I want to address Sunnydale first....

I was at a point of quiting the fight about my H wanting to see oc...

H had moved home after a second seperation and I was so frail I was going to file for divorce. The mere thought of having oc here on weekends or whatever was wearing me down. Our son was grown and I couldn't imagine my weekends filled with ow's child and my H's child,

Still at first my H insisted. I acquiesced...reluctantly.

It was a total nightmare...lawyers....ow fighting with H over his cell phone at will...ow insisting I have nothing to do with anything...I was beside myself and about to leave this time for good.

My H gave up on the idea of having oc visit as ow was ruining his chances at a reconcilition with me. I had had enough and frankly Sunnydale you cannot pick or choose when oc comes to visit. It may well be when you want to be "just a family".

I will tell you I never would have stayed married if I had to have another womans child with my H here anytime.

My H reflects back and sees it as the most horrible time of his life. Now he'd never accept oc here as we have finally begun to live our life for ourselves.

We have sold our home and aren't sure where we are going. Our S DIL and Granddaughter have moved out this week and although sad...I have H alone again.

Be prepared Sunnydale....be prepared for the ride of your life....

Pops...I disagree...we sold because ow lives a 1/2 mile from here and has done everything in her power to disrupt our lives...while in Florida I asked H if we could sell...he agreed and we sold in 4 weeks!

We will be gone in 30 days far from this scene of the crime and it will help me so much you'll never know.

You wouldn't know because you will forever have the marriage perpertrator around to remind you...we will not.... I do not mean FH!

So you see it's a matter of different opinions and I want Sunnydale to know it won't be cool or easy.

love and prayers,
Debi

gem,,,,,,

<<<<<<Pops...I disagree...we sold because ow lives a 1/2 mile from here and has done everything in her power to disrupt our lives...while in Florida I asked H if we could sell...he agreed and we sold in 4 weeks!>>>>>>>

i understand that in your situation the ow is a cheesy pain in the a$$. that is not what the post to sunny was about. she is hoping that all can put their anger aside and work together.

i was hoping the same here but om nd fh seem to both be stubborn headed and have dislike towards for other. understandable.

moving to florida will be great for you since your ow is such a wacko. but the fact of the A will always be there. true or false.

it is thru forgiveness that you and h have been able to move forward.

<<<<<You wouldn't know because you will forever have the marriage perpertrator around to remind you...we will not.... I do not mean FH!>>>>>

i know exactly who you meant AND eactly what you are saying. when grace is gone for a visit with om it is easier for me to pay attention to fh.

the trouble we are having is that fh has such a hard time when grace is gone that she is not happy and can't manage to give me the attention i need in order to work on us. does that make sense?

just wanted to add that i too want to let sunny know the whole truth. and that the whole truth doesn't always have to be as dismal as some here portray it to be. it can work. it is posible. and YES it will take a lot of work and three adults who can find forgiveness for each other and empathy for what the others are going thru.

<small>[ May 20, 2004, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: pops ]</small>

Gem,
We never faught over contact. I told him from the start we would do contact. Believe me, I'm scared sometimes w/ all the stories. But everyones group (OW.BS.WS.OC.BC) have different personalities. We may be in the a like situations, but the way we need and do handle them are different. My H took a stand on ultra sound & delvery, and he is keeping his promise. If I could go, he would go. I am a part of this, didn't ask to be, but I am. If I have desided to stay M and stand along side of him, then I am a part too. I am the step mom, do not want to be mom, I know who it feels to have a child leave you E/O weekend. Everyone has the hurt they are dealing with, and having to get past. My situations is not as complexed as some, so if I am at a place that I will go on and I will give 100% and get control of my anger then I pray for the others to get there soon. As long as my H is standing up and being the H and man he should be then I will stand beside him. God doesn't want me to live w/ anger, rezentment, jealousy and unforgivness in my heart. He wants me to be close to him and so I have to over come those things before I can go on. I am not going to live in D-Day for the rest of my life. No one is perfect and I am sure one of us in my group will act a butt at one time or another, but we all have the hurt and anger to deal w. The OW knows that we are a team now and she has to go on. Yes she still has her hurt, anger, and hope she is learning to control it. And I will help by not adding to it. And praying that she can and will get over it. Forgiveness is not for a select few, but for all involved. My 2 cents ! And Gem Im sorry things worked out the way they did. But that was the way he wanted it ! We live learn and don't look back on the bad, you can't change anything, but your future something we should build on.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

Sunny~

Thanks for the wonderful picture of "acting like adults"! (and I don't mean because you chose C--that's neither here nor there--it's an attitude thing, not a C thing).

I believe what you posted, is what pops has in mind when he uses the phrase. You cannot control her, nor the circumstances, but you can control yourself. You've chosen to do that. Time will only tell if your ow will act like an adult, but I'm glad you're not waiting to find out before you decide how you're going to act. Looks like you are finding more and more peace as the days go by. Good for you!

Take good care.

~ad

Pops,
We are not moving to Florida although it was an idea... but you know with the kids here we just can't yet! Need a few more grey hairs! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Getting away from my location has eased my mind and my H's mind.

Ow does still show up around here and it's because we live so close.

I know you were just showing your side. See what I mean about the interference? Even when you and FH have alone time you guys can't get it together because Grace is gone and FH can't relax...and it will get better.. but how it delays you two meeting each others needs... <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> We simply do not have that stress to deal with, ya know?


Sunnydale I just see no reason to go together to the hospital. Stay away until DNA is done. Your H may be too involved with ow emotionally and that is dangerous.

I can understand your wanting to do what is right but he is the one that needs to make amends to you to show you he is never going to allow ow to come between you. You will look back one day and wonder why you went there. Together or not it shows support for ow, who at this point should be out of the equasion.

Please rethink what you are doing.

Blessings on future contact, really...just wait for the DNA is all.

If it should not be your H's child you will have gone through an agonizing time for not.

Prayers to you.
love
Debi

I agree w/ the DNA. She planned this so well, I hardly doubt its not his. I would like to see it and I will know also.I dont think us going to the hospital is supporting her. I think one look at this child and we will know if it is H. I know I have to have the mind set, if its not his, then I will be more than releaved, but if its his then we will have everything in place and not have to deal w/ the OW going thru all the emotions after childbirth. She should be better to deal w/ before than after. I want to do my part to see everything goes as smooth as it can. My H has been supportive and works at showing me most of the days that he is and wants to be MY husband a wants to be with ME and we grow old together.
I've met his needs better since and so has he. He doesn't think or want anything to come between us and he is showing me that also. Not everyday is perfect, but at least we love each other now when a year ago neither one of us loved one another. If it took this drastic measure for the lord to show is how much we indeed need and love each other, than we see it now. We will never forget the pain we caused each other. (Mine being before the A) And we will be forever changed.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

Sunny,

I am not by any means taking any sides here because I am to new at this and am lost myself, but I do know that C would not be an issue if it were me. I could not have my H with OW/OC at any time for any reason. I do not see a future in that especially because I already have a 13 yr old stepchild that we get only on weekends( from H's first marriage). It is hard enough on him because he loves us so much. It was hard enough for him to accept me when we got married and to accept our children when they were born. I know that he would just be a lost soul if he was to find out that his dad was about to have another child from another woman other than his stepmom (me). Plus we have toddlers who would not benefit from this either.

Just a thought - make sure that you are not being so supportive that you lose sioght of yourself and what you want from the marriage and the future. I don't think God meant for you to put all your desires and feelings aside while you focus on your H. H has to be able to accept you feelings and deires as well.

JT

gem,,,,,,,,

<<<<<<Getting away from my location has eased my mind and my H's mind.>>>>>>>>>

i felt like moving in the beginning also. the reason i didn't follow thru was that i wanted my kids to all finish thru the same school system.

my parenats moved us 3000 miles when i was in jr hs and i still remember how hard it was to meet new friends. since most of my kids were in jr hs or about to enter jr hs i decided to stay put.

JT2,
Nuff said....you are so in tune with what I am trying to say to Sunny.....run...do not walk to the nearest exit from the hospital/I wish some oldies would come on and let you know what you are in for with a H that would expect that from you!

Aw Pops...we are only moving about 20 minutes away...near MIL and BIL all who supported me from the git-go....

AND!!!! Down the street from our kids who are renting in an upscale neighborhood...exhausted from bidding every hour with the owners...they accepted at 8 pm...and we will move within 30 days!

Very ultra contemporary, lots of grey white and black!!!!

tread carefully Sunny...
Love
Debi

<small>[ May 20, 2004, 09:21 PM: Message edited by: gemini1 ]</small>

Sunnydale my H can't sign on as he doesn't have an e-mail account...However he is sitting here telling me what to tell you...

you are out of your mind to accompany your H anywhere near the hospital...

Your H wants both you and his oc....

H says it'll never work....

You need to planB here and if you don't hear from him you will know automatically you are out....
If he spends more time with ow and oc at your expense and he is not willing to do what it takes for you...then it may well be over....
this from someone who has been through it too...
H said you are headed for bad news.... You should not have to bargin...he either wants you or ow/oc

Prayers
love
Debi

<small>[ May 20, 2004, 11:16 PM: Message edited by: gemini1 ]</small>

Maybe I've given yall the wrong impression. He didn't ask me to go to the hospital. When the issue came up, I told him if he wanted to go then we would go. I would go w/ him. Not to see OW but just to see the baby. He would not force me or ask me to do something I didn't want to do. When we found out about the pg, he asked first what did I want to do. I told him I would never ask him to not have contact w/ his child. No one would tell me I couldn't have contact w/ my child. I would leave on my own like I said if I could not deal w/it. Maybe I'm crazy, but I do think about my self, but I also consider all involved. I know the OW doesn't consider my feelings, she probally never will. But I just cant be her or like her. Thats why my H is where he is now, he knows my heart is good and what kind of person I am. As for plan B, we did it first! from 2-03 til 11-03. He called everyday, he followed, cried, begged, bought gifts. I was so not happy in our M, and I left, no note, just left and never came home. He got served the next day. Yes he woke up, no he never though I would do it, but knows I will. I wasn't happy, neither was he. Was he cheating then? don't know, H said no. But during that time he was seeing his XW, which is the XOW. They dated and H also saw other people. I saw no one. I think he picked XW because he knew she would be the one that would piss me off the most, and it did. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> We started talking in 9-03 and moved in in 11-03. Now the A can in, in dec, "one last time thing" whatever. Has this been hard on me YES, Will we be together in a year, don't know. We have made a commitment to each other in jan and he has kepted it, and showed it. Do I think I'm doing the right thing, not really sure, am I doing what I feel in my heart YES! If in years it doesn't work, I can look back and honestly say I gave my 100% and no regrets. Do people think I have lost my mind, YES. But they have never been in my shoes. People here have and I cherish every word I hear here.
Am I doing what I think everyone should be doing, NO ! Depends on the people involved. Am I offended when people say don't do it, no. Like I said I want to know all the stories good or bad from the way I feel. Contact to me is going to take everyones effort. H is going to have to us first, I will be open to OW feelings (said open, not puting her first) and she will have to be open to mine, in order for this to work. Are we all going to have to comprimise, yes. Will the OW want to compramise, dont know yet. And if she doesn't then the contact will not work and I will have to make another choice, which I will. I don't want my childern to deal w/ a bunch of fighting, so I'm not going to have it. My H knows this, he knows she is not controlling my home or life. We will make previsions for the OC, and make him a part of our family, if he is H.
Thanks again for the information.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

Sunny, I wish you the very best. You are so kind and so thoughtfull. You truly do have a heart of gold. Your husband is lucky to have you.

I think what some of us are nervous about for you, is whos idea is it to be at the hospital? Does he want to be there? If so, I, along with a few others are seeing a great big pink elephant in the dining room. Has there been a conversation about where each of you WANT to be that day? Not where you think you should be.

Bless you sweetie.

I can't say that I want to be there w/ all of her people and stuff. But I know if I get a look at this child I will know in my heart if my H is the dad. Do you under stand? Did anyone else feel this way or am I being the physco? We talked about going on a cruise and still may go. OW has asked if H is going to be there. He told her in front of me face to face not if my wife cant come. Maybe this is his way of getting out of it? I don't think she will agree to it. We also have plans the weekend after due date and we are still going on w/ those plans. My H has only asked that me and her develope a talking relationship. He doesn't expect to to kiss her butt, but he knows nothing about a baby, NOTHING. And thats my fault. I didn't think he could do it right so I did most of the caring for the children. So if she has a question or something is funny about the baby she will have to talk to me. I think he is trying to get the contact thru me. That way my mind is eased about if she calls, what she wants when she does and that they are not talking "friendly". I would prefer contact to go through me. I am more apted to keep her on the OC conversation, than he would be. H still has reservations wheither I can do this situation, so many of our friends tell me I'm crazy and tell him hes lucky. And can't say deep down inside that I am 100% sure if I can. I know the lord will give me strenght when I need it. I also know when I am being taking advantage of. So H will indeed learn how to do alot of things for and with this child! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I promise you that. And Im not afraid to leave if something comes up or I'm being taken advantage of. I know I will be on this web site telling everyone, yes, we are making it work and the next day may be saying,give me strenght, they are making me crazy. I will be the hardest thing I have ever done and I am a stong independant woman. I make my own money, I can take care of me and mine, and just because I'm 40 don't mean I too old to find someone who will love me as god intended for me to be loved. This is just a chapter in my book of life and my "dash" on my tomb stone and I plan on living it to the fullest and be happy doing it. When the comes a time where I'm not happy, I will give H a chance to see if he wants to be the one to make me happy, if not, I will be fine.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

sunnydale

You have such a positive attitude, I believe you will be just fine. You also have a good chance of making this a posiive experience for your family.

It can be very frustrating on all sides, but when we try and keep positive alot can work out. Not every one can do this and most dont do it the way we do. But closer to how pops and full house handle it. It is hardest for children to handle it. But if the adults make it work the children will most likely follow their lead.

The hardest to overcome was learning to communicate with each other( I am speaking of bs and the ow/ with child. )That took us alot of conversations and alot of talking, sometimes pleasant sometimes not so pretty.

It took some give on my part, It took a great amount of patience on her part and i struggled with learning to co parent. Now after 3 plus years, things are relatively simple and pretty pleasant. We all enjoy our time with daughter, and we share every thing about that time with the other parent.
The bigest difference is om and i share more than most on here We make all decisions together and communicate almost daily about our daughter. how ever i think it would be ok for it to be less. He tends to be a little over protective with her, as his other children are 30 something and its been a while since he did this. But he does a good job, better than i expected and he makes sure he does all her care, he doesnt leave it up to his wife, which suprised me. Now considering the first time I let him take her for a few hours and cried my little eyes out. I am doing just great! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

The best part is that d feels she can love all of us and talk to any of us when ever she wants. If he has her and she wants to say good night, he calls and i do the same. I even call his wife if she ask to talk to her, and his wife is free to call here when ever she likes. If I am doing something special, I invite his wife to go. We also share b day parties, with grown kids and y kids. Every one enjoys it, and d doesnt have to worry about hurting any ones feelings or worn out because of two many parties.
We share time all holidays, and live close enough to make sure no one misses out. that doesnt mean we have christmas dinner together, just means we take turns in a way that every ones family is considered.

I hope you are dealing with a other who truly wants whats best for her child, be patient and dont give up too soon. It takes time, and dont let any one run over you. As hard as it is, if you show a litle respect to the mother, just because she is the childs mother, it will go a long way to working out something fair to every one. I am not saying be a door mat, I just mean show the same respect you would want other people to show you about your children. It eases some of the tension.

Good luck

well, sd, I hope it all works out exactly like you plan/want & hope for. I remember thinking just like you.

But I do have a serious question. You have said a few times now that if YOU can't handle it, you will NOT ask H for NC, you will LEAVE.

WHAT ABOUT YOUR D? So if YOU can't handle it, you will destruct HER family? That does not make any sense to me. Sorry.

H will have to make up his mind at that point. I will not ask him not to do N/C. But if he chooses that on his own then I will support that. I think it would be better for my D to have a stable, happy mother alone, than a mom that is stressed, depressed, and not happy. Like I stated if I can't do this I will be honest w/H. So if it comes to that then he will have to search his soul and do what he feels right in his heart. I dont think I will have problems unless the OW acts crazy. And I expect her to at first. But she should calm down and do what is right for her child and give him a chance to know his father and step mom. Most women wake up and see things for what they are. It may hurt, but if we show her that we are a team and we are going to make our M work and be a possitive part of the OC life then she should also try and be a possitive part.
But only time will tell and we live one day at a time. Some are good and some are so bad you want to give up, but tomorrow is a different day.
Happy Monday! Hope everyone had a good weekend!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

Sunny,
I meant to write to you earlier, and I am so sorry that I neglected to do so.

From what I have read, you seem to already have a firm grasp on the situation.
It sounds like you and your H are on the same page and you are both taking each other’s feelings about the situation into consideration.

I believe that you said your H has already told OW that there will be no C without your involvement. That in and of itself speaks volumes.
I also believe that you have experience being a stepmom? Though this situation is not the same as the “traditional” stepmom situation, it does help to have an idea how that works.

You have said that you would prefer that contact go through you.
The contact that we have with OW mainly goes through me. The hours that my H works make it difficult for him to be available during p/u and d/o. In the beginning he didn’t think I would be able to handle it…but he has since found that its easier for him and for me.
Even when we went to court for the custody change, OW commented that it was easier to deal with me than it was to deal with H.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> so many of our friends tell me I'm crazy and tell him hes lucky.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I can’t tell you how many people have said the same to us.

I truly believe you are capable of doing this, sunny.
Stay prepared for anything. As you know, situations can change in an instant.

Keep your positive attitude. Keep posting.

Stacia

Stacia, you have primary custody? And the mom has visitations? If you don't mind me asking how did that come about ? I know our OW is a fairly good mom to her other child, but what if she gets to acting all crazy ? How hard was it for you to get custody ? Just wandering.
Thanks for your info and support
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

Sunny,
The OW in our situation has a history of domestic violence and neglect. She has had 3 children. Her first child she gave up for adoption and the father stepped in and took him. OW has not seen the child since. Her 2nd child was beaten w/chain-link dog leash at the age of 4. He was removed from her custody, due to failure to protect him. OW blamed it on her exBF.
Knowing her history we were very concerned for the safety of the baby. H filed to establish paternity and legitimate the baby prior to her birth.
We began watching Lil Bit for OW while she worked. She was leaving the baby filthy on a daily basis. (see a little background...) H had enough and called DCS. Thus began our custody battle… and the baby was only about 2 months old at that time.
After Lil Bit turned 2, OW began calling and saying she couldn’t pick her up… She was moving… She left Lil Bit with us from July 23rd to Oct 12th, seeing her only 6 hours on the 14th of September.
When we went to court in November we took along the documentation of all the time we had spent with Lil Bit… times that OW gave up her time with her… It was enough to convince the Referee that OW was unstable. The custody change and visitation change was agreed upon by all 3 of us, OW, H & me. OW was the first to have her pen ready to sign the agreement.

The old saying, “Give ‘em enough rope and they’ll hang themselves” is what we did. Knowing she would eventually do something big enough to convince the courts, we just kept documentation.

Apart from obvious abuse & neglect it is hard to take away custody from a parent, mother or father, w/o their consent.

Including stacias's I have known of a total of 2 cases where the father gained full custody of the child. The other is IRL & the mother was a drug addict, this was not an OC from A but OC from before marriage and father began his relationship w/ daughter @ 4 yo.

Because it is so hard, is what kept OW from revoking joint custody from my H but she wanted to & tried, just to have "control", but there was no grounds for it.

Minus any abuse, joint custody is best, IMO.