We just had a session with Jennifer Harley tonight. For those who are doing recovery on their own, I wish you could all try at least a couple of sessions with her.<BR>We really are making it! All along, through all the emotional turmoil, she told me to just stick to the plan ( we wrote up a plan of how we were going to address each other's top 5 ENs).<P>Then we learned to have feedback sessions to "toot our horn" to each other and tell how we were doing on the plan.<P>This is the first time I have felt so positive about our marriage. I still feel the pain (today another thread about someone who would not forgive multiple PAs triggered me). But it is much more infrequent.<P>And we are learning the skills to have a "perfect" marriage. Yes, I know none of us are perfect, but I'm starting to see the relationship I always wanted, that was just out of reach.<P>And I know that neither of us could ever share with any OP at the deep level we can with each other. For sure, no woman can be to him all that I am. I used to believe that about him. That no other man could even come close to what he and I share. It is really coming back!<P>The affairs were a big mistake, but do not define who he is. I believe he has learned from this and is an even better person than before. I actually am starting to believe my chances of having a man that is FAITHFUL are better with him, despite the betrayal.<P>Why? 1. Because our new marriage is being built much better than the old. and 2. He is one who learns many lessons the hard way but does not make the same mistakes again. I believe him that having experienced the pain he caused me, the OW, never mind his own withdrawal, he will not do this again.<P>Having gained so much, at so great a cost (to him too not just to me), we will live by Harley's four rules and truly care for and love each other. We want to grow old together. I struggled a lot with that one too. (Afraid he might leave or cheat when I'm old or infirm). Funny thing is he had the same fear about me.<P>HGB said I needed to decide. Well, I am in, all the way.<P>------------------<P><P>------------------<BR>Cindy

I wanted to add something I wrote on another thread - it was far from easy getting here, and I am not one of the "strong" people that was at all sure we would make it. (Any who have followed my posts know that, I have been questioning everything.)<P>I tend to be negative, to see the glass as half empty. I DECIDED to live this way, avoid LBs, find out what my h's needs were and meet them, etc. I was very sceptical that it would work.<P>I'll share something that cost me hundreds of dollars. My counselling sessions with Jennifer Harley, I would tell her - it's not working 'cause of the pain I feel, or he's not doing this or that, whine, whine. She would tell me keep working on the plan to meet his needs, it will work.<P>At one point I wanted to end the counselling, I told my h, she is just going to say do the plan, do the plan, like a broken record.<P>BUT IT WORKS. This is an update from a reluctant convert. The passion is coming back, better than ever. Unbelievable!!!<P><P>------------------<BR>Cindy

I was so excited to share my good news with you all, yet I fell off the page without a single reply.<P>I really hope that doesn't mean that no one has read it or that no one cares one way or the other.<P>I know many are still hurting terribly, but I wanted to offer a word of encouragement.

Don't worry Schizzo, people read it. I plan on sending a couple of people to read your post, because you answer several important questions.<P>This will get the attention it deserves.<P>God Bless,<P>JL

Schizzo,<P>Great to hear such positive results!<P>I have a question about meeting each other's 5 top emotional needs. Where yours and his different (as they tend to be)? If sex was one of his top 5 (just a guess ) did you have any problem with willingness to meet that need? <P>My W seems to want to treat sex in a separate category - somehow as a less legitimate need than her need for admiration.<P>Sorry if this is too personal to ask.

Did your H always want to work on the marriage? Most of the problems I see on this sight are based on the fact that the betrayer leaves and doesn't want to work on the marriage. <P>If that was the case, I am curious about the following...<BR>1. How long did it take your H to come back to his senses?<BR>2. What made him want to work on the marriage again?<P><BR>I am still in the stage of trying to figure this all out. Success stories seem to help sometimes.

Yeah Schizzo!!!<P>I think that is wonderful news!!!!!<P>Congrats to you and your DH!!!<P>So what were your first steps in recovering in you could share with us?<P>------------------<BR>Cat<P>catfrommb@yahoo.com

<P>But be patient...it's too soon for the rollercoaster ride to have ended. Your emotions will be in a blender a long time.<P>But you will be fine!<P>------------------<BR>Faith, Hope, Love Remain,<BR>but the greatest of these is Love.<BR>1 Corinthians 13:13

Scizzo,<P>Hey there my good buddy. I am ecstatic at your post and the good place you are right now. How cool. You inspire me and lift up my spirits. <P>Sorry about not replying yesterday. I did read this thread and it made me feel good, I was just in a funk at didn't reply. <P>I know you and H are going to make it and be fine. Like FHL said you're going to be in the blender for a while and have ups and downs, good and bad days. In the meantime bask in the wonderful feelings you are having right now.<P>Love yah bunches. See you on ICQ<P>------------------<BR><B>God bless you and all of us. We are all going to make it, all of us! With God on our side we can't lose. What God has joined together let no man put asunder. <P>Samantha</B>

JL - thank-you for your reply. Your words have always made a lot of sense to me. BTW - how do you send people to a post?<P>2sad - I don't mind you asking. I'm not sure my case is a good indication, but it seems we expressed more love for each other through sex than we were able to any other way for awhile.<P>teddy bear - sorry to hear of your confusion. There are soooo many stages. I was fortunate not to linger in limbo after discovery. He talked about leaving for a month before he confessed.<P>H is a wonderful man who, though obviously could deceive himself and me like anyone else (my story got wiped out, but he had two affairs, each for several months; the 2nd one resulted in him falling for her and wanting to leave), will also make difficult decisions once he sees and believes the truth. He was convinced by a friend that he and OW would not last, that it was a fantasy.<P>But the betrayer deciding to stay is only the first of many steps. I think the big challenge whether it comes early, as in my case, or after a long period, is to rebuild the marriage based on Harley's four rules. Particularly learning new habits to not LB and to really care for each other.<P>Caterpillar - thanks for your kind words. He decided to confess and stay, and I decided that same night to work on it because I wanted the marriage if it could be really good like Jenn said. I had scheduled the session for us, little dreaming what was really going on. He told her first, and she coached him on his confession. She was also available the next morning (Sat) so I could talk to her after I knew.<P>The first steps after that were to exchange questionnaires and start a plan to meet each others ENs. It was very hard as he was in withdrawal, for a long time I did 90% of the work, which seemed totally unfair. But wasn't it all unfair?? I wanted it badly enough to keep going.<P>FHL - thanks, dear. If you are referring to the emotional triggers, I agree. I still can start crying unexpectedly. But we have crossed a threshold in the way we interact. I have to choose not to let the pain get in the way. Jenn also coached us on that - he had to stop himself from thinking about OW, and I about the pain, etc. It was really hard work. Each time thoughts would come, I would find a way to change it to a positive, or think about something else.<P>Samantha - thank-you, my dear friend. I almost feel bad that things are so good for me, while you are in such troubles. But you too will be up again. The Lord does not give us more than we can bear, and He too knows betrayal. For 3 years Jesus poured Himself into His chosen 12. 1 sold him out, and the others ran when he was arrested. No one stood up for Him in His trial. As He died, He even felt forsaken by the Father, for He cried out, "Why have You forsaken me?"<P>I thought a lot about this the morning after I found out about my h's affairs and felt totally devastated. I always thought even a one night fling would be the end. Not in my darkest dreams would I have ever imagined what happened. Not from my darling.<P>But Harley has to be right on this too. My h was vulnerable because his needs weren't being met. I handled it differently; shut down emotionally and focused on my 2 and 4 year old. I don't excuse him, but it helps to gain some understanding, and I forgive him.

schizzo<P>I'm so glad you brought this to the top right now. I really needed to see it.<P>when I sign on I usually read the top posts and sometimes get so wrapped up in them that I don't make it down the list to all the posts. <P>This is one that I missed. I'm sorry now that I missed it. It carries a great message.<P>I hope I can write my success story soon.<P>Keo<P>PS sorry about the "trigger". it was me who wrote that (there's more to it but I won't go into it here)<P>

Schizzo,<P>I'm totally with you here. Keep doing the plan, keep doing 90% or more of all the work, don't love bust, meet all the emotional needs they will allow -- in time this will work. I'm experiencing that right now.<P>Like you, after nearly four months of my wife telling me she was definitely going to leave me, at the top of her lungs and with such force, anger, and permanance that even I thought it would really happen - she told me just this weekend that she was sorry, that she wasn't going anywhere, that we are going forward and a couple, as husband and wife, and that we will start counseling again just to discover how to better meet each of our needs. Even she admits that this will sometimes hurt her heart as she goes through withdrawals, but like you've indicated, this is a far cry from "I'm leaving you no matter what, get used to that".<P>Putting a marriage back togther after such insanity and intoxication takes at least one party to give in to God, time, patience, and doing everything possible to get the wayward spouse to the other side of this horror such that they can once again see the light and re-commit to the marriage. And that in and of itself is indeed the hard part. Just look at these threads - in many cases it is us, the betrayed that does the love busting or falling out of love, or just plain giving up. We have to be strong beyond even our own beliefs - and unfortunately that is really hard to do. <P>Still, it is true that most marriages survive affairs and become stronger than ever. <P>I'm so happy for you Schizzo, and will continue to follow and learn from your recovery experiences. I'm sure my ride is not over either, but hopefully is just got a lot less bumpy as we move forward.<P>SamH

I had a chance to connect at the Admirals Club while waiting for a flight, and I came here first.<P>Keo- thanks for your reply. One of the risks of hanging around in MB is that there are many triggers, but I'm still here 'cause it has done me a lot of good. It was the term multiple PAs that hit me hard that day, but he went from one to another before I knew anything. Now that we are making new vows based on Harley's four rules, I would end it if he cheated on me again.<P>SamH - I've been following your posts. Glad to hear things are looking up. Yes, it takes one person to look to God for strength and reach out to the other even if they are getting crap in return.<P>I rebelled very strongly at the idea of me being the one to start treating him like a king while I felt neglected. But I realized God had already prepared me for this one-sided love. My wonderful boy (now 5) was the most difficult, unaffectionate baby I've ever known. I felt like I gave and gave and got so little back. But now he is sooo special. And I realized I could love my h one sidedly (not indefinitely) as I had my son.<P>I'm not sure what you said that most marriages survive affairs. But they can with a group like the folk here at MB, and they do become much better.