Well I was okay last night when the kids and I got home at about 10:20pm my H and stepson where here. We have stepson this weekend. H did not stay at Home even with him here this is the second time he's done this. I do not want to tell him to keep him with him since it is really his time to spend with him,but that's how I feel. I did not LB and did not call him however when I got up this morning I cl=alled him to ask him about it and his phone was turned off. So I called our shop and asked for him and I swear I believe that OW answered my phone. He was not in yet but I immediately got fumed.

I could not control it and called back to talk to one other operator and they claimed that they did not know who this person was that answered the phone. I find that strange? I am torn up and I called an hour later and got him and just asked him but of course would he ever tell me the truth? I am fuming still and have lost my mind. I do not think that this is worth all this pain. I am the only one hurting here - he is gone on about his business. I am tired of the back and forth until I just want to let it all go. It will never seem to get any better!!


I am soooooo stuuupiddd for thinking that I coul;d have a happy life with this man. I get tired of feeling lost and alone. I have no support other that you guys. I am tired and feel like my friends are tired of talking about it. Sometimes they don't even answer my call. Is it worth this type of agony. I just don't know!!!


what am I doing?

JT

I'm here for ya' girl!

Could it be a little paranoia? Friends not answering your call? Maybe they are not really home?

ANYWAY.........it does NOT matter.......TAKE A DEEP BREATHE!

Is there anyway for you to go to the shop & see for yourself?

How could the operators not know who answers the phone?
************

Listen to me......if it was HER.........so WHAT? He is YOUR H! Let's think this all out.

What if it WAS STOW? What business would she really have there? AND..if it was STOW.......how do you think she would like to know about H spending how many nights w/ you this week?

See how she handles that? NO woman likes to be 'betrayed'....OW or W!
***************

For sanity's sake why don't you go over there & see for yourself? What do you have to lose?

We are hear for you. It takes some really devoted friends to endure something like this w/ you when they really don't understand. It's scary for them becuase I know they are thinking....dang if it could happen to them, it could happen to us! And no one wants that.
*********
Where do you live? what state I mean, no need to get specific. I just wish there was a better/faster way to get the support you need.....you could email me directly or call me if you wanted in this kind of ......... situation when you are so fumed & need some immediate & clear direction.

What do you think?
*******
Hang in there hunny bunny!

Now think rationally. IT could have been someone else but since his phone was off your mind jsut jumps straight to that......that is the more likely thing.

Take deep breaths......write it out here so you do not go over the edge.

Why doesn't H want to take son? Why isn't he spending time w/ him? What does ss think of all this?

KT,

I did not go to the shop because I would have strangled her if it was her. Plus I do not even knoe what she looks like. I have only spoken with her over the phone and it sounded like her. I would love to call you or email you. I live in ALABAMA. Bet you couldn't tell that huh! I do not have the southern draw because I am not originally from here.

H usually stays the night with us when SS is here but the past time he did not. I don't think SS really knows what is going on But this is his only stable family so I don't make him take him with him even though it angers me to no end. But hey, he leaves the rest of the children as well so what's the difference.

The only reason I did not go to the shop was because I would have smacked her one and caught a case. Which would have not helped my family, plus I own the business so it would have looked bad. But I did of course call and rant and rave to him which did not help the cause any. Oh KT I am a lost cause and I don't know if he really loves me enough to help me throuhg this or even for us to go on past it. I don't even know if i can really forgive him and let go of the anger. I have not as of yet and look what it's doing to me? I can not find peace anywhere. I hate this whole thing and have no where to turn.

JT

You need to see her in person. PERIOD. Do you know her name? If so, hire an detective and get a photo of her. You need stand up a bit taller in your boots and check this woman out a bit.

Now, you say you are part owner of the shop and your own employees are not telling you? Does the word FIRED come to mind here? I swear, if one of our employees had the gall to say they had no idea of who answered the phone, or were in anyway shape or form lying to me, they would be fired on the spot. This is YOUR company. You get your butt down there and start evaluating all positions, who does what, etc. Then have a staff meeting and make dang sure they know their job descriptions. If Suzie Q is supposed to be answering the phone, and she doesn't, and has no clue as to who answered it????? She would be fired on the spot.

Why would OW be at your company in the first place? STAND UP FOR YOURSELF. Even if she works there, you can play some games with her. Have her sign an affadavit stating that the relationship was consensual, etc. GET A LAYWER HERE. Then, after that is signed (have your H get her to sign, he can "toy" with her to get her to do so), you can start hammering her. If she even looks at you wrong, or says a word, you can fire her too. THIS IS YOURS TOO. FIGHT BACK.

Overall, if one of my employees ever lied to me or played in this game with the husband, they would be fired on the spot. Then I would hire a "mole" who would report to me about going on. Nothing wrong with that.

You probably are paranoid right now. Stop it. People here will listen to you and really do care about you and what you are going through. Maybe your friends are tired of hearing about it. Lucky for them, they don't know of the ups and downs of a life like this. We do. We have been there and want to help you. It is with respect and understanding that we have for you that allows us to NEVER EVER get frustrated with you, or sick of it, or whatever. We have lived it and are here for you. So while you may feel paranoid of your real life friends, know that many of us cyber friends will be here. So vent away.

This is strictly my opinion for whatever it's worth. (and by the way, my ex-WS had his children over to our home Christmas day and left to lead an AA/NA group "because nobody else was available" I suggested someone who would have no family contact that day would have been a better choice to lead the meeting. It made me sick to see the faces of his two children when he left for the meeting. The normal one hour meeting somehow lasted for four hours...Later found out he and the OW met in AA/NA and and were viewed as a "couple".)While I admire your concern for your SS, your family really is not "stable" at this time.. maybe more stable than his other family, but still unstable. If your WS is allowed to have no consequences for leaving his son during a visit, you may not be helping this child in the long run. It sort of "rescues and enables" your WS in continuing with this behavior. It's a thin line between not wanting to hurt SS in the short run, and perhaps doing him more damage in the long run if his dad's behavior is allowed to continue with no consequences. What kind of message does the SS get now about his importance to his father?

JT2, my dear please take a deep breath.

I am not sure what to tell you or if I am even on the right track. First, you need to sit down with your H and tell him what you feel/think. You need to tell him that it is not fair to SS if he is not there while he is there for visits. Maybe even suggest that if E-wife finds out, she could go back to Court and have SS visitation modified. He needs to understand that he is hurting more people in this than just you.

Ask him point blank if he wants his M. If he says yes then tell him you need help to make it work. You need him to be honest with you. Maybe even ask him to see a picture of OW. Ask him if she was at the business.

I don't know what your business is or how much time you already spend there but I would suggest spending more time there if you can. Maybe you can even snoop around when H is not there. You never know what you might find.

Dear JT2, you are in my thoughts and prayers. You will be fine, stay strong.

Well today is a new day. I have decided that I am not geting better about this so I have made a decision to just let it go. By letting it go I mean I am not going to worry my slef anymore about it. I am going to enjoy my kids and my life. I am not going to be responsible for anyone but mysefl.. I am not going to qeustion ym husband nor will I live like I am waiting on him to come home. I will do what I want, when I want, where I want, and with whom I want.

I keep acting as if I have to report to him, scared of staying out too late or even taking the kids away for the weekend without consulting him. I do not have to do it and I am going to stop it. How would he feel if he could not get in touch with us? Some of it might be out of spite but I am tired of waiting. I know that I have contributed to the problem of not getting back together, but I have done it out of fear of what could happen? I have to get past that and take control of my life, I am tired of my kids seeing me so down and uncertain of our future as a family. No matter what happens I will love my kids and moveon for them. They deserve better than what they are getting and I should be blessed just to have them.

I have been running every since we got married. At first in the marriage we lost a child and I found out my mother was terminal with cancer, so when we would fight I would always run home like a little girl. I left after on argument and took everything I brought into the marriage ( furniture,etc.) We have been apart more that we have been together. I am more fearful of OW?OC because I know that I did not let my H be close to me and the kis(babies at that crucial time. I always did what I wanted to do and expected him to just deal with it. Now I guess I am getting what I dished out back on me. I admit that I was wrong, but how will we ever get better if he does not forgive either. This is just to much so ladies I will be going and thanks for everything. I am my biggest problem so I need to be better and not worry and just move on.

The funny thing is that there are people (men) that I know that are interested in me. My H thinks that he is the only one that is desireable, well he is wrong. I am still s loving and wonderful person - I just don't want to be hurt. And I have shielded or at least tried to shield myself from pain (strictly from men I'v been involved with). I feel like I should be this though person that does not need anyone. My biggest fear is now the one that I live with daily.

I do not want to be this way so - if he leaves then he does - life will go on I guess. The alternative has to be better than what I am living with and what my kids are going through.

The buck stops here - Right now. I will not be a victim any longer!!!

JT

I am responding to both your posts in this one.

If you are a LOSER........then we ALL are because we have ALL been there. ALl those questions you have are the same ones we have all had at different times & some STILL do have. They are reasonable because the answers affect your life & future.

Yes, it would be good if you could let go a bit but that does not mean that you need to give up.

STAND UP FOR YOURSELF like Lynng said.

Don't give up out of sheer tiredness. Some things you can let go of and it will allow you some relief. Focus on putting your energy where it will be the most effective & productive & into what is REALLY important to you.

Let the rest all fall away.

No I would not have thought you were so far away from me! (CA) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

<small>[ July 07, 2004, 12:39 PM: Message edited by: ktbunch ]</small>

KT,

I am sorry I am responding so late to your post. Thanks for always answering when I need you. I appreciate it so and since I value and admire you the advice is taken to heart eventhough it is tough for me to put into action right now. I am lost. I went through H briefcase when he came over tonight of course I found a picture of her. She is a pretty girl - woman just a little (how can I put this and be polite) raunchy for me. I would not think she would be my H type. But petite as I thought she would be. So how do you compete with that? I should not have too. Her place is where the photo was taken and I must say if that is what he choses then he went from diamonds to CZ's - riches to rags.

I am better educated, financially stable, if you want to be materialistic I have a fabulous newly built home while she is living in an apartment with her three kids. If that is what he wants then he definately does not need to be with me.

My heart is in such bad shape that it does not even matter that she has nothing it's the point that she had my H and might be carrying his child.

It will never be over will it? I will never have the M and H that I want and deserve. Why doesn't he just go on and leave us alone. Why dosen't he just get out. I feel as though I should. I feel like the card I found tonight from her was given after I found out about the baby - which means that he is still in contact with her or living with her. I do not know for sure he tells me no but hey he's been good at lying all this time why stop now.

I do not want to be the only person here that wants this family intact without interuption. It amazes me how people hurt people with no regard for the future or the consequences of their actions.

KT their is no end and no such thing as everlasting love is there? I don't believe that it is or at least it doesn't feel like it at all for me!!

JT

JT! There IS an end. I promise.

As for OW - what a freaking kooze. Have to get it out there - like Sunny says, she's a STOW. Don't worry your pretty head about her. Concern yourself with YOU and your young'uns.

As for your mindset of telling dh where and when you are - eff that! I fell into that, and when I let him know that if he wasn't gonna stay around I didn't OWE him an explination of where and when I was....seriously, THAT was a wake up call for my dh. Oh yeah, he tried the tack, "They're MY kids and I have a RIGHT to know where they are..." Bull hockey (read: sh*t). You walk out MY door, and you loose your rights to me an mine. The LAW says that as the custodial parent, as long as you leave the kids with capable, responsible caregivers, you can go and do as you effing well please (within legal limits, of course). I know dh tried that bs with OW and it worked because she's an uneducated kooze, but this chickie don't fly like that.

Lay it out to him if you have to. Shoot! You don't even have to go anywhere. Just don't check in with him - I've got caller id - I don't even have to pick up the phone if I don't want to. Funny thing is - I really don't have the urge to go anywhere besides the beach or my mom's...but HE didn't need to know that info, and I wouldn't have shared it with him. Let HIM worry and wonder. It's his turn anyway.

Once my dh got that through his huge, thick skull, his tune and attitude towards me improved greatly - infact, I think that's one of the main reasons he decided to stay with me. He couldn't bear the thought of me having a LIFE without him. And I was SO gonna have a life!!!!!!!!!!!

- Kimmy

Kimmy,

How old are you? if you don't mind me asking. You have such a fresh and pleasant presence about you until it is unreal. I appreciate you always being there and am glad that you joined the gang ( not the situations ). I am a little better today. I made a comment to my H last night when I found the picture and card ( I still have them might I add) that he must really love that girl. He immediately got upset and said " You are so stupid" I then replied "that i really must be - to still be here".

I then went to bed and watched a little TV. He played with our son and put him to bed then came in a little later and said that he was leaving. I said nothing and he left for the night. I went to sleep a rough one I must add because my son has a summer cold which is the worst kind. H called me back at about 1:30am. When I answered the phone he asked me what I was doing I said sleeping. He then said that I made him mad before he left. He said that I was wrong about the whole thing he does not love her and never did. He said that it wasn't about that. He then said that the two things don't even compare; He loves me and our family aqnd never told her or promised her anything. He said that we have a family and nothing compares to that or is more important, he made a mistake. He then went on to yell that he will be glad when all this is over, but hey I wanted to then say that it would never be over if this child is his. I did not say a word I just held my tongue and was quiet.

H then said that was all he wanted to say and for me to have a good night "I know you are tired" BYE.

Well what do I do with this info. Is it the truth? or another lie!

I'm gone for now - What do you think?

JT

<small>[ July 07, 2004, 11:20 AM: Message edited by: JT2 ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> How old are you? if you don't mind me asking. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">OMGOSH! I can't believe you asked THAT!!!! KIDDING! I'm 36, going on 104 (hehe).

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> ( not the situations ). </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Believe me, I understand. I would've much rather met you all doing something fun like playing slots in Vegas, or on a beach in Cancun with cabana boys waiting on us hand and foot (d'ya think I have an unhealthy "thing" for cabana boys???) or something - rather than be sisters by our tests through fire and pain. But hey, I figure God knows what he's doing, and we all were meant to meet one way or another....who am I to question the "how" of our meeting? He knows we'd need each other so we've met....

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I made a comment to my H last night when I found the picture and card ( I still have them might I add) that he must really love that girl. He immediately got upset and said " You are so stupid" I then replied "that i really must be - to still be here".
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Um. Can you say LBing? Both of you! BTW: I made dh BURN the pic of the kooze he had....this was before I came here and learned so much. I must say, it felt GOOD to bbq the tart!

I HATE it when names are called. That "stupid" comment really got me in the stomach for you. Boy howdy, tho, you have a comeback for it. Tit for tat never accomplishes anything....

Kinda wish he wouldn't spend the nights away from you all. I'm with Dr. H on that one. I think if h's and w's are going to make it, they should be under one roof. Actually, statistics are with that, too.

I don't *think* he's lying about not loving her - honestly, it doesn't sound like (and this is just from what I've gleaned from you) he ever wanted to loose you all. Most men don't want to leave their families for the OW.

It sounds like he's making the right "noises" right now. As the BW's, sometimes I think we've got the hardest part to play in these messes. We've got to try to temper our anger and attempt to hold our tongues a lot more than the WH's deserve (imo). But, NO ONE should have to pay for mistakes forever. Not YOU, and not your H. It might seem that this situation is a forever thing because no matter what, there will be OC, but there are blessings in your future....I promise you. What's even better, is that I'm not the one that has to keep the promise - it is promised by God....so you know that as a human, I'm fallible, but that promise is a keeper!

Only God is infinite. This pain, this confusion, this sadness, it will all end...a lot of the "when" it will end is up to you, though.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Well what do I do with this info. Is it the truth? or another lie!
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Can I give you a teeny bit of advice??? You can totally tell me to eff off, but as someone who thought she'd NEVER ever be happy again - who saw the world as a horrible and hurtful place because of the actions of her dh, can I give you a little of my insight to a "great mystery?" Store that info away. Do not use it as a foundation to build anything. Do not put hope into it, do not do anything with it except to take it out every now and then and compare it to his ACTIONS. Because, between you, me and the fencepost, we all know that they are just WORDS and have no meaning unless they have actions to back them up. As wives to wh, we have had words blow up in our faces (lies) because of ACTIONS (a's). When our dh's begin to "walk the walk" as well as "talk the talk," then we can begin to hope again.

Was it me, or did I just ramble on and on and on......so sorry about that!

- Kimmy

First, excellent post Kimmy. JT you need to listen to her.

I only want to add that I think the rubber is in need of hitting the road. Your tires have been spinning in the mud for a long time now. I see you struggling so much, kind of like trying to make sense of it all, when there is no sense to be had.

You only need to ask yourself if you want this M or not.

Don't worry about the future.

Don't torture yourself with all the what if's.

Don't worry about who's right and who's wrong.

Just simply ask yourself, "Do I want to continue in this M?".

If you decide you do, and your H does as well, then move forward in that. The rest can all be figured out later, once you're on the road to recovery.

JMO

~ad

<small>[ July 07, 2004, 12:13 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]</small>

Thank you both for the imput.

- AD, I have been spinning my wheels for to long now and I am ready to begin anew. I have decided to stick it out as long as I can. I do not have the answers that I want yet but have come to the conclusion that he may not know what to do now either.
I am not trusting of him not even a little bit. He could tell me the sky is blue and I would not believe him at all. My problem is I fear everything that is happening to me; and that only increases my doubts daily. But this is getting me no where - not one inch further than yesterday. I need to stop tormenting myself and H for what has happened and deal with it.

My kids are suffering and it hurts to know that they maybe suffering longer because mommy can't move past it.

-KIMMY, Thanks for the advice. I will keep the picture. I put it in a file I have of all the other memorable items I've found along the way. You never know when they might come in handy.

I am feeling better after talking to you girls - so thanks again for everything.

JT

You are right not to trust him. He needs to earn your trust. He can do that by his deeds matching his words. Until they match, nothing should be believed.

Are you using Plan A concepts to the best of your ability in the meantime?

<small>[ July 07, 2004, 03:04 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Are you using Plan A concepts to the best of your ability in the meantime?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">It really does help, JT. Even if your dh doesn't follow it, it helps you....

- Kimmy

No I have not been using Plan A to any ability. I do it for a couple of days and then I go to it. H complains that I just need to stop nagging all the time. He said he loves me and loves spending time with me but who would want to come home to someone nagging all the time about the same thing.

Well I get so upset because I am not getting any answers I just start up with it again and again. I also think the DEVIL loves me. He torments me daily and I fall for it!! I know that he only goes after the children og GOD with such diligence - so I know that something good is in store for me because he stays on me, dropping little hints here and there.

I am just so out of control I need to get a handle on this.

Thanks for asking - and does plan A really work? Should I just let him gop and hope that he comes home? But I am so afraid of being the one left holding my hands out saying why?

I let fear keep me from moving forward with my life. I don't want to lose him but I don't want to be standing with egg on my face either.
So what do you do. I need to be the person that plan A suggests but I am just the opposite. I try to control everything which is partly why we are here today - not the affair or Pg, but seperated.

Just stupifieddddddddddd is what I am!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

JT

JT - Yes, plan A does work. I have been working so hard to meet my H's needs. He has noticed. As a matter fact, the problem now is that he doesn't trust it. He thinks that I am all of a sudden changing my ways just to get him back home and then I will change back to the "old" me. Until he trust my actions for what they are - which is an honest effort to change for the good of our M, a sincere effort to be a better wife - I am not so sure what else to do. But I am not so sure it is my actions that he does not trust, but more that he doesn't trust himself to take the leap to try again. And maybe a little bit feeling like he doesn't deserve this second (or third) chance (but who's counting??). Point is that is does work.

You have also got to stop the LBing - angry outburst, nagging. Anything that will push him away more. Be the best, most loving you. He will be more receptive to you.

About the devil, he will use your weaknesses against you. Know your weaknesses and be aware of him. For instance, I see him using my love for my kids against me. At one point, I was so angry because of all the hurt H was causing kids, that I wanted to give up and end the M. But you see, that would only hurt us all more. The kids would not be happy if the M ended, they would only be hurt more. You see how he can play with your mind and make yourself your own worst enemy. He does not want to see your M succeed. He plays by no rules - anything goes. The best defense - God. Pray to God to handle the devil for you, pray for strength not to fall into his temptations. You are a strong, faithful woman. Turn to God and he will guide you through this.

Hoped I helped a little.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> H complains that I just need to stop nagging all the time. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">HENCE TAKING YOUR ANTI-D's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I swear on my left big toe that it works. They work....they HELP! They have made ALL THE DIFFERENCE in me.....

Sweetie - you've commented on my attitude....how d'ya think I got this way? I'm not drugged out/zoned out...I'm on an even keel for the first time in a year and a half! I don't OCD on things that are in the past anymore....and I did, and I did badly. I would nag, I would hound, and I suffered. Please don't suffer for a year and a half like I did. You ARE suffering....your dh sees it....IT HURTS HIM to know that he's the reason you are behaving the way you are. The only reason I can say all of this is because I've BTDT! Wouldn't you much rather be able to be able to look at the whole situation objectively and then be able to make decisions and conclusions without obsessive thoughts clouding your perspective? Wouldn't you much rather be able to relate to your dh - hear what he tells you, and make your life choices regarding him without having LB thoughts bursting from your lips?

Both of you are on the defensive right now - because you both (from what I read yesterday) LB at each other. One LB said causes another to blurt out from your partner's lips. That slight not to be outdone, you LB back again. It's a vicious, ugly circle that feeds upon itself. All it accomplishes is ill feelings and distrust towards each other. And you know what? The devil is sitting on your living room sofa watching this and eating popcorn like this is the best show in the world because this is what he lives for. DON'T LET HIM IN ANYMORE!

One of the ways to gain CONTROL of it all is to take care of yourself. Only then can you take back your marriage.

Your sister through the fire,
- Kimmy

You girls are the best! Especially by sticking with me through this roller coaster of emotions that I am constantly on!! I am so blessed to have found each of you and am thankful for the advice and concern that you show on a daily basis.

I do let the devil control me and I do let him take front row seats while I LB away, hound, and claw my H to death. Does he really care that I am hurting is the question that I constantly ask myself, but answer is probably yes. I just don't give him any time to clear this whole mess up. H once last week asked me if I had any trust or faith in him and I said NO, which is true. He said that he just wished this was all over and so do I but the only way it can be over is if this is not his baby and if he has no intention on being with her again or anyoner other than me for that matter.

I think that he might have learned from this mistake. H now carries his BIBLE with him in his car and reads it again everyday. I must say he is doing a better job at that than I am. So that might be why he always seems so calm about this thing. I need to have my faith jolted or jump started to the point that I have inner peace with myself. I can only find that through GOD - I know!!

But I vow today tha I will REBUKE the DEVIL and try to live in peace as I am promised by GOD. I hope that I do not always sound so preachy, but since we all have established that we are christians I feel comfortable talking about him. I do not mean to offend anyone though if I have. But thanks to you all and G I get up every morning ready to face a new day. I may not always be positive, but I am glad to be alive.

I will get better - I will do better. I will take some of those da** AD's. It could not possibly be any worse that it already is for me - Right? Keep praying for me and advise me at will - Please!!

Oh yeah- I do believe that OW is trying to get my H back with her. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />


JT