Many folks have been talking about how "venting anger" is an important part of healing and getting some of these things out. I wanted to at least offer some other perspectives about "venting" as food for thought.

The first is from Psychology Today:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> RESEARCHERS SAY: Pillow punching, like other forms of vigorous exercise, might be helpful for stress management, but recent studies suggest that venting anger may be counterproductive. "Venting anger just keeps it alive," says Brad Bushman, Ph.D., a psychologist at Iowa State University. "People think it's going to work, and when it doesn't, they become even more angry and frustrated."

In addition, several studies show that the outward expression of anger leads to dangerously elevated cardiovascular activity, which may contribute to the development of cardiovascular disease.

Bushman recently put the so-called "catharsis hypothesis" to the test, deliberately inducing anger in a group of college students by marking nasty comments on essays they had written. Those who slammed a punching bag afterward were more, not less, aggressive to people they subsequently encountered.

WHAT TO DO INSTEAD: A better tack, says Bushman, is to do "anything that's incompatible with anger and aggression." That includes watching a funny movie, reading an absorbing novel, sharing a laugh with a friend, or listening to music. Given time, your anger will dissipate, and then you'll be able to deal with the situation in a more constructive way.

Though Bushman has found that exercise can actually heighten physical arousal and keep anger alive, other studies have concluded that sustained strenuous activity might indeed release anger and improve mood. And nontraditional exercise programs like tai chi, yoga and stretching may not only dissipate negative feelings such as anger but make people more conscious of their mood states, paving the way for them to do something constructive about them. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">This second one is from a long time poster Moth:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Thank you all for taking the time to respond. I read and re-read the responses several times, and have tried to establish what has been bothering my detractors the most. It seems to be my criticism of venting, so I think I owe those people some further comment. Later I�ll try and address the other comments, the ones that were directed to my �chatroom� remark, which most people seem to have misunderstood. It's not that I feel insufficiently involved with this board, it's that I'm worried about the opposite. But I'll come back to that later. Meanwhile...

I do empathize with the fear that unless we vent and keep our anger and fear perpetually fresh and raw, we won�t be able to keep the goblins at bay, those monstrous bullies who fill our nightmares with all the things that were done and said that hurt us and cheated us of what we wanted and needed. I do understand the panicky feeling that says, if we don�t vent with every ounce of strength we�ve got, the floodgates will open and the bullies/goblins will annihilate us. I, too, have worried that if I let my anger or fear or apprehension slip, that I might not avoid, but actually encourage the behaviour that led to my being violated the first time.

But we can�t control every encounter, every crisis, or rather, we WON�T control it, because of our need or impatience or greed. Yes, there is such a thing as a greed for respect, a greed for a wrong to be righted, a greed for fairness and justice. We know it is greed, because greed does not satisfy. And if we capitulate to this greed, we will be seduced into living in a nightmare world of lack, of frustration, and of powerlessness. I say, �seduced� because this nightmare world, unlike the world that offers at least a chance of happiness, does not burden us with the requirement to take action. Taking action is scary, for it offers no certainty, whereas the nightmare world does. Certainty can be comforting, so comforting that we can be drugged by the comfort into forgetting that the certainty we have sold our souls for is only the certainty of more pain.

We can�t go back again. Often I have looked upon this reality with frustration, until I remember that this inability isn�t a bad thing, that�s a wonderful thing! We don�t need to re-feel and re-live the pain over and over again, we can step out, into the sunshine, into the light. It is time to forgive ourselves for the greed for justice, but also time to let go of it! There are better options out there.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

These are thought provoking.

I have noticed in myself that I CAN control my attitude & my attitude sets the tone for how I will respond or 'deal with' unwanted situations.

There is a book that our church marraige group is studying through right now called Communication: The Key to Your Marraige......I beleive I have posted about this before but.....

Anyhoo-it brought up the point of 'self-talk'. It really can encourage or discourage our moods & attitudes.

It was very hard for me to see this in the beginnning becuase I was just soooooo upset @ the UNFAIRNESS of it all.

But after a while I could see where I controlled the 'stirring-up' of my anger again or not.

Others have reminded (for those who are christian minded) to (as the Bible says) ......take every thought captive.......

Thank you for the reminder again. There is a time & place for everything but when it is a continuous 'thing' to just keep venting over & over again-----then it becomes counter-productive. There comes a point when you MUST for your own health & sanity...focus on other things.

It's sooo hard for a BS to realize that @ first. It all comes in stages.

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I was trying to do that in the thread by gwenie BTW------i really wanted to hear about the vacation! LOL

Again, thank you for the reminder.

I think a great way to vent anger is to write a letter. Not a letter you're actually going to send, but one you write for yourself.

I do it all the time, and it helps me to sort out my issues without going off on anyone in anger. Often times we say things while we're so angry that we aren't thinking clearly, so by writing it down, re-reading it, and processing it, you can work THROUGH it.

As a matter of fact, I was just writing one to my best friend, because at the moment she's angry with me for something ridiculously petty and that, in turn, made me very angry at *her*. Of course she'll never see it, but *I'll* feel better "yelling" at her on paper.

It's very freeing.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I'm having trouble with the author's name Dr. Bushman.... I donno... the name just sets my mind ablaze with pun after pun...but I digress...

Anger is a secondary emotional response... there is always a more tender emotion underneath. Like fear. The problem I see with too frequent venting, is that it ignores the underlying emotional issue. Like a sense of impotence, or feeling powerless.

An occasional brief vent does no harm, in my opinion, as long as the underlying emotional issue is not ignored.

Pep

<small>[ October 27, 2004, 08:24 PM: Message edited by: Pepperband ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> An occasional brief vent does no harm, in my opinion, as long as the underlying emotional issue is not ignored. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I agree with this Pep....I see folks "blow steam" every now and then...and that's not a bad thing. I also see people (not necessarily this board because I don't know the posters well enough yet) who do nothing but vent and it really gets them "stuck".

kt...I'm glad you brought up "self talk"...positive "self talk" is considered very healthy....here's a sample of some strategies that deal with that from Judith Pearson:

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Focusing only on problems: This is the essence of complaining. We dwell on the problem, instead of solutions.

Instead: Assume most problems have solutions, and ask "How do I want this situation to be different?"

Catastrophizing: Every bad thing that happens is a horrible disaster.

Instead: Be realistic in your assessment and stop scaring yourself. Yes, bad things do happen, and many bad things are often inconveniences, mistakes, and foul-ups---not necessarily traumas, tragedies, or disasters.

Expecting the worst: "What if he doesn't like me?" "What if I don't pass the exam?" Expecting the worst does not encourage you to behave effectively. Expecting the worst only promotes anxiety.

Instead: Ask questions that presuppose positive outcomes. "How can I make a favorable impression?" "How can I prepare for the exam?"

Stereotyping: By putting others, and ourselves, into preconceived categories, we avoid thinking of people as unique individuals. This leads to strained relationships, and gives us an undeserved sense of superiority or inferiority. It also often deprives us of opportunities to know and understand the giftedness of those whom we stereotype.

Instead: Remind yourself that we are all human beings, with unique personalities, each having qualities and shortcomings.

Shoulds: Should, ought, must, have to... used carelessly, these words presuppose rules and standards for behavior that do not exist in reality. They imply a consequence for noncompliance, and often evoke quilt. For example, according to the law, we "should" obey posted speed limits, or pay a fine. Is it equally true that "I should be smarter than I am." or "I ought to be married by now."?--Of course not!

Instead: Replace the words should, ought, or must with the word "COULD" and realize the gift of choices.

Thinking in Absolutes: We exaggerate reality with words like "always," "never," and "everyone," as in "I always eat too much--I will never be slim."

Instead: Replace exaggeration with words that more accurately reflect reality. Example "I often eat more than I need, but I can change that."

All or Nothing Thinking: We distort reality by thinking only in extremes. Our efforts become total failures or complete successes---with nothing in between. Example: "Either I lose two pounds by Sunday, or I quit exercising."

Instead: Chunk down your perceptions to see the parts of the whole, which can be positive, negative, and in-between. Give yourself options or choices whenever possible. Example: "I want to lose two pounds by Sunday. Even one pound would indicate that exercise is helping. If my weight stays the same, I'll experiment with variations in nutrition and exercise until I reach my goal."

Negative labels: Negative labels are the tools we use to lower self-esteem in ourselves and others. Example: "I'm stupid," or "I'm fat." When we say phrases like these often, they become a part of our identity and we can begin to dislike who we are.

Instead: Remember, people are not their faults or shortcomings. You may engage in stupid behavior occasionally, but that doesn't make you a stupid person. Change your negative "I-am" statement into a statement about behaviors. Example: "I make unhealthy choices when it comes to food." It's easier to change a behavior, than to change your identity.

Blaming: We assign guilt, instead of solving the problem. If we can blame others, then we can feel vindicated in a wrong-doing, and avoid responsibility.

Instead: Focus on what YOU can do to promote a solution to the problem.

"Yes but..." Arguments: When someone offers a possible solution to our problems, we "yes but..." and list reasons why the proposed solution won't work. "Yes but..." says "I'm really not listening to you right now."

Instead: Open up to new possibilities and consider alternatives. Really listen to advice and give it a fair hearing, before dismissing it so quickly.

Overgeneralizing: This is similar to stereotyping and thinking in absolutes. It means that we take a single instance or occurrence, and generalize it to numerous other situations. Example: "Joe is a nice man, and he doesn't want to date me. Therefore: No nice man will ever want to date me." When misused, this kind of generalizing can lead to illogical conclusions.

Instead: Ask yourself whether there could be exceptions to your generalization. Does a single occurrence mean it will happen every time?</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">meNboys...I like to vent in letters too...and then burn them and release them. Sometimes, there are things that hurt us that there will never be an apology for. It's hard to let go of those things....so I like ritualistic "ceremonies" where you rid yourself of that pain. It isn't dependent on someone else...and it gives you a way to free yourself. "Forgiveness is a gift we give ourselves".

kt said~ </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">But after a while I could see where I controlled the 'stirring-up' of my anger again or not.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I know HOW much younger you are than me, and let me say, you are very blessed to have come to this realization, because I definitely wasn't "there" at your age. I think of all the years I wasted being angry about miscellaneous things, and not taking one moment to realize NO ONE and/or NO SITUATION could make me angry, it was a conscious choice I made. Oh well, I'm a slow learner, but at least I'm learning, that's something, you think? kt, I'm quite sure you're not "joyful" for some of the situations that have come your way, but you can be joyful and proud for what you've chosen to do with what has come your way.

M&TB said~ </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">As a matter of fact, I was just writing one to my best friend, because at the moment she's angry with me for something ridiculously petty and that, in turn, made me very angry at *her*. Of course she'll never see it, but *I'll* feel better "yelling" at her on paper.

It's very freeing.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Ain't that the truth! I myself have done this. I especially remember a time, I was sooooo upset with my IL's. I really wanted to blast them. I knew I would only regret it though, but more importantly I knew what they did/said was not intended to be malicious. Still I needed to do something with my frustration, so I wrote down what I would've "liked" to have said to them. It was just enough to get it off my chest, and pretty much out of my mind. I kept it for awhile, and then ripped it up. I am so glad I never actually spoke the words to them.

Ever hear the saying about how once we vocalize the words, it's like opening a window, and releasing all the feathers out of pillow...Try as we may to retrieve some of the feathers, but we will never get them all back.

Good thing for edit/delete option, hey? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> But even then, someone is bound to see our cruel words before we edit/delete--can't get them all back.

~ad, who is done with her schmarmy philosophy 101 lesson for the evening.

great post <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Yup---anger is a very valid emotion. But it's not a good emotion to nurture---it wears on one's mind and body...

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> ---it wears on one's mind and body...
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">I totally second that statement. I'm living proof of it right now....I believe that my anger is the no. 1 reason for my general maliase right now....I've got no...um....drive to better anything, not me, not the M. IC and I have a plan drawn out to help me get past the anger so I can heal and trust again. Oy! Do we ever have our work cut out for us.

- Kimmy

Speaking of Anger......I have been informed recently that anger is a SECONDARY emotion...that there is usually a root to it that is the underlying issue.......

(Pep, you are the 3rd person I've heard mention that lately <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> )

Does anyone care to elaborate on that for me? I had never heard of that before. It makes sense but I am not much for psycho-babble so if someone could explain it a little better for me I would appreciate it.
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'Letting go' is not one of my strong points but I am really making a conscience effort to do better.

I learned once that the reason for NOT letting go is to use it against the perpetraitor @ a later time. The example they used was stamp collecting. Like each stamp represented an offense perpetrated against you, some people hold onto those stamps & have them neatly arranged in books, then when the appropriate time shows itself (usually in defense of their own bad behavior) they bring out their 'collection' of stamps to the other person. Such as remember when you did this....OR...but you act like this....ect. I think you get the idea.

That analogy was real eye opening to me. It helped me learn to articulate what I needed to be able to 'get over' the offense towards me.

For example in my marriage............if H has done something to upset me or something, I will tell him straight out what the problem was/is & that I would like an apology. Then it is gone. I don't waste anymore time on the issue or being angry. That is how it is for me. I would rather enjoy my time in relationships then spend time being angry or upset. @ least w/ the minor things.
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I struggle w/ issues that have no resolution or apology like offenses directed to me from OW. I think that is the MAIN issue for BW & why it is so hard to 'let go' & why we can still be so angry towards OW for the role she may have played in hurting our marriages.

For me it is no longer THAT issue but rather things that happened AFTER that. (comments directed to my kids) I like the idea of having some kind of ceremony.....even though my first thought is that it's REAL cheesy (no offense star) but I think that might be something that may work.

I think this is my last (or one of the last)roadblock to healing but I am @ a loss as to how to approach/deal w/ it.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

H has tried to tell me this (letting go) numerous times but I just can't seem to get it or understand it or know how......like I'm missing a step or something? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> So I just deal w/ it personally by ignoring 'it' but I know 'it's' still there....inside.

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PS: ad.....thanks...maybe the sooner you go through the fire....makes a difference.

kt,

Basically, secondary emotions are emotions that are caused as a result of OTHER more primary emotions.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> A number of psychologists have classified the emotions we experience by placing them on a wheel. Robert Plutchik believes that emotions have four dimensions:

(1) positive or negative

(2) primary or mixed

(3) polar opposites

(4) varying intensity

Plutchik also believes that emotions are like colors. Every color of the spectrum can be produced by mixing the primary colors. Plutchik's wheel consists of eight primary emotions: fear, surprise, sadness, disgust, anger, anticipation, joy, and acceptance.

In contrast, secondary emotions are produced by combinations of primary emotions that are adjacent on the emotion wheel. For example, Plutchik characterizes love as a combination of joy and acceptance, whereas submission is a combination of acceptance and fear. In Plutchik's scheme, additional emotions can be classified as representing different degrees of intensity of primary and secondary emotions. For instance, fear can range from mild apprehension to blind terror, anger can range from annoyance to rage, and so on.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">check out the whole article and look at Plutnik's wheel here:

http://library.thinkquestafrica.org/TQA00098/overv02.shtml

Alot depends on who is venting and about what. If a betrayed wife is mere days/weeks/months into it, venting is quite healthy. It is her voicing her feelings, hurt, thoughts, etc.

That is why it is so important to CHOSE to shut it off and do for you. That is why I tell people to let their husbands seduce them and romance them and get intimate and close.

I agree that our self talk can be damaging. Look at how many women we have here who are at the hump and not sure how to get over it. While they may appear to be venting and full of anger, it is usually confusion. Or fear. By going over that hump means they have to open up again and try to trust again. THAT is not an easy thing to do.

That is why it is vital to take a day to yourself and totally indulge in what it is you love to do. You have to slowly teach your mind to shut off the thoughts and enjoy. It takes time.

Everyone vents. Everyone gets mad. I think it is far worse to bottle up those feelings and let them fester inside. Shoving things under the rug, etc. This causes people to be pushed around and manipulated all to keep the peace.

I think venting is healthy.....to a point. At some point (in a marriage with an oc, as we are all here for), a strong POJA will help the venting go away and the CHOICE to move on and work at being happy and finding life again. If a person is told to bottle up there feelings and shut up about their needs, and get berated for venting, they end up worse. Most people vent cause something isn't quite right. They don't have all the answers they need, they aren't getting heard etc. If they DO keep venting, after all avenues have been addressed, maybe that person (pertaining to the issue here), is one who can't ever heal from or trust the betrayer and that marriage would end.

Lynn,

You'r quite right that "bottling" feelings is also unhealthy. So if venting isn't good, and bottling isn't good...what's good? LOL Actually, as you suggest...learning productive ways to express anger, reduce anger, come up with solutions that create harmony, refocussing that energy and making it work for you...all that is good. Anger can be energizing and empowering...and I think a far healthier emotion than hopelessness. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Blessings to you and your family.