I know they say that we are responsible for our actions so H says I am responsible for my being depressed and my emotions going all over the place. He also thinks that he is not responsible for why I am feeling this way. He does not think that his going about doing his thing with OW and OC should have any impact on me. He thinks that I should manage it better.

I have to admit, I just finished doing a pretty good job LB'ing him. He called but did not mention that he was going to OW's place. Finally he said something and my response was a very emotionless "ok, that sounds cool." He got miffed, saying "you think you would say it with some kind of emotion." I asked if he thought I was supposed to act like I am so thrilled or what. It just went on from there, over an hour on the phone bickering. Not a good thing before he is going to see OW. Oh, and less I forget, he already said that he does not expect much to come out of the conversation. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Just makes me feel like he is going there to spend more time with her, an excuse since our agreement is only 2 hrs. to see the baby.

He said that he can't take my roller coaster emotions much longer. I told him, neither can I. My whole insides are turned around. One minute I am happy, then next as sad as can be and crying.

I told him I just want him to take some responsibility for what he is doing to me. He does not get it.

Why do I stay? God, I must be the biggest fool, chicken, loooser in the entire world.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I know they say that we are responsible for our actions so H says I am responsible for my being depressed and my emotions going all over the place. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">First of all who are "they"???? You didn't ask for any of this. He is trying to ease his own guilt.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He does not think that his going about doing his thing with OW and OC should have any impact on me. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He is still in the 'I need, I want, me, me, me' mode. Has he always been there or is this new?


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Finally he said something and my response was a very emotionless "ok, that sounds cool." He got miffed, saying "you think you would say it with some kind of emotion." </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He is goading you into a reaction so he can justify himself.


</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> He said that he can't take my roller coaster emotions much longer. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Yet he goads you into reacting emotionally!!!! He is playing with your emotions and then using that as an excuse to make him feel better.

No matter what agreement you had about him seeing the baby for 2 hours, it is not working. He should be caring and supportive of what you are feeling and it appears that he is just making it worse. Some of his comments are very immature and childish. I am not surprised that your emotions are all over the map... nothing is normal and he is not making an attempt to help the situation at all. He IS making it worse and He IS totally responsible for the rollercoaster you are on. Maybe if he had a handle on his ummm 'emotion' when the affair happened you wouldn't be in this place. I will keep you in my prayers.

Luv,

I'm so sorry to hear that. We are responsible for our own happiness, BUT (here's the big BUT) others can make it extremely difficult for us to be happy. As the WS, I am trying to do everything I can to ease my H's pain. I know that I did something extremely unfair and hurtful to him and since I can't take it back am trying so hard to let him know I love him and will never on purpose hurt him again. It doesn't erase the pain, but hopefully in time he will feel that I really do love him despite my selfish act.

I wish your husband would realize that since he has caused you pain and an OC to boot that he needs to do everything possible to help you get back on an even keel emotionally. Is there any way he can see the OC with only minimal contact with the OW? Can he take the OC to your house? To the park? Something? He does need to take resposbility for the OC, but he also needs to clean up the mess he made in your heart and emotions!

I'm sorry that he is putting the blame on you when he needs to be loving you so much that you can heal! I feel that if H wants to yell at me to feel better then I better just let him vent! He hasn't, but he's certainly entitled to it!

KMF,

Gosh, I've thought about posting to you a couple times, now I feel compelled.

Your H is abusing you. Plain and simple. What is being done to you is emotional/psychological abuse in it's most basic form. I've been reading several of your posts, and my heart just breaks for you.
Emotional abuse is sneaky. It doesn't leave that clearly visible bruise a slap or punch does, but the damage is so much deeper. Most women don't even realize it's happening until they are knee deep in it. It's a slow erosion of your own self-esteem, and then the point comes when you aren't even sure which way is up because he has confused your emotions so badly.
Many people originally think that this form of abuse can be written off as "just a fight" or something like that...but there is a pattern.

LMF, telling someone, as your H did, that he could easily replace you or find someone better (I can't remember his exact words from your other post) IS ABUSE. Completely disregarding your feelings, then oh-so-subtly turning it around to blame you IS ABUSE. I don't know your past with him, but I have to wonder if he hasn't maybe been doing this to you for a long time. I have seen many "red flags" in your posts.

Please, please, please do a little reading on the topic.
Check out this link:
http://www.angelfire.com/vt/rcwn/Pagesixteen.html

Go down the page to the list and read about the Power and Control Wheel, Emotional Abuse, Psychlogical Abuse, and Emotional Blackmail.

Take care of YOURSELF!!
Hugs to you.

Ladies, thank you so much.

Things only got worse last night. He spoke with her for 3 hrs. 45 mins. (see my post "OW wants to talk...." Anyway, they were supposed to talk about V, when he got home he said that they did not accomplish much as OC wanted attention. The main thing that came out of the conversation is that she DOES NOT want me around OC becuase of my remarks when I found out about PG, that I wished she would have an abortion or miscarry. My H also wanted her to have an abortion. She said that for the first year, she does not want OC around me, she fears for OC's life. Give me a break. I asked why couldn't he just talk to her on the phone? He made fun of me..."oh so you don't have to worry because I might fall to her prey..." He just does not get it, does not want to, or does not care.

Anyway, during our conversation my H was nothing but mean. He said many hurtful things, including that I am a lunitic (sp?)

StillStrong, every response you wrote is what goes through my head, what my commen sense tells me. The "They" that I refer to is therapists. He has always been in the me, me, me, mode. He is selfish to the core.

Robel,
Thank you, it's great to hear from a WS. I think women tend to be readliy do what ever to make it right. A lady I work with had an A, she said "I ate crow, I was wrong, etc." Her H had one but he won't eat crow or do anything to make it right.

My H is down right pig headed and egotistical. He won't do anything for me that causes him the slightest bit of discomfort or makes him feel like he has to work for forgivness and healing. It is only instilled in him by his father.

MeNtheBoys,
Thank you so much for posting to me.
You are right, I am in an emotionally abusive relationship. My priest said that after only speaking to me for an hour and my therapist said that. I know it too but for what ever reason, I find it heard to break loose. I know understand how women of physical violence keep getting sucked back in. It's all the promises from the H, you believe them, you want to believe them, you think...just one more time.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> LMF, telling someone, as your H did, that he could easily replace you or find someone better (I can't remember his exact words from your other post) IS ABUSE. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This was not me. I think it was Genia's H but I am not sure. Unless in my emotional state I have totally forgotten something he said but I am pretty sure it was not me.

I am going to check out your link, thanks.

I called my atty. on the way to work. Asked her to call me back. I am going to move forward with a D and I am telling her that no matter what I say, she is not permitted to let me back out. I have to move forward with this for my sanity and health. Last night, I thought I was going to have a nervous breakdown, I felt so out of control of my body and emtions. I did not freak out, hit or even scream. I was calm but still felt out of control. Does that make sense? I guess I just felt hopeless.

Anyway, if I don't make this move with my atty. my H is just going to pull me back in with his words and justification. I can't let him do this to me any longer. I am not be completely ready for this but I have to make myself do it. This has gone on far to long and I have been abused way too much. I need to have a better life and it's my time to start putting me first. I know I need help and support. I need to be reminded of how his words are just words and not get sucked back in.

I will be happy, God loves me and he does not want me to hurt any longer.

LMF,
I can only tell how my H has acted when he was doing things he was not supposed to do. He acted like your H. But, in hindsight, I realize that he was just trying to provoke a reaction so that he could find another reason to justify his actions.
The current situation we find ourselves in, with an OC, is just one of a long line of infidelities.
DO NOT beat yourself because you love your husband. You want to do the right thing. By working on your marriage, keeping your family together. Nowadays, people bolt at the first situation that causes tears and frustration.
No matter what happens with you and your H, you know in your heart, YOU gave it body, heart, and soul.
Don't worry about what others think of you....Focus on yourself and your children.
I love you.
Ent

Hi Luv,

I am very sorry. My husband is doing me the same way. he does not feel responsible for my sadness either. I try and act happy because he gets angry with me when I feel sad. He does not want to be around me when I am sad. He acts like he is not responsible for anything. Like his funk up is my fault.

PS: Luv, You are correct. My husband told me he could find somebody better than me. Too that I replied, "Go ahead if you think you can, but I doubt it." Good luck with getting a divorce. I wish I had already. I hate being in this mess but I understand how hard it is. They are mean one minute and then so sweet the next.

<small>[ July 28, 2004, 08:18 AM: Message edited by: Genia ]</small>

Oh, Luv my heart breaks for you. I would love to be there with you to give you the support you need. You voice some of the same feelings I have felt in the past. I know that you can get past this and be stronger but the journey is long and uphill. I believe the decision to move forward with the D is right. Your H will probably fight this though, simply because he will not be in control of it. Be Prepared for it. I would go to a plan B now if possible. He is placing the OW feelings and needs above yours...his are first, then hers and yours are at the bottom. Lean on the Lord, he is your strength and will see you through. I will be praying for you. God Bless.

LMF,

Sorry, you're right, I think that was Genia's post...
Still, other behaviors your H displays, including what you posted about last night, still fall under the abuse category. I'm glad others in your life have recognized it as well.

I respect your efforts to hold your M together, but no matter what YOU do, HE will still abuse, it never just "stops". All that happens is that you eventually keep lowering your expectations for his behavior and your own happiness in order to keep the peace.

I think you're making the right choice at this time by filing for D. I know how painful it is for you, but YOU have to take care of YOU!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I will be happy, God loves me and he does not want me to hurt any longer.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">YES YOU WILL!!!!!!!!!! You have a whole flotilla of angels here to vent to and to talk to and who are praying for you. I am so proud of you and all you've tried to do. YOU can honestly say that YOU gave it your best shot (he cannot - and won't be able to ever). Now, lets get your duckies in a row! I mean it, I'm so proud of you and you should be proud of YOU!

Love,
Kimmy

Ladies,
Thank you all so much. You are all so wonderful and I love and do need you. I wish I had more people here close to me that I could lean on. I have another person from MB that has become a dear friend but she lives in Hawaii (lucky dog). I have a bunch of friends here but only one that knows about OC and she just got laid off so I hate to burden her. I do feel alone, except for you guys. Thanks.

Entwife
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I can only tell how my H has acted when he was doing things he was not supposed to do. He acted like your H. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know, his actions are very familiar to me, very much like during the A. I guess my H must really think I am so stupid that I can't figure things out.

Got to run to a meeting, will get back with you in a bit.

Hi Luv,

If you ever need somebody to talk to, I am much in the same boat. MB and MIL is all I have. Nobody else will understand. I have a close friend that got laid off but she just thinks I should have left a long time ago. You can have my e-mail if you like. I am not sure if I am leaveing or not because I am afraid my husband could have given me an STD from OW. I am not sure but I keep getting recurring infections since he went to her town a month and a half ago. Of course he still says he did not sleep with her.

Luv, most bs say and feel that when they hear there husband got the ow pregnant. Has hard as it is to hear that (from the ow side) it's normal. Also, if your husband would step up to the plate I think that when it goes to court the worst that could happen would be supervised V for awhile for those comments, then go to regular Visits. At the very worst unless of course she could prove your physco which it does not sound as if you are. I too think your doing the right thing. It sounds like it all about your husband and what he wants and how he feels. He still wants to have his cake and eat it too. And now he has an excuse "seeing the baby" to do it in the open. I'm sorry for your pain.

Augggh, my atty. is on vacation till Monday. Why not, just my luck.


Still,
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Your H will probably fight this though, simply because he will not be in control of it. Be Prepared for it </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I nkow you are right. We traveled this road before and he is always in his selfish mode. He says everything should be 50-50 and that I am always being unfair. I told him "I want what I want and you want what you want." "What makes my wants unfair and selfish and yours not?" He said, "because you want more than 50% and that's not fair. So, I know it's going to be a fight. This time, I am going to ask for more. I allowed him to have more visitation than I wanted to give, not this time. He can't have everything he wants.

Need,
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Luv, most bs say and feel that when they hear there husband got the ow pregnant. Has hard as it is to hear that (from the ow side) it's normal. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know and that's what I told him. My atty. even agreed with me. I told him, it's just something that she is trying to use to make it more difficult. He made a comment that he is mad I opened my mouth. I should have told him that I am made that he opened his fly. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> At the very worst unless of course she could prove your physco which it does not sound as if you are. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I agree with you comments on visitation. However, I fear that he will try to say I am psycho because of the way I have been acting and the fact I need meds. I am referring to our sit. if we divorce not the OC.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> It sounds like it all about your husband and what he wants and how he feels. He still wants to have his cake and eat it too. And now he has an excuse "seeing the baby" to do it in the open. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Oh for sure. This baby has been his excuse and he is using it to the max. Too bad he did not put that much effort into being our children's father. He still does not. He puts more emphasis on cleaning the house, getting them to bed on time and silly stuff rather than taking a walk with the kids, letting them catch lightning bugs, etc.

So sorry LUV! All can say is big (((HUGS))) and I'm here for you.

Luv,

Your H is beig so insensitive, it's hard for me to read about it. I say file, put your requests in there for however much you want, and leave it in the judges hands to decide. Your H has put you thru a lot more than a person should have to endure in a M. You're reason for filing is not petty or shallow, it is a very serious issue.

When he says you are asking for too much, tell him you will just wait and see if the judge agrees. He is no longer your judge and jury. You are taking the high road from here on out.

In situations like this, I have to wonder how understanding he'd be if you were the one that got pregnant by another man. The things you requested of him are not out of the question. They would be very easy to comply with, IF he wanted to help make you feel more comfortable. When I found out I was having my first child I wasn't married and my mom was very worried for my future and suggested an abortion. When that child came she loved her more than life itself. That crap about the OW being concerned is just that, crap! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

Whatever you decide, when you TAKE CHARGE of your life again you will start to feel better. It's pretty much a proven fact that when we start to act versus always reacting, it empowers us.

You have many people here pulling for you. I wish you the best of luck.

Thanks sweetie. How are things going for you?

Albany, how's it going for you?

Finding, thank you.
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">In situations like this, I have to wonder how understanding he'd be if you were the one that got pregnant by another man. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I try using that situation and ask him to put himself in my shoes. He makes fun of it, pushes it aside or just says I don't know. I even mentioned that just this morning. I reminded him that I recall him being very upset when I went on a business trip with co-workers, all men to a conference with 15,000 police officers. He was very worried that I would do something just to spite him.

meMtheBoyz,
I checked out the link and I was amazed. He uses emotional blackmail all the time on me. He fits the description on an emotional blackmailer and I fit the description of the victim, to a T.

A couple questions about this, maybe you can help.
The "types of emotional blackmaliers"
The Sufferer--the martyr who believes they’ve done everything for others and suffered because of it and don’t hesitate to remind them so they will feel sorry for them. My H says that I do this all the time. I act like I am the only one who has suffered and it's because of him. Any time I want to show an example of something he says I try to beat him down and remind him of how horrible he has been. Am I acting like a "sufferer"? Am I an emotional blackmailer? I don't have any of the other traits they mentioned, at least I don't think so.

He also uses the "crazy making" they mention and the verbal abuse.

Thanks for all the support. Now for my atty to return from vacation.

MUCHO GRANDE HUMONGOUS HUGS TO YOU!!!!!!!!!!

I can't wait till your attny. gets back either! I SO think your h will be singing a totally dif. tune when he gets hit by that mackerel!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Am I acting like a "sufferer"? Am I an emotional blackmailer? I don't have any of the other traits they mentioned, at least I don't think so.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As an outsider looking in, my first reaction is "does it matter?" I mean, YOU'VE tried everything you could think of, even going past your breaking point (the V at OW house) and he refuses to meet you even halfway. HE tells YOU that you have to get over it? Um, hello? HE'S the one that needs to get over it and start establishing a new life with YOU, not you making room in your life for HER. So no matter what you determine (on being a "sufferer" or not), the FACT is that NO MATTER HOW MUCH YOU CHANGED for him, he never did so for you. If/when he realizes this, he'll be a MUCH better person for it!

JMHO. I love you, girl, more than I love my luggage (from Steel Magnolias)!

- Kimmy

Thanks Nio.

I remember that line too. Great movie, just goes to show you what a strong specimen of a human being women really are.

I really thank each and everyone of you so much. You are all wonderful and i love you all too. I hope only the best for each and everyone of us. I wish I could meet everyone in person, I think that would be a hoot.