hi Luv,

I am so sorry for your pain. I know I am living in fantasy land now. We have not talked about other woman for a week. I just cannot bring myself to discuss. I want to wait and see what happens. Husband is treating me better since I am not talking about other woman. I know before end of year I will know if we will be together or no.

Luv,

How are you today? I think you are doing the best thing you can right now by moving, if H won't leave what other choice do you have.?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I really see LynnG's point about how C does not work. But there are others here who are doing it with success. However, the HUGE difference it their H was willing to see the damage he did to the M, the trust, the BS emotions and was willing to make amends for that while still maintaing contact with their child. I truly think I could have done it, had he just given me the slightest bit of consideration. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">That speaks volumes, until he is willing to do all those things C will not work, I am living that right now, & it is another road you don't want to travel. The only way C will work is if you and your H are operating thru POJA, your H sounds like mine, with the I am not leaving, mine will have to if the C issue is not resolved by the end of the summer. I do admire you for your willingness to do whatever it takes to save your M, most BW's wont have anything to do w/ OC & I can understand why.

It is sad that your H won't see what he is about to lose, as I said though maybe this will be his wake up call. Since you can't leave until mid July, maybe you can do the 180's & then PB once you are in your apt. It is a risk I know but what other alternative is he leaving you with?

To me Plan B is like the drug addicts "rock bottom" once a person hits that they decide to change, you don't know what his change will be if you do this, but at any rate YOU move on, which you have to do for your sake & your childrens.

Take care.

I think I am about to disappoint everyone. I told H I was leaving on the 14th and he said I can understand you need to leave, this is a difficult situation and I don't blame you. Not really the response I was hoping for.

Anyway, we talke almost all day on Saturday and I think we are communicating a little bit better. I probably and being way to easy on him. I am however, not ruling out leaving, I am just waiting to see if things go better. If we can come to some agreement on these issues.

He did do one thing that I liked, he tore up the picture. Not a big thing but a little step. I also asked him to keep his visits to 1 1/2 - 2 hours and he has been home on the dot.

I can always leave but I think I am only partially ready. I cried all night after I told him I was leaving. It may come in the next few months or it may not. We may figure it out or we may not. This is all new to us and I think we are finding our way. I also figure, even if I D him, our kids will still be affected by OC so it might be better if I am there too. I want to protect them but if we D, that protection lessens. I am not saying that in the long run that might not be the best solution for them and for me. I am just saying that I am still mulling it over and ALL these and many more issues fill me pea sized brain. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Luv,

I can only speak for me & I am not disappointed, honey you have to follow YOUR heart. If you are not ready then don't leave, stick it out as long as you can & see what happens. The day I Plan B will be the day I know without a doubt that I have done ALL I can to save my M.

You & only you will know when you've had enough.
And who is to say things can't still turn around for you! I am praying they do.

Keep us posted.

LMF~

I'm here to support you--not disappointed--I myself can't quite do PB yet either as well as BBYG--I'm just not ready and as BBYG said I want to know that I have done everything else I could do before I PB but I feel that I'm getting nearer PB.

I'm anxious and I'm sure H is that OC is nearly here--right now OC child doesn't concern me in way because H and I aren't together at the moment but it does because I wanted to be in recovery by the time it got here.

So I just want to say I'm here for you and I completely understand not being ready for PB.

Maybe then, I am disappointed in myself. When am I going to finally say enough. Geez ladies, I have been on this roller coaster for three years now. WHAT IS WRONG WITH ME!!!! I can't possibly love this man that much. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

My head is telling me to just leave but my heart is still hanging on. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="images/icons/blush.gif" /> When H and I were talking, he said the same thing. It actually made me feel better, at least his heart want's to be with me and still loves me. We both know why are head is telling us to give up. It's just been such a long haul, mabye it can't be repaired, maybe we are fooling ourselves. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I guess only God knows for sure.

Hi luv,

I feel your pain but I still think he should bring the other child home to visit. I do not think I could tolerate my man visiting with other woman for one and a half to two hours. My other woman is in another state. I am sure now. However he has been calling her almost every day. I found this out from cell phone detail. So now I guess he is not having physical affair but still having emotional affair. I think I am about ready to call it quits unless something changes. I just need to get some unfinished business completed before I leave. I do not want to leave either because I love him but I am tired of being walked on. I just hope you can be strong if you become unhappy. You do not have to be unhappy.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It's just been such a long haul, mabye it can't be repaired, maybe we are fooling ourselves.

I guess only God knows for sure. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know exactly how you feel, but God is the only one who knows, so pray & keep standing, GOD will work this out for our good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Wish I could tell you how & when.

I am not dissapointed in you at all. It is your marriage and you need to do what works best for you. You can be nice, and talk things out, and still have your line in the sand. If he is talking to you about issues that matter to you and your marriage, that is good communication. If he is talking about the ow/oc, walk away from him. Let him SEE the pain he has created. He has made a mess and he has to SEE and FEEL the damage he has done.

Don't ever feel bad for what your feelings are. You are in a nightmare and there are no clear cut, right-wrong answers to what YOU want with YOUR life.

LUV we are here to support you. You and only you and your H know weither your M can be saved. We don't want you to D out of anger, ect. It's really something that is hard to do. ANd your kids are also involved so much more than they want to be too. I'm glad you are doing better. You and H need to work out all the details to what make ya'll happy and whole. It's hard and we are here to listen and cry w/u ! I wish you all the luck in the world for your M. If you two want and work at it it will be worth it in the long run.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> sunny

My one friend that works with me asked how it was going. I gave her the run down that I am starting to change my mind about moving out. She said you were so adamant about it last week. I said yes but we talked and I want to see how it goes for awhile. She said that she was disappointed in me. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

She asked what am I going to tell the kids. I said that I have no idea but that I was worried about that. I also told her that I felt not having to deal with a divorce and OC would be better for them. She said but at least they would understand why the D and that the OC might make more sense. I have no idea what to think.
I know I should see my C this week but at $90 a pop, it's tight.

My H and I talked, he seemed very honest about what goes on while he is there. He said all he does is hold the baby. He said that when he does that she sleeps. He said that he does not feel anything for her, that it's just like they are doing what needs to be done for the baby. As much as he has lied to me in the past, this did not get me in the gut like he was lieing. Am I stupid for believing him?

My friend does not think I will be able to deal with the OC when it comes for visits. I don't think I will have a problem with it. I only worry about my children. KB and others, how did you do it? Was it difficult? I actually want to meet OC, I can't wait.

Lynn our conversations were about us most of the time and how we feel and what we feel we can/can't do. I did ask about OC because I truly want to know. I asked about OW in reference to some of my concerns, i.e. feelings he may have etc. All in all, I think it was a very productive weekend. I would still like to start MC but he is so against it. I told him to find someone and he seemed to be open to that.

One of the things I realized is that a family does not have to "look" like the typical family in order to be happy and to work. So, we are different, big deal. We can be happy being different, right? If we are, that is all that matters.

The other thing that keeps haunting me is "Am I doing damage to my children?" "Have I already damaged them?" I worry a lot about that. However, if that is the case, then anyone who chooses C would be in the same boat, correct? And we know from experience that is not true. Don't we?

Just rambling on a bit. Thanks so much for your support.

Well, every MOTHER is afraid of 'doing damage' to their kids. In this case, I take no responsibility for any 'damage' or long lasting affects this may have on my kids.

If there comes a day, H will have to face it all. I only hope for the best & know that I am doing right by my kids now & trying to teach them the tools they will need to face the more challenging aspects of their lives on their own.

SO don't feel guilty about that.

You are right in thinking that you will not be able to have as much control over their environment if you D. That is a good enough reason I think.

Don't let any one else's opinions sway you (not even ours) if you feel like your doing the right thing. How will you ever know unless you try?

That is a very good step & good sign that H is keeping his word about being home in a timely manner. I would still start to be a part of it, either going w/ him (if you could handle that) or bringing baby to your home. tere is no reason not to do that.
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If you are referring to me 'handling it', I am still w/ Lynng that it just should NOT be done.

Here's a news flash: Oldest son has been getting these 'headaches' and 'feeling sick' (sometimes throws up) every so often, just dawned on me that 'every so often' is every time we are going to p/u OC!

I think some changes are about to be made in the next few weeks, @ least I hope. My son is 11.5 yo and only weighs 63 lbs. as it is. I can't afford to have him losing his appetite and/or vomiting 'every so often'. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />
**********
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Not every family/child will react this way but I regret taking this risk.

**********
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This entire situation is so JACKED up! IT is so unfair for every person involved & I am so angry that all of us have to deal w/ this selfish crap because 2 selfish people didn't have the decency or even the self-control to WALK AWAY! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

LMF~

I understand the disappointment thing with yourself--I struggle with that because my head says leave and get out before things get worsebecause as time has shown he keeps messing up and my heart just can't/won't let go.

Try as I might can't keep thinking about how H came back after OW was w/OC and no one forced him too--I just keep thinking that he is too scared to deal with this and it is easier just to be done--almost like he can't face me everyday knowing what he has done and easier to run from the problem but we all know they will catch up with you at some point.

You are a very strong women LMF--hang tough girl!

LMF,

I'm an oldie who rarely posts anymore. I believed in contact but in my case it did not work exOW was totally psycho you can look up some of my old posts if you would like. It affected my then 9 year old child a lot. To the point that he still has issues from trying contact and exOW antics. Things are going OW's way so she's going to try and act civil please realize as soon as she knows your H is really trying to commit to your family all heck is going to break loose.

I just wanted you to know no one can judge you. But please do what it takes to protect your children. In my state you can still live with your spouse and collect CS. Even if you decide not to move out protect your children by getting a support order first. September will be 4 years for me I still have my ups and downs dealing with triggers etc.. The reason why my marriage worked was H was willing to do anything to save our marriage and I tried to be reasonable but I would not allow him to walk over me. H visiting OC alone with just exOW in the house was not an option in my case. I could not deal with them looking like a little family when me and my children were his family. OC is his child but exOW is nothing to him.

I used to be upset that exOW was nothing to him but an on and off booty call relationship per her. But I'm glad he had no emotional ties to her. Granted after finding out about the affair I filed for a D the next day and was ready to serve him by the end of the week. I think that sort of scared him straight. lol (I can laugh about it now) Be strong for you and your family if you allow him to get away with being alone with her the affair will rekindle. Right now she can't have sex but eventually she will. I know that me and my H laying side by side watching the baby made us closer and fall more in love as we watched that beautiful child we created. Do not allow him to share those intimate moments with OW. The child is here and if he wants to be a father I have no problem with that but the affair was their dirty little secret now that it's out in the open I feel a BS has a right to be a part of everything that goes on. You did not ask for this they pulled you in the middle of the affair by being careless. Good luck and do not let him sway you and remember people in affairs lie.

You and your family are in my thoughts and prayers you may have to get counseling for your little boy. I talked to my son's school counselor I wasn't embarrassed I did nothing to be ashamed of. I put my children first and if talking to her helped my son I did it and it allowed him to have a safe place to vent. Something to think about.


Unsure

<small>[ June 01, 2004, 11:01 PM: Message edited by: UNSure919400 ]</small>

Hi LuvMyFamily,

I really feel for you and can understand the strong love you feel for your husband because I feel that same love for my husband. I finally got the dirt on him that he is calling other woman almost every day. We got into a discussion. Mostly him talking. He told me all the stuff he did not like about me. We got into needs and he said I was nagging because I asked for more affection. From there I told him how I posted on this board trying to find out what was wrong with our relationship. Then he asked about what I was posting and how people responded, so I told him. He asked about how people responded about the baby and I told him that they said that Him and I should see the baby as a couple. I told him that he should be a man and tell her grow up and accept me for the baby's sake. He told me he tried to talk to other woman about that but that she hates me and does not want me to touch her child. I know I would love her child as my own because my husband wanted a baby and I could not give him one because my tubes were tied. I had suggested adopting a child but he wanted a baby naturally. He also thinks it is OK to go to delivery. I told him to fight for parental rights. He said he can't because he lost his other kids. I told him that she is manipulating him. He agreed. I told him I knew he was calling her almost every day. I said, do not deny it because I got proof in black and white. I told him I had the proof at work. He confessed and told me he was calling her because she relapsed on drugs and he was concerned about the baby and that he is trying to get her to give him the baby if she is going to choose to destroy her life with drugs. He did seem honest. He did get angry with me because I hit home. I left the house and went in the yard for five minutes and came back in and went to bed with him. I think he feels better for being honest and I feel better. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I said all this to say this. You need to put your foot down. Other woman is manipulating your husband. He needs to be a man and tell her that she needs to accept you. He needs to bring the baby to your house for visitation. He is making you look bad. Nobody knows what your husband and other woman might do alone in a house. Maybe he is honest now but it will put too much stress on you to continue and it is not fair to you or your children. If he brings the baby home he can spend time with baby, you, and his children by you. You can all bond together versus him bonding with other woman. Show him my post. He needs to wake up and see the pain he is causing you and your children. He needs to be a man and put his foot down.

Genia - I am sorry to hear that your H continues to call OW. I hope he starts to be honest with you and that the two of you can work it out.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He told me he tried to talk to other woman about that but that she hates me and does not want me to touch her child. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I hear the same thing. Makes me laugh, they hate us. I can't figure out that one. What in the heck did we do to them. My other thought is that is what you get for messing around with a married man.

We both think the baby is too young to come to our house right now, she is only a week old. I figured when she is three months and in day care but maybe it could be sooner.

Unsure,
Thanks for posting, espec. since you don't post anymore.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Things are going OW's way so she's going to try and act civil please realize as soon as she knows your H is really trying to commit to your family all heck is going to break loose.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know this can happen and this might sound strange but I hope it does. I hope she acts like the idiot she is and my H wakes up. He woke up when he first found out but now, he is sleeping again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> In my state you can still live with your spouse and collect CS </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I spoke with my atty and she never mentioned that. Maybe I did not phrase the question the right way. What state are you in?

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The reason why my marriage worked was H was willing to do anything to save our marriage and I tried to be reasonable but I would not allow him to walk over me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">There are two big differences right there. One, my H is not trying to do ANYTYING to save the M. He just want's to do what's easy for him. Two, I think I do allow him to walk all over me.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> H visiting OC alone with just exOW in the house was not an option in my case. I could not deal with them looking like a little family when me and my children were his family. OC is his child but exOW is nothing to him.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is exactly what I told my H. However, all he cares about is seeing his child. He said that he misses her. I almost find that hard to believe, since I don't think he ever missed our kids that much and I still don't think he does.

My big risk is that my H does have/had emotional ties to OW. This was a long standing A and developed into a relationship.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">if you allow him to get away with being alone with her the affair will rekindle. Right now she can't have sex but eventually she will. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This is what I tell him. He says "no way it won't happen." But I just don't see how that is possible, for the same reasons you stated... </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I know that me and my H laying side by side watching the baby made us closer and fall more in love as we watched that beautiful child we created. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He says that all he does is hold the baby and she will either sleep or do her things around the apt. My stomach is turning just thinking about it.

I know that people in A's lie and I have created a situation where he can have an A and be telling a truth about why he is there. The more I think about it, the more I think I have set myself up for a huge fall.

I am starting to feel like I need to move again. I hate this so bad, I just want it to all go away. Why can he be the selfish one and I am left dealing with it! He should be the one dealing with his selfishness! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I know, because I am letting him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">The more I think about it, the more I think I have set myself up for a huge fall.

I am starting to feel like I need to move again. I hate this so bad, I just want it to all go away. Why can he be the selfish one and I am left dealing with it! He should be the one dealing with his selfishness! I know, because I am letting him. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Luv,

Your H sounds so much like mine, & reading some of the posts especially Unsure's I feel the same way you do, why am I even giving him til the end of the summer??? My H did all those things Unsure spoke of he lived w/ OW for the first 7 months of his daughters life, they both told me the PA was over after the baby was born but who knows - He lived there!!!! Even now he says he sees the baby at day care everyday & not at OW's house & I have not seen her since Feb., last time she was at our home. I am so sick of this all, I know the ups & downs of this, I say I am done one week & the next I am committed to trying to work it out. So as far as your friend being disappointed until she has lived the nitemare you are in right now, she should be quiet.

Luv don't let this "visitation" at OW's house continue, it opens to many doors & sets a tone for this situation to follow that leaves you out, I should have never let this situation in my M get so out of hand, these wanna be homewreckers have the nerve to express their wishes about who can be around OC, & some of these dumb H's listen to it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Like Genia said he needs to put his foot down w/ OW now, I told my H this when he came home & he hasn't done it yet, I don't know why I am still in this mess, please don't follow in my footsteps. If you want C with OC & H does too, you two have to work together to make that happen, let OW know it is about you & your H & your family, not her & your H & the "fake family" she has tried to make. If OW wants OC to see her daddy OC has to see step mommy too, that is the bottom line.

Hello, I'm just reading on this section of the boards but maybe the baby is a little too young to visit in your home now, but have you suggested visiting the OC with your husband when he goes? I may have missed that somewhere. Since your husband says all the OW does is sleep or clean up around the apartment when he is there, even if she "hates" you, if she is sleeping, she should have no problem with you visiting as well. She must know that since she had a baby with a married man who wants contact that the wife would be involved also. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> Sorry if I seem naiive about the situation. My fiance and I are not married yet because he got deployed, so I have only posted on the Premarriage and the Early Years section but I like to read everywhere. I am so sorry you are going through this <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> I can not imagine the emotions I would feel if I were in this situation. Well, yes I can and you'd probably be seeing my trial on court tv. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Luv,

If it were me I would definately stop the visits without you. That does leave the door open for anaything to happen. It also gives the OW the impression that she can play family whenever she feels like it. It gives her control over the situation. H is not likely going to agree to this, so you might have to go on and make the move to show him that you want to be happy with your life.

Just a thought!

JT

JT2, I agree with everything you say... </font>

• <font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">the visits should not continue on without me.
  It leaves the door open
  Gives OW the control
  H won't agee with that
  I need to make my move to prove a point</font></li>

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">
I think Casey is correct too. The baby is just too young to come over to our place. I can't figure out how to satisfy his desire to see his D and my desire for him not to be around OW. Someone suggested my going there, which I also suggested and it was met with disapproval. The other obstacle is our children. If I would go over there, what do I do with them? I can't always ask someone to watch them.

BabyGirl - I feel for you too. What state are you in? Maybe we can team up and leave together. LOL.

Got a meeting now, and the need to leave early. I will respond to you again, BG.

Thanks Everyone
MJ