Can all of you betrayer out there let us know what you felt like when you were having your affair? How did you feel about yourself? How has your life changed?<P>Is it true "What goes around comes around"?

Missy9:<P>You can go back and read some of my old posts to learn more about my situation.<P>Even before my affair turned physical, I knew that what I was doing was wrong. I knew that it was wrong to have such a strong emotional bond to another man besides my husband, but that didn't stop me. I was so lonely and vulnerable that I just kept on keeping on. In spite of the fact that I knew that what I was doing was wrong, there was still this twinge of excitement. I felt like a school girl waiting for this "great guy" to call me or to e-mail me, etc. <P>I felt interested and interesting. I felt attractive on the outside and ugly on the inside. I felt wonderful. I felt horrible. I felt excited. I felt exciting. There were days that I felt guiltless, but there were more days where I felt the full impact of my guilt. I felt happy, but there were more days where I felt sad. I felt confused and like I was in a "fog" most of the time. I felt sneaky. I felt like a liar. I felt heartbroken. I felt dirty. I felt loved by the other man and unloved by my husband. <P>I look back now, and that whole time period was a blur...it was such a fantasy realm. I was so confused. <P>For the new people here...I haven't said any of this to hurt those of you who have been betrayed. The "oldtimers" here know my heart...they know that I'm sorry for what I did...they've seen my journey and they've seen my pain and my remorse.<P>I hope this helps. I will honestly answer any questions that you have for me.<P>Jill

Thanks Jill:<BR>I have read some of your post before and I do think you might be able to help me tremendously understand what it is my h is feeling. My story is such a long one that I can't go into the whole thing now but my h affair was with someone he worked with. she was in an unhappy marriage and she leaned on my h for support. He started to feel bad for her and then started to question his own happiness in his marriage. Things that never bothered him in the past suddenly did. This ow started to come on to my h in the worst way. She dresses so provacatively at work. She was even sent home from school because of her dress. She once chapperoned her daughters class trip in her bikini. She always talked dirty to my h and promised him the wildest sex of his life. She no longer works with him now because of all of this.<P>Soon he gave in to her. I found out about this back in 6/99. At that time my h and I sought counseling and he agreed to cut all contact with ow. I honestly felt like he never felt true remorse for what he did. he was just going thru the motion and lied the whole time . <BR> <BR>OW did not take this to well and she started to harass me, my h and my family non stop. She even showed up at my place of employment and created a huge scene. That day my h went to police to file an order of protection against her. He was truly scared of her at that time. <P>5 months later, he hears thru the grapevine that ow has begun to start dating other men and got breast implants. Well, you guess it, he secretly started to see her again. <P>I overhear a phone conversation on 1/2/2000 revealing the fact that my h was seeing her again. I was destroyed. I can not begin to tell you the pain I felt and still feel today. I told him to leave and I contacted a lawyer within a week to file for divorce. He immediately moved in with ow and her 3 teenage kids. ( she divorced her h just last year). I am so disgusted that he would even move in with her and she lives within miles of us. What kind of man could do that? <P>My h has changed from this wonderful man that made me so incredibly happy that I truly felt blessed to have been so lucky to be married to him to someone I no longer know. Mind you we have been married 12 years and together 19 years total. Everyone who knows us is in shock because we were known as the ideal couple. <P>I know affairs happen because something is missing emotionally. But, and my counselor agrees with me, in this case I really can not think of one thing my h was missing or not getting at home. I believe it is a case of sexual addiction. My h even addimited in counseling that he thought of this woman as a porn star. He all of a sudden is in to masturbation and pornography as well. He was never like that in the past. At least not to that extent. She got him hooked on all of that stuff.<P>Now a days I try not to see him or talk to him unless I have to for the kids sake. But, after all he has put me through, I still love him. I honestly believe he is so addicted to her and sex that he just can't help himself. I am truly afraid for his future. <P>Do you think he is to far gone in all of this? Can he still get the help he needs? I also think that he will stay with her and be miserable instead of admitting to me and his family and friends that he made a mistake. He wants to justify what he is doing and he'll fight like hell to not look worse than he already does.<P>What do you think? Sorry for such a long post. I left out many things believe it or not.

I really do not need to go into all we have been through, But, I as the betrayer can and will DITTO everything Jill went andis going through. <P>Jill,<BR>I read your post of.. It all started so innocently...<P>I have been where you have been, i felt so much the same way. <P>I hate the way I feel, although, I did tell my H. I had to. I felt like such a liar, Icouldn't stand to look myself in the mirror anymore.<P>I am 3 weeks exactly since the NO contact rule has been established. and today, i feel like hell. It is a big bump in the road but i am going to get over this.<P>Mercy

Missy:<P>I believe that with God, ALL things are possible. I know that your heart is broken right now. I know that right now, you feel like there no hope, but there's ALWAYS hope. I am sorry for your pain.<P>In your post, you mentioned that you feel like you are married to someone you hardly know. You're right: You don't know him right now. He is doing things that are out of character. He is being irrational. You are also correct in saying that he will probably stay with this other woman instead of admitting that he made a mistake. When I was having my affair, I was in a fantasy land. I look back and I'm humiliated at how irrational I was...I was completely incapable of making decisions. That's how your husband is right now. He's so caught up in the fantasy that he can't see reality. He can't see the reality of the pain that he's caused you or your children. He can't see that he has basically moved in with a NUT (you mentioned that this woman had threatened your husband and you at some point). Your husband is so caught up in the fantasy of sleeping with a "porn star" that he can't hear your cries of pain right now. For your husband to think clearly, he is going to have to get away from HER. He is addicted to the fantasy of HER, that's for sure. He is possibly addicted to sex and pornography.<P>I hate to say this, but your husband has to be the one to realize that what he is doing is irrational and wrong. You have to be the one to continue to do the right thing and pray that his eyes and heart will be open to the horror that he is causing you and your children. If he is still at the place that he is trying to justify his decision to cheat on you and move in with some semi-crazy "porn star" woman, then he's not ready to be the husband that you deserve. HE has to see his mistakes and HE has to see that he loves you and your children. HE has to see that he needs help.<P>It is my prayer that your husband will come to understand what a precious treasure he has in you and in your children. It is also my prayer that reality will bite your husband sooner as opposed to later...<P>It didn't take long for me to understand what a treasure I have in my husband (even though we DO have our bad days) and that I would be stupid to throw him away. <P>I know that you are in an amazing amount of pain...I know that you are shocked beyond belief.<P>There are counselors that specialize in helping those who suffer from sexual addictions. Someone listed some web sites on a thread here recently...<P>I hope this helps in some small way...<P>Jill<P>P.S. Mercy, hang in there. I know things seem tough right now, but it will get better...there's nowhere to go but up, right? <P>

Hi missy9<P>I'm new around here but hope I can help?<P>I have been on both sides of this affair thing, It's not something I am proud of and at the moment I'm pretty mixed up, but I too have been through the devastation of coping with my spouses affair, asking myself questions such as.. why did she do this?.. What did she do with him?... what did she feel for him?... what did she feel for me?... the questions go on and on... I struggled through these questions found the answers, at least partly and moved forward. But…. then somehow I got involved with my own affair (please take a look at my post "Please can anyone help me understand myself?”) suddenly I could see the power of an affair, things I just couldn’t understand before were happening to me! I felt excited, alive, wanted, attractive, sexy, my heart would pound so I could hear my own heart beat….. but……. After each time we met I would feel guilty, sad, sick, unhappy and confused.. Looking back now it was just one big fantasy, one that I now regret ever getting involved with, but one thing I can say is that I now understand affairs from both sides and I wouldn’t recommend either side to anyone.<P>Take care<P>Brainfart<BR>

Hi Missy...<P>You ask about what is going on in the mind of a betrayer....let me offer this insight.<P>First of all...ending up in it is like that "slippery slope" that you hear about. For one reason or another, I got to close to the edge and began sliding. There is a certain sense of euphoria and excitement that "knocks the edge" of the danger of what is happening. <P>For me...being involved with this EA(along with a brief physical encounter) was like being in this cave that provided the most incredible sense of pleasure, warmth, comfort,...feelings that certainly can be fleeting, but certainly addictive. <P>There are times when you would feel pangs of guilt...sort of like coming out of the cave "into the light" (of reality) and that can be so brutally painful, that your reaction is to run back into the cave. It becomes a hopeless cycle...seems like the deeper you fall, the more often you want to retreat to the cave. It becomes the only comforting place you can find.<P>Not sure if this makes anysense....but it describes where I have been.

When people say "what goes around comes around" I have to wonder. I've lived long enough to recognize that sometimes bad things happen to good people, and wonderful things happen to bad people. <P>I have been both betrayed (first marriage and second marriage) and betrayer (second marriage). What have I learned? Consequences are relative. There are many people who find a way to turn terrible circumstances (whether they brought it on themselves or not) into something good. <BR> <BR>I have the same reaction when both sides on a football team pray to God for victory. Is the winning team blessed by God? Is God pissed at the losing team? It all depends on your perspective.

Thanks for all your replies. They were helpful but I would still like to hear about what happened to make you open your eyes? There was one post out there that say 9 out of every 10 affair will end. I want to believe that and hope my h will be one of the 9. <P>But, how do I stop myself from obsessing over this? Why do I keep hoping this will end. I think I am losing my mind for hoping to regain a future with this man. I don't believe I can ever trust him again. <P>This is the 3rd time he has cheated with the same woman. When does one say enough is enough? Do you think its possible for a man to get over this addiction and have a life with the woman he married? How long does it take for this addiction to end? I thought once he moved in with her, it would speed things up. <P>I even went to a well know psychic a month ago and he said this woman is the devil. He said my h is going to get the help he needs and i am gonna love what I see and he will come back to me. <P>Does anyone have any advice on how I should treat my h when I do speak to him? Is it best to just plan b him at this point since he is living with ow. This weekend is my wedding anniversary and it is going to be very tough for me to get thru. Any advice? <P>

Are any of you betrayers out there today? Please read my post and give my any thoughts you can.

Dear missy9, I am also tempted to look for a psychic, buthave resisted. Desperation drives us to look for an absolute answer. Use the money instead to do something nice for yourself - a facial & waxing (my personal favorite) or a manicure pedicure. And don't confide in the operator! She may be a gossip or a friend of the OW.<P>

Missy9<P>As a betrayer to answer your question is really difficult since each situation is different.If you go back and read your other post "Average length of affair" I posted what it felt gave a pretty good description of what goes on in the mind of a betrayer and also how it ended.<P>It seems that you are so desperate in getting in the mind of your H and it is vertually impossible to totally get into another persons mind.<P>Most affairs do end on it's own once the spark dies. I feel your frustration and I'm so sorry that your having to go through this. Beiieve me it's terrible on both sides being the betrayer is like a double edged sword. It's like a rollercoaster ride that never ends. <P>It truly is a fantasy, but the betrayer is so blind that they can't see through it. When you do finally wake up and realize what you are doing, it's almost mortifying to look back an see what a different person you became. Trust me I am still dealing with issues.<P>I hope that I gave you a little more insight of the betrayers point of view.<P>Keep us posted and Take Care!<P>Reina

<p>[This message has been edited by felix18 (edited April 22, 2000).]

I am not a betrayer or a betrayed, but, because no one yet has addressed your question of "to Plan B or not to Plan B?", I felt the need to speak up.<P> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by missy9:<BR><B>Does anyone have any advice on how I should treat my h when I do speak to him? Is it best to just plan b him at this point since he is living with ow. This weekend is my wedding anniversary and it is going to be very tough for me to get thru. Any advice? <BR></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>I heard Dr. Harley say during his radio broadcast that it is hard to stay in Plan A for very long. It sounds like you have tried to work through this with your H several times, and, yes, now there is an additional layer of complexity - he is living with her. <P>I feel that Plan B is a good idea at this point in time. Dr. Harley had gone on to say that if you try to Plan A for too long you could end up no longer loving him, and not want your husband when he is ready to come back. Dr. Harley suggests Plan B not as a way to get back at your spouse, but as a way to protect your feelings so that your ability to love your H is preserved for a time when he might return. At worst, it starts your process of healing and moving on if he never comes to his senses and leaves this OW.<P>I wish you the best. May you have strength during this difficult time! God bless…<P><p>[This message has been edited by felix18 (edited April 22, 2000).]

These replies from the Betrayers are so great that I am printing them out and I will let my wife read it. Who knows, may be this will wake her up to what the reality really is. <P>JEC<BR>

missy, when I was involved in my affair, I felt the mix between elation and despair most of the time, until the time came when I only felt real depression. The guilt really eats away at you until you feel pretty much worthless (unfortunately it took some time for me to get to that point). It starts with someone giving you undivided attention and this really is a very selfish cycle, you keep on going back because you feel as if you are really admired and of course there are none of those little everyday things to mar the relationship. What I felt about myself? I felt like I was cherished and then I realized that I was just being used. I felt I was "in love" with the OM for a time, but just before I ended it, I felt so worthless. It took a very long time to regain my self esteem and I still have issues I'm dealing with now. How has this changed my life? I can look at it in several ways. I can look at the mainly negative aspect and say it killed my esteem, it drove a horrible wedge between my husband and I that took years to recover from and still are dealing with these remnants. I feel as if it were one thing that I would take back given the chance. But also it forced some issues to the surface that may not have been raised if it hadn't happened. It's taken years to get to the point of liking myself again, and still there are reminders. It's the most traumatic thing that's happened to me, bar none. And I caused it myself, but I have learned so much and have grown from it, if there can be anything positive said. <P>And you're last question, is it true what comes around goes around. In my case, 100% true. My husband had a brief affair after mine and I then realized how horrible that pain really is. It can tear a person in two. Hope this answers your questions.

Thanks so much to all who answered me. In some strange way, it made me feel better. Yesterday was my wedding anniversary and deep down I was hoping that my h in some way would have acknowledged it. But, he never did. That made me so sad. I can only hope that the reason he didn't was the guilt he was feeling.

I also am the betrayer, I felt alot like Jill, it was exciting, I felt like he was giving me what my husband wasnt. The really bad think about this is that I knew this OM longer than I knew my H. I thought that all of the things that the OM was telling me was true, since I have known him for so long and he knew how I had felt about him. After I told my H about the affair, I also found out what a jerk the OM was. I am now totally dedicated into working on my marriage. Now that I look back at what I had done to my H and to my family, I fell really stupid and selfish. I have never done this before and I am not sure how to make this all better. Can anyone give me some advise?<P>------------------<BR>If you dont have God in your life, you dont have a life at all.

I felt like I was living a double life. In some respects I felt like I was 17 and in love again...I was happy and giddy and positive about everything. I also behaved like a 17 year old, not taking seriousely my responsibilities. I was resentful toward my H. There were times when I thought myself so in love with the OM, I would think about leaving my current life and risking it all to be with him. This thought would scare me because, logically I knew it never could be. So, after a few months of being on this emotional high, guilt and remorse started seeping in. The OM was married too and I wanted to know how deep this was for him. When my H discovered the EA I actually felt better. I had been living a double life and though it was exciting at first, the stress of it was exhausting. I have always been an honest person; I did not like myself now. I was lying and sneaking out to make phone calls and countless other little things to be in contact with this OP. <P>I am now in the process of getting a divorce. Has my life changed? You bet and not at all for the good. The OM and I are not together, I am still fighting intense withdrawl and trying to cope with that. I do know that the EA made me see what was lacking in my life. I don't recommend my methods of learning this way, but for the first time in my life I stood up to my H. He is at least trying to change his abusive treatment in general. I know that I may have to quit a job I love and do well becausse I can't afford to keep it and raise two kids on my salary. I have no idea what the future holds for me. I am terrified. So, yes, the five months I was engaged in an EA changed my life completely.

Missy:<P>You asked when my eyes were opened to what I was doing, and you also asked how my life has changed since the end of my affair.<P>Well, my eyes were opened to who the OM really was during the weekend of our physical affair. He was sloppy and had no manners. He had no ambition. He was lazy. He was not a person who was in control of his life. He was very "shaky" in his thoughts and beliefs about God. He left his wife and two daughters because he said that he felt "trapped". I began to "pick him apart" and I'm glad that I did. My eyes were really opened when his wife phoned our hotel room. I thought, "What in the HECK am I doing here with this man? He left his wife and children...he is fleeing his responsibility in life to come here and have a weekend with me...have I LOST MY MIND? I have a beautiful, wonderful man at home and I'm here with this complete idiot..." When my fantasy world crumbled, it crumbled QUICKLY...thank goodness.<P>How has my life changed? I don't take lightly my relationship with my husband. Now, I completely understand how truly blessed I am to have my husband in my life. I also understand that I married my husband for a reason...there was something that I saw in him long ago that made me want to spend my life with him.<P>I also now realize that ANYONE can be vulnerable to having an affair. I have loved God for many years...I have had a daily prayer time and devotional time for many years. I married a Christian man. I come from a Christian family. I KNEW BETTER, yet, I betrayed my God, my husband, my family and myself. Why? Selfishness...instant gratification...I wasn't willing to work on my marriage at that time...I wanted to "feel better" immediately. <P>Missy, I really do wish you the very best. Let me know how I can help...<P>Jill