Lost, let her and her husband deal with it. She'll be fine I'm sure and if not, well what in the world can you do to make any of it better by going to the hospital or calling her? It'll just set you off in an emotional tailspin that you're trying to get out of. IMO it's just a ploy to get you to call. Let it be.

Lost do you even know for sure she is pregnant? have you seen test results on paper? it sounds to me like she is just playing head games with you. She is trying to get control back. She feels you sliping away.
Keep doing what your doing. Be strong. Think of your wife and kids. THink about your future with them.
I know that in one post you said that after you have been apart from your kids for 4 days you start to physically ache for them. Well make them your goal. To be back with them on a regular basis.
YOU CAN DO THIS!!!!

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Lost71:
<strong> 10 missed calls, once voicemail (unheard).

As I'm typing this, my boss just called and said OW asked him to call me to tell me she has passed some tissue and is on the way to the hospital.

The guilt and suffering and loss and fear are really overpowering right now. I don't know what to do. How do I not call her back to ask what's going on? How do I not go with her to see what's happened? How do I withstand the blame she's sure to unload on me when I do speak to her next?

This is horrible..... </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">How to avoid her unloading on you when you SPEAK to her next?????!!!!!!! Are you serious?

DON'T speak to her! THAT is how.

Apologize to your boss for dragging him into the middle of this & request that he not relay any messages from OW to you any more.

Get back on track to fwd your emails to flukeboy. CREATE that message RULE in your inbox so that it happens automatically.

Her H can take care of her. LET IT BE OVER.
There WILL be consequences & pain ALL around, OW is NOT the only one here & if there is an OC, they are not the only one either. Every one takes their piece of the hurt & moves ON w/ thier life. This A was a MISTAKE. No need to continue making more.

YOU CAN DO THIS. BE STRONG. THIS will pass. Don't fall into it.

Can't you see how desperate OW became when you strated to stand up for yourself & do the right thing?

***************************
***************************
Pleasant conversation w/ your W? A positive step in the right direction. Remember to be honest w/ her too...........if questions come up initiated BY her.

You are doing well, don't stop now. Hold on & taek it ONE day @ a time.

Press on towards the goal....to win the prize.....

Hang in there buddy.

This A will become a MOMENT in yoru life, NOT the defining moment.

sincerely,
kt

Lost, I have read this thread and see your in a tough spot. You have been given some great advice. You would pay a fortune at any counselor to get this information! I hope you take it. I have noticed a few things, having read this all at once.

1. I think you love your wife, but are ashamed, scared and nervous about what/how to correct this. So you have done nothing. Heck it is hard to face the destruction you created isn't it? But you can do it. So start.

2. Your ow is a lying manipulative shrew. PERIOD. I would be $$$ that she isn't even pregnant. Throwing up blood???? Then calling YOU? Most normal women would be at the ER pronto. What does she do? She calls your boss to get you? Son, you need to speak to that attorney of your wives and get a letter shot off to the ow pronto for harrassment. As for her Doctor, saying her stress is induced from the father of the baby not being around???? Call him on it. There is no way a doctor would talk like that. NO WAY. Her stress would be self induced anyway. No matter what her deal is, it is HER PROBLEM AND NONE OF YOUR CONCERN. Focus on your wife and children, as they are the innocent ones that you have destroyed here. The ow chose to be where she is. Let her deal with it. If/when oc is DNA tested and proven to be yours, then you can decide what you want to do. Her attempts at guilting you are, actually, standard issue behavior. You are NOT saying anything that those on here have not heard/seen/been through. Guess what? Many of the ow were not pregnant, the father was someone else, etc. Don't be so gullable.

Keep reading here. You need to get a grip and get moving. Stand up and take control here. Have a letter sent to ow stating that any contact has to be 100% work related, anything else will be harrassment. Get a laywer to do this for you. Then stick with it.

If you want your family back, fight for them. You caused this, you have to fix it. Be strong and show them by actions what you want.

Call the OW's husband now and tell him you two had an affair. Let her own husband handle her and the baby. QUIT talking to her for good are you nutz man? In fact get her husbands phone number and put a message on your phone saying: Teri (or whatever) please if you have anything to say call your husband and speak to him about it. His number is ____________. And "I talked to him about us" and told him I would have you call him with any concerns!

<small>[ February 23, 2005, 07:55 PM: Message edited by: lifeisstrange ]</small>

So yesterday was a day of failure and some successes. Failure, in that the NC fell apart (my fault -- I let the guilt, fear, and call from the boss instigate me into responding). My boss thought I should call her back to find out what was going on. I did, and of course the guilt was poured on thick. Let's see... "selfish [censored]... I wish I could just walk away from this baby... I know you're trying to get better but sometimes the baby will need you around." (As in, yesterday! She really considers time with her, now, as help for the baby, and threatened full legal war when it's born if I don't support her now. Duh.)

She was very angry that I was not willing to cancel my planned parenting time with my kids last night to be with her. That tells me a lot about her phony sympathy for my relationship with them, a phoniness that in a moment of clarity I saw last summer too, right before I left her.

Based on her constant lying last summer (over six weeks it went something like "I'm pregnant, I miscarried, oh-the-baby's-back, oh-I-miscarried-again, oh-I-have-cancer"), I knew that the ONLY way I'd know what was going on would be to be at the ulrasound. So I went. Amazing how much "better" she seemed to feel once I showed up. Not surprisingly I guess, the baby and OW are both perfectly fine. I drove her home -- where her H was waiting for a package to be delivered, so hopefully they talked -- and told her exactly what I meant by "distance" -- that is, no contact at all. She said OK, good-bye, get better, I love you.

What I'm afraid I've done is left it open ended enough that she thinks NC is "for now." The problem I've had in talking to her both last fall (when the "boundaries" came down) and now is that she filters everything I say and hears what she wants. Even my boss acknowledges this. The only antidote is NC at all. I'm trying to learn that lesson.

I'm considering a letter. The work thing has to get sorted out first. I'm meeting with my boss by the end of the week to come to a conclusion. If he wants me to stay as badly as he says, he'll have to referee all our communication and accomodate some flexible schedules -- letting her work from home on days I'm in the office, while I work offsite when she's in the office. It'll be his call.

Flukeboy read me the riot act yesterday, rightly so. I can't say enough about how much he's done for me, not to mention all the support and advice everyone here has offered.

OK, so maybe it was really a day of failures. But I'm still truckin' and it could have been worse. NC 18 hours.

<small>[ February 24, 2005, 08:02 AM: Message edited by: Lost71 ]</small>

Michele, as you can see I blew it, and I paid an emotional price yesterday, as you rightly predicted. I do think I'm learning though. If nothing else, I'm learning that Flukeboy and others know what I should do better than me sometimes, and if it's me-against-everyone I should just concede. Since I've always made so many bad choices, why on earth would I trust my instincts now? I need to be like George Costanza -- take whatever it is I feel I should do, and do the opposite. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Talking to my wife, such as it was, was nice. I miss her. I thought it was nice that she saved some shows just because she knew I'd probably not seen them. Last night when I dropped off the kids, I asked if she'd given thought to my question about joint counseling. She said she had, and would want to understand my motivation before she could respond. I offered to wait and talk about it after the kids went to bed, and she said she wasn't ready for that. I said OK -- no anger or irritation on either side -- wrote her her support check, and left.

kt, obviously you were dead right about everything in your response. I am learning (1) that in moments of clarity I can predict her behavior as well as all of you can and (2) that I need to just allow myself to be led by people who have better perspective than me, who are outside the fog. I can be taught! -- but I have to be willing to trust that advice with emotional blinders on.

<small>[ February 24, 2005, 09:04 AM: Message edited by: Lost71 ]</small>

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Based on her constant lying last summer (over six weeks it went something like "I'm pregnant, I miscarried, oh-the-baby's-back, oh-I-miscarried-again, oh-I-have-cancer"), I knew that the ONLY way I'd know what was going on would be to be at the ulrasound. So I went. Amazing how much "better" she seemed to feel once I showed up. Not surprisingly I guess, the baby and OW are both perfectly fine. I drove her home -- where her H was waiting for a package to be delivered, so hopefully they talked -- and told her exactly what I meant by "distance" -- that is, no contact at all. She said OK, good-bye, get better, I love you. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">

Please clarify something for me here. You say you went to the ultrasound yesterday? Then, she feels fine? Did she have the ultrasound done with you there? Did you see any evidence of the ultrasound?

You definitely need to compose a NC letter, send it to her, and allow Flukeboy to keep you accountable, and have more who can do so as well! You CAN do this, and your W's response to your question of couples counseling was perfect. You need to honestly and seriously think of your motives for wanting to go to counseling together. Especially since you did it before, and fell right back into OW's arms! Yes, this time apart from your W has been revealing, and I think that you are actually learning who is the one who screwed up here! Keep up your work, and let the OW and her H deal with their own issues and don't worry about the baby UNTIL DNA proves you to be the biofather. Until then, work on your M, and possibly saving it!

I know that I haven't posted to you before now, but I was compelled to do so now! I will keep reading to see how you are doing!

Tigger

Again - Are you 5 million percent sure she's really pg????

Sounds like emotional extortion to me.

Hi tigger, thanks for your response!

Yes, I was at the ultrasound and saw the baby in there, kicking and moving, arms and legs and all. They gave me the picture. This is the third one I've been at with this pregnancy. She is definitely pregnant and due August 27.

Though not perfect, my W is a very wise woman of great character, and her question makes sense to me, too. Especially since I don't have an immediate response besides "we just shouldn't get divorced."

My wife asked what my reasons would be for wanting to pursue joint counseling, and this is what I drafted. </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial"> Well, here are my reasons.

1. I love you, and I miss you, my best friend. There are no words to describe how sorry I am for everything I have put you through and the unimaginable pain you are feeling right now because of what I have done, and I would like the opportunity to help you heal, whatever your ultimate decision may be.
2. I think we should not be divorced, because I think soon I am truly going to be a different person, one to whom you would want to be married. I am realigning everything in my life to become that person, because that's the kind of person I want to be whether we are together or not.
3. Along those lines, with a great deal of time, effort, and help, I have ended all contact with her through some drastic steps.

For those reasons, I believe joint counseling should be pursued at some point. I propose that it follow the methods spelled out on the Marriage Builders site, including starting off with at least one or two phone counseling sessions with Dr. Harley. For my part, I would wish to exactly follow the Marriage Builders approach during this process and beyond.

Though I will of course cooperate with your suit, I no longer intend to file a counter-suit for divorce. When the deadline arrives, we will be married or divorced based on your decision. You absolutely should do what it is you need to do. Myself, I have hope. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Flukeboy thinks I need to hold off a few weeks before sending this, to have a track record of NC without the "carrot" of reconciliation, to show her it's for real and not just saying anything to get her back.

Any input is welcome.

<small>[ February 24, 2005, 10:13 AM: Message edited by: Lost71 ]</small>

I'm in agreement w/FlukeBoy to a certain extent because the last thing your W needs is false promises. The false recoveries are miserable and do nothing but further damage the relationship. So OW's H didn't give a sh*t that you were with her yesterday @ her appt? What's his deal other than the teen porn and $ laundering or whatever SHE has claimed he's done? I'm not trying to defend the OW's H because I know nothing about him, but you do realize that OW's a liar and manipulator and will make her own M sound like it's the worse thing in the world. (I'm sure you've said a few things along those lines to her about your M and it's been proven that it's NOT true <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> )

The great Dr. Phil once said that the only TRUE thing you know about the OP is that they are NOT trustworthy. Think about that one for a minute, Lost, because it's so true. Keep up the good work you're doing.

Because I saw the keystroke capture reports, I do know MOW's H was heavily into barely-legal porn and had definitely blown their money in options and lied about it. And he definitely knew I was with her, because (1) she talked to him on the phone while we were on the way to the hospital and (2) he saw me drop her off. I've indirectly been privy to some of their emails and phone conversations, and he definitely knows everything. I also know he has bruised his kids' arms etc. because I've seen them when they got back from his house, I've heard the nanny express her concerns, and the kids are vocal about how afraid they are of Daddy. His responses to all of this are just... strange. He's very distant, matter-of-fact, and unemotional about it all. He can spend hours discussing the support payments and tax ramifications but has no interest in going to counseling, either IC or JC. He says he is how he is, and that he can't change anything.

What I do know for certain, because she's done it to me first-hand, is that OW has an incredible ability to twist and distort discussions and actions to fit her needs, which is generally to be "the victim" of everything that happens in her life. I know I don't know the whole story of their M, namely what her behavior was like.

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Originally posted by Lost71:
<strong>
What I do know for certain, because she's done it to me first-hand, is that OW has an incredible ability to twist and distort discussions and actions to fit her needs, which is generally to be "the victim" of everything that happens in her life. I know I don't know the whole story of their M, namely what her behavior was like. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Arial">Sorry if I offend other OW's in here, but from my own experience that seems to be common. They are very selfish people, and when caught with their pants down, will start pointing fingers left and right instead of owning their own actions. The whole woe is me syndrome. My H's latest OW didn't have a freakin' leg to stand on when it came to that. She had the world handed to her on a silver platter as a child. She has a faithful husband, a wonderful, high paying job working only 3 days a week, a beautiful home, money to spend whenever she liked, I could go on and on and on. I knew her far too well (we were best friends) so she couldn't even try to pull that crap. Her life was a piece of cake (especially compared to mine). She had an A for selfish reasons only.

It's not yours to worry about, Lost.

I HATE, LOATHE, AND DETEST your calling her MOW. She is just OW. That's all. The M (for my, I'm assuming) is BS. Your possession. Like she belongs to you. YOUR OW. Quit calling her that. She is not YOUR anything. She never was. She belongs to her h and he to her till they sign on their dotted line to end it.

Okay. I had to get that out.

But she is not your worry. That baby is not your worry. REALLY. You and she might have made it, but the decision to carry and birth that child all came down to her. If she looses it, it's because SHE DIDN'T TAKE CARE OF HERSELF - OR IT WASN'T MEANT TO BE ANYWAY. She's a grownup (sort of). Her guilt trips are all for your benifet so she can guilt you into being with her.

QUIT SUCKING UP HER SH*T like it was life giving manna and concentrate on people that are actually living in THIS world (your wife and kids).

Doin' good so far. Quit backtracking. Have Flukeboy help. Shoot! You've got a flotilla of MB angels praying for you boy! That speaks volumes to what you're tryin' to accomplish.

I wish your dw would post! I've SO BTDT - I'm sending her cyperhugs!

- Kimmy

Dealan-de - I think the M is for Married ... Married Other Woman ... but if it is for 'My' ... I'll join you to smack him on the head ... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

My use of "MOW" was definitely meant as "married," not "mine." <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks for the encouragement guys. Things are moving fast on the job front. I'll post more about it as soon as I can.

Oh thank goodness!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

*Fluke yawns, dog ears a page, and closes his copy of "Riot Act".*

Seems like I've read enough of that book for a while. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Lost is definately on-track today. Good stuff. Really good stuff.

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />