am finally making progress! Besides, she knows we are together still, thanks to nosey big mouthed SIL of mine, so no need to go and show her we are together. It would only hurt me. And you are right, hurting in SA... I am always cleaning up his messes... he can go sit in this crappy court for 5 - 6 hours (in our county it is overcrowded and an all-day experience for a 10 minute hearing)

Also, I don't think H has to list any insurance information, as it states "insurance in which defendant MAINTAINS for himself or the child in question".. maintains = pays for. He is COVERED, but does not maintain it, so pooey, it aint getting listed.

Wonder at what point does the state ORDER the DNA, as opposed to it being requested?

I don't think H has to list his insurance at all, bei

Can anyone help?---

Anyway, here goes. My h has an oc that is 1 yr now. We have nc w/oc, and ow calls every now and then to ask for her money. H went to court w/ ow and was ordered to pay $500 or so. We were supposed to pay her until it started coming directly from his check but we have not been able to pay her all the time. We are really struggling with our 3 c, so he is in arrears.

H got a letter from the court the other day b/c ow filed a motion since cs hasn't been coming out of his check to her. H called his employer and they messed up so it will begin in a month they said. I have read a lot on MB about people filing for separations and making sure everything is in the w name before they go to court and I wish we had done it. The ow may take him back to court soon if she doesn't start getting some money soon--but we just don't have it!!!!

I went back to work after our 3rd child b/c we couldn't live off his income esp. w/ this cs, and I am beginning to resent him for all this pain. I am planning to go back to counseling, I stopped because I thought I could handle this alone. I am realizing again that I can't.

Well, my question is--is it too late to file for a separation now regarding cs, even though we are not planning on separating? Can this help if he has to go back to court regarding his arrears, or will they know something is up? I should have done it to begin with but I guess it was too much to deal with at the time-I think I believed that it would go away if I didn't do anything about it. I know that is not the case though, it was just wishful thinking.

I have said that I am going to stick by my h and continue working on our m and my healing, but it just seems to get harder. I just feel like me and the c are paying for something we had nothing to do with. We have to go w/o b/c of their indescretion.

Sorry to ramble but I had to vent, plus I thought someone might have some advice. Is it too late?