Ok, normally I don't seek advice, and like to think I'm strong enough to handle my own problems, but dog-goneit I am so frustrated and I'm stuck at work. I wish my my ex(babys father) would just leave me alone for ever. I am through feeling sorry for him. He is a manipulative, evil being. He just showed me once again over the phone that he is not sincere when he says he has changed. He is back to wanting to play childish games and hanging up on me and stuff like that. Ughh so annoying. That's what I get for having a heart towards him.

Lately I have been feeling that he is a flea that won't leave me alone, he is constantly trying to woe me back and when he sees I'm not falling for it he starts getting mean, and later I'm on speaking terms with him because he is crying to me or something like that. We aren't even together anymore and the same crap is still happening. My parents are scared he's going to be playing with our daughters emotions like that further along the line as well <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> . Anyhow here's the thing. I have child support on him but he is 2 months behind already and doesn't seem to be really looking for a job <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> . Take in mind he has never held down a job for more than 6 months. In the agreement it states that there is to be supervised visitation like every other saturday or something but we never follow it and I would just let him come (when he got a ride), but since this month I told him he can't see her until he starts helping me financially. I've always told him he can't just come into her life when ever he pleases. I want him out completely <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> . I know he is no match for me in court because I have kept a journal of all the things he has put me and his daughter through. I even have letters written by him stating his guilt for some abuse he has given me. I also have the proof of when I went to the police because he assaulted me. I believe he is even wanted for an old marijuana case.

Ok I've been rambling, but my question is, if I am awarded sole custody then he can't see his daughter unless it's on my terms correct? I know I can probably look this up online, but the information is often vague and too darn wordy. I also needed to vent.

Can you do no contact with him? P/U and D/O of mija at a neutral setting?

I'm wondering if it becomes too much a hassle if he'd give up.

"but since this month I told him he can't see her until he starts helping me financially." If you follow through with this it could get you into as much trouble as he's in for lack of support. As any attorney will tell you, child support is not tied to visitation. They are considered two separate things by the court systems.

"Ok I've been rambling, but my question is, if I am awarded sole custody then he can't see his daughter unless it's on my terms correct? " Wrong. Unless he agrees to it. If he doesn't then you will have to go before a mediator/judge who normally sets it on a case by case basis. If you can prove that he is completely unfit you may be able to get his visitation rights taken away but that is usually only in extreme circumstances. The courts tend to lean towards supervised visitation first if there is a problem.

Thanks for replying.

Can you do no contact with him? P/U and D/O of mija at a neutral setting?

I was thinking that same thing, that he can see her at my house. (He needs to come see her, not she go to him) but without me there. Since I am temporarily staying with my parents then he can go there, while my mother is there, and I will leave.

Crynsomuch, like I said before he doesn't have a leg to stand on in court (if we ever go) he probably wouldn't even show up. Since he fears he's wanted. I still intend to not let him see her, until he helps me. I don't care about the legality of it all. He's not very smart, and I don't believe in that sharing of the children stuff especially if the father is a dead beat like my ex. I'm there every day, I clean the diapers, and wipe her tears, and pay for daycare. I do all the work, and I will be damned if he's going to reap the benefits of being around my precious angel without helping in her care.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I do all the work, and I will be damned if he's going to reap the benefits of being around my precious angel without helping in her care.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You go girl! You rock!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Since I am temporarily staying with my parents then he can go there, while my mother is there, and I will leave.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">He won't be argumentative or confrontational to your mom, will he? I suppose if the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, that your mom can probably hold her own. He just sounds so...childish.

Oh, have you told the DA about his non payment? The earlier you get them involved, the better it is - they can keep track of his Social so if he does become employed they can come knocking on his door.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> I'm there every day, I clean the diapers, and wipe her tears, and pay for daycare. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">You are awesome! You and mija should go to Dairy Queen tonight just because. Ice cream is fun to bond over!

- Kimmy, who's had an almost obscene craving for a Moolatte.

He won't be argumentative or confrontational to your mom, will he? I suppose if the apple doesn't fall far from the tree, that your mom can probably hold her own. He just sounds so...childish.

No he won't be argumentative with her. I'm pretty sure he will behave. He is a big two face, and a sweet talker. A long time ago when he first met my folks, he had them thinking he was really going to take care of me and he was going to get his life together..Ha! hasn't happened yet. He is very childish. Now I am by no means a phsycologist but I am almost positive he is has borderline split personality disorder. He comes from a very broken home as well. How I ever loved this boy who seems to be from another world from mine is beyond me.

Hmm ice cream, oh no, no more sweets for me, I've been here at my desk snacking on mnm's all day. I think if I have any more sugar I'm going to go into shock lol. When I get home Angelbaby's idea of bonding is taking all her clothes out of her drawers and letting mommy put them back while she runs away, or trying to smack me with her dolls. She just turned 2 and "the terrible two's" are in full swing, and I heard that they don't end after they turn two, that's only when they start.

Terrific twos...it's all in the perception. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I loved two. It's a magical age. Actually they all are magical ages. My oldest just turned 15. He's awesome! I wouldn't trade him in if you dared me to.

8 is nice for girls. They are getting more grown up, but still love mommy's love. That's where my middle is.

5 is charming. I mean it. They all are charmers at 5. My youngest is 5 and the world stops when he smiles.

OY on the clothes. My youngest was a streaker. Get home, all the clothes came off. My middle made it worse by commenting on it - so little dude would do it just to get her goat.

OC #1 just turned two - she, like Angelbaby, loves to redecorate using stuff in drawers or laundry baskets. She also LOVES the plastic container cupboard and it all ends up in the kitchen floor.

OC#2 is only 8 mos. He is a love. You'd think that I was the most interesting person in the world, so rapt is his expression when I talk to him.

But 2 - 2 is magic. She won't be 2 forever - they grow in their sleep, you know?

- Kimmy

Kimmy very very true......they grow in there sleep! I can't believe how fast my little girl is growning. All the new things she is doing and how much fun and precious she is. She is just a doll.

X: I'm not sure if you can hold her back because he is not paying support. I would get the DA involved though. Then get your journal out and start going through it and take him back to court regarding the visiation. Enjoy her little 2 year old things. They do grow up so fast. I can't believe my twins are 6 <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I'm guessing you didn't have ice cream, Angel. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Did you have a nice night?

X: I'm not sure if you can hold her back because he is not paying support. I would get the DA involved though. Then get your journal out and start going through it and take him back to court regarding the visiation. Enjoy her little 2 year old things. They do grow up so fast. I can't believe my twins are 6

Yes, I am going to call the child support office and notify them about the situation, and give them his updated address and phone number.

They do grow up so fast, when she was a baby I felt I could handle her just fine, but now that she is becoming her own person, sometimes I feel like oh geez I do feel awfuly young to be this child's mother lol. I know I've always been wiser than my age and responsible (ok except when I met her father) but often times I feel a little guilt that I'm cooking this little chicken and I'm still a little raw myself ya know. We are learning together I suppose.

I wish I had twins. they must be so much fun.

Hi delean-de, nope no ice cream. I got home and she was napping, so I was able to practice my piano(finally). She woke up soon after though and that was the end of that, we just played, had dinner, watched some tv, and went to bed. Nothing really exciting but hey it's a weekday.

I'd give my left big toe to be able to play the piano! That's neat!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I'd give my left big toe to be able to play the piano! That's neat!

Yeah me too...hence the word "practice" lol

Just kidding. I've been playing for a couple years now, I can usually play a song I hear, but I was never playing the right way, like with my fingers in the correct postions and playing a song correctly from the page adhering to the tempos and stuff. So for the past year I've been taking lessons, and I loved it. I wish my parents would of put me throught them when I was smaller. That's why angelbaby is going to be my little prodigy. I shall live through her lol. Well I want to start her young, and I hope she wants to play.

I still intend to not let him see her, until he helps me. I don't care about the legality of it all. He's not very smart, and I don't believe in that sharing of the children stuff especially if the father is a dead beat like my ex. I'm there every day, I clean the diapers, and wipe her tears, and pay for daycare. I do all the work, and I will be damned if he's going to reap the benefits of being around my precious angel without helping in her care.

Uh??? ok......talk about playing games.

You complain about him playing games & I'm sure you are telling the truth. (sincerely) But now you are doing the same thing.

Don't play these kinds of games. Visitation is not determined by CS--paid or not.

Go to court & do it all legally. IT is the only mature & right way to handle this.

I know you love your daughter & want what is best for her but she is not a bargaining chip to gain some financial support. I understand it is his obligation & all that bla blah blah blah but it still makes what you're doing, the way you're handling it WRONG.

If he is calling to see her---then he wants to right? So he has some feeling for her. Yah, he may be mixed up so you set your boundary, like you stated (visits in your home w/o you). IF he is such a loser then he won't visit long or very consistantly.

I don't know what kind of custody arrangement you currently have but you should go to court & have it LEGALLY changed to fit your daughter's needs. IF that means sole custody by you then fine, you can have stipulations in your agreement that dad must do whatever in order to have visits, like 2 week notice, supervised, @ your home, whatever it is. If he doesn't show up--then fine, you get everything you request by default. IF he does & he argues...that is his right & the judge will decide & according to you, you won't lose anyway.

And yes, your CS should have been set up legally as well. Go through the DA, it is my understanding that they will give you all the help you need, FREE. Doesn't mean you will see any money but he will still be obligated to it by court order. His name will be in a database & whenever he does get a job it will show up to the CS collections & they can then garnish his wages. (@ least that is how it is in my state) And any arrears owed will be taken out of any tax refund he is ever entitiled to recieve as well.

IF he IS such a dead-beat as you say..............then I would get used to budget that does NOT rely on CS. He is obligated but it does not mean that he will actually take responsibility. kwim?

p-nutty m&m's: the meal of choice for kt! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hmm well we all have our opinions. Thanks for the advice Kt.

Don't play these kinds of games. Visitation is not determined by CS--paid or not.
Go to court & do it all legally. IT is the only mature & right way to handle this
I know you love your daughter & want what is best for her but she is not a bargaining chip to gain some financial support. I understand it is his obligation & all that bla blah blah blah but it still makes what you're doing, the way you're handling it WRONG.

Yes I'm sure doing it all legally is the right way, but who says the law is always correct? Apparently it's not all the time or unfit parents wouldn't be able to keep their children whom thay abuse, etc. You see I don't want to play games, I haven't figured out exactly what I'm going to do. I know what I want to do, but sometimes I have a change of heart.

If he is calling to see her---then he wants to right? So he has some feeling for her. Yah, he may be mixed up so you set your boundary, like you stated (visits in your home w/o you). IF he is such a loser then he won't visit long or very consistantly.

I'm sure he loves her in his own way, but so what, he doesn't have to do anything for her and still be able to reap the benefits. Like I stated before. I'm not for that. I also know he doesn't keep his word and plenty times before he's say he's coming and doesn't come. Children need stability. he does not provide that. I don't want him coming into her life whenever he pleases and just leave again. yes I can set boundaries, but he always has an excuse."Oh I don't have a ride" "Oh I'm broke" blah blah.

IF he IS such a dead-beat as you say..............then I would get used to budget that does NOT rely on CS. He is obligated but it does not mean that he will actually take responsibility. kwim?

Believe me I don't need his petty child support. I make enough money to support my child and myself. I don't even care about the money but it's just not fair to us. If he would give up all rights if he didn't have to pay child support than I would take that deal.

Once again, there are laws higher than mankinds. I want what's best for my child and if that means defying these laws then so be it. He wouldn't fight me anyway.

Yes I'm sure doing it all legally is the right way, but who says the law is always correct?

It does not matter. You can't break a law & then just tell a judge, "well, I didn't think it was correct"--they'll laugh you right out of the court into jail. So that arguement won't work. Jsut as men have to deal w/ unfair laws when it comes to their paternal responsibilities.....we all gotta suck it up sometimes. The laws are there for a reason, you can't just pick & choose which ones you want to follow.

BUT...since you KNOW that it will go your way....then do it the right way. Some day your dd's father MAY grow up....& if you have nothing set in place already, then he can do whatever he wants as well & it can turn out in his favor. Because according to the law, he CAN walk back into her life whever he wants/feels like it. But if you have all your bases covered NOW.....then you will be protecting your daughter in whatever way you feel is necessary, for the future.

Apparently it's not all the time or unfit parents wouldn't be able to keep their children whom thay abuse, etc.

That's an interesting statement. I never knew the law to leave children WITH parents that were proven to be abusive or unfit. WHERE do you live? But sometimes there are social workers who makes mistakes. Such as removing children from homes under false pretenses & accusations. PEOPLE make mistakes...that is true.

I'm sure he loves her in his own way, but so what, he doesn't have to do anything for her and still be able to reap the benefits. Like I stated before. I'm not for that. I also know he doesn't keep his word and plenty times before he's say he's coming and doesn't come. Children need stability. he does not provide that. I don't want him coming into her life whenever he pleases and just leave again. yes I can set boundaries, but he always has an excuse."Oh I don't have a ride" "Oh I'm broke" blah blah.

That is exactly why getting a very specefic court order would be beneficial for you & your child.

Believe me I don't need his petty child support. I make enough money to support my child and myself. I don't even care about the money but it's just not fair to us.

How is it NOT fair? If you have everything you need, what is not fair about it? Like you said, you are reaping all the benefits so what about this makes it unfair? YOu put in all the effort & you get all the rewards, where is the unfairness?

I understand it IS the law, I disagree w/ the current standards & laws concerning CS BUT, we still have to follow them. See what I mean? It doens't matter what I THINK about the law, H would go to jail if he did NOT follow the law.

Oh BTW....on another note, are you aware that in MOST states whoever files for CS first, gets the highest %? SO it really is in your best interest to have it on record becuase if this guy is so irresponsible as you say.....then what is to stop him from producing another child & that girl could go to the DA first & then he would only be LEGALLY obligated to support that one & then if you filed after her.....your child would get less.

Once again, there are laws higher than mankinds. I want what's best for my child and if that means defying these laws then so be it. He wouldn't fight me anyway.

LOL But those laws are NOT recognized by the state & have nothign to do w/ CS & custody.
What are you talkign about anyway? I never read anywhere in the Bible that says it's ok to keep a child from their father becuase of how YOU feel about him. I do know that it talks about responsibility. But obviously the man you chose to be your child's father doesn't seem to care about God's laws or personal responsibility so the only enforceable laws are man's (government/state) laws so those are the ones you have to use.

And I'm sure those 'higher laws' that youi are referring to do NOT condone taking advantage of another person just becuase you know that you can get away w/ it.

Doing this legally would simplify your life & your concerns so what other reason would you have to NOT do that? Drama or lack of it? A reason to keep in C w/ him (asking for $$$$, time w/ child ect)? IF you want the madness to stop then do it yourself.

Some people thrive on drama. Not sure if you are one of them but what you are talking about has such a simple solution so it makes me wonder WHY you would not choose it.

And if your goal is for him to leave you alone, & he is how you say he is, then going to court would most likely be the answer. He would probably totally avoid you then & your problems would be solved.

ooo
xxx
kt

I do already have CS on him, that was established a long time ago. I understand about doing things the correct way, but I don't always follow things by the book, sorry if I don't like getting walked all over unlike some people. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

When I say it is unfair, I'm saying he knew what he was doing as did I. He wanted a baby so he should be supporting it whether he gets visitaion or not. I am not judge and jury but I'll deal with myself and my loved ones accordingly. I intend on keeping the CS office updated on the situation, but the process is often slow and not in one's favor, so in that mean time. I will do what I think is best. Sorry for not taking crap from men anymore, <<ok that sounded defensive lol but seriously. I haven't decided what I'm going to do yet. I know he is not happy with the thought of me taking her away from him completely. We had a talk today...he bawled like a baby as sual <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> so I'm not sure. I lectured him and told him my thoughts, but I also felt sorry for him. (He is such a lost soul) so I still am thinking about the situation. It is a learning process, but I feel that it is best that I hurry up for my daughters sake.

I understand about doing things the correct way, but I don't always follow things by the book, sorry if I don't like getting walked all over unlike some people

No one is implying you allow yourself to 'get walked all over'. I don't see how going to court to set up a better, legal & more suited to your wants & needs visitation order is getting 'walked all over'. THIS is precisely the reason TO get it set up legally.

When I say it is unfair, I'm saying he knew what he was doing as did I. He wanted a baby so he should be supporting it whether he gets visitaion or not.

True. And I can see where you continuing to lecture him & have C w/ him is helping to insure that he is properly doing his duty right? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> You are spending all this time arguing, lecturing & whatever else & then you wonder WHY he won't leave YOU alone? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

As well as he has a right to visitation whether he is paying CS or not. Talk about double standard here. I thought you believed in black & whites?

But yet this entire past conversation is ALL about grey---YOUR grey!

Sorry for not taking crap from men anymore,
????? Where did anyone suggest that? Your title to this thread is why won't he leave you alone...and yet....w/ clear instructions on HOW you can accomplish your supposed goal of him leaving you alone & you NOT doing it...you consider it taking crap? So then WHO's choice is that?

uh??? hello out there? You're providing it for yourself. You are continuing the drama instead of doing specefic actions to end it.

I think that people who have children together are linked forever. So YOU will never get him out of your life & I don't really believe that you want to. If you wanted to you would NOT be having ANY C w/ him whatsoever.

I don't think you are truly 'over' him as much as you claim to be. I think deep in your HEART you still HOPE that he will change, grow up & that ultimately you WILL be a happy little family that you dreamed of.

I think your posts on here are just to convince yourself that you are over him. GO ahead keep posting. I like you. But I don't think you are being all that honest w/ us or yourself.

I don't see anything wrong w/ hoping, you know that from my previous posts.

But don't come here asking a question if you either don't really want the answer OR you are just not willing to do what it takes to get the result you claim you want.

I mean if you already KNOW that you can't count on him then why are you spending ANY time lecturing him? It can only be becuase you are HOPING that your words will get through to him & he will CHANGE.

I know he is not happy with the thought of me taking her away from him completely. .... but I also felt sorry for him. (He is such a lost soul)

Yes, he does sound lost. And if he is having any psychological problems that I think you mentioned earlier...then he may not truly be able to provide for her right now, @ this time in his life. NOT that he shouldn't be anyway--just that for him--he truly might not be capable.

And it may be best that he not be so involved in her life until he can get it together. She will be ok. Not the ideal, sure, but she will be 'ok'.


sincerely,
kt

<small>[ December 10, 2004, 06:21 PM: Message edited by: ktbunch ]</small>

????? Where did anyone suggest that? Your title to this thread is why won't he leave you alone...and yet....w/ clear instructions on HOW you can accomplish your supposed goal of him leaving you alone & you NOT doing it...you consider it taking crap? So then WHO's choice is that?

Actually it was more of a vent session, this was my original question:

"Ok I've been rambling, but my question is, if I am awarded sole custody then he can't see his daughter unless it's on my terms correct?"

I got that question answered already.

I don't think you are truly 'over' him as much as you claim to be. I think deep in your HEART you still HOPE that he will change, grow up & that ultimately you WILL be a happy little family that you dreamed of

Actually Dr. Ruth your phsyco-analization assumptions are wrong. I am over him. I have dated, I actually was falling for a guy too, but I decided he wasn't so right for me after all. I am not attracted physically or mentally to my ex anymore.

But...your right about one thing, as much as I hate to admit it, <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> I guess I'm still clinging to the hope that my words will get through to him one day. I know we will never be a happy little family. I don't want him as a husband, I just want him to respect me as his child's mother and as a person. I'm hoping he will still change because yes he is forever linked to us, and if we are stuck with each other, we might as well get along, or not have anything to do with each other at all.

Part of my conversation with him today was the circle we've been going through, the emotional roller coaster. I picked up his phone call because he left a message crying. I felt sorry for him,(yes I have a heart <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> )and I'm trying to get over that because he is manipulative. Like I said I haven't gotten it all figured out.

X, I understand what your saying totally. I also agree with KT about letting him see his child. I don't WANT to see YOU loose your daughter because of this. I have a friend that is actually the bw and her husband has been fighting for joint custody since day one and it's going to trial. The judge flat out said who ever is lying is the one who looses custody. Believe it or not her and I talk and compare our stories all the time and we talk about how I wish she was my bw and how she wished I was her ow. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . I agree that you should not count on the cs and sounds like you really don't need it, but the point is it's YOUR CHILD'S right. Not yours. He should be paying cs by what the legal guide is even if it's a little a month because he is the bio father and helped bring her into this world. Put it in a college fund if you don't need it or save it up monthly and once or twice a year take her someone where fun and special. Just for her. Trust me the older she gets and starts to understand those comericals and sees her friends with these COOL things your going to need to that money to help support the children of today's lifestyle. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

BTW........yes my twins are fun! It's great cause they have each other to play with all the time and help each other etc. They have there moments though. They are two totally different people though and that is very good. They were very easy after they turned 1 month and until they turned 1 year old then the "fun" began. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />