Hello all, and Sheba, I have not posted to MB since last September. My "H" said that we could be traced through these postings and he did not want anyone to "know". A lot has happened in the past 8 months.<P>We tried MC with two different counselors but after 2-4 visits with each he either did not like them or convinced the last one that we did not need to come as frequently. We had to take our oldest to the counselor recently and that was ok at first because it was for her but when the counselor started family meetings with us, then the complaints started.<P>Basic scenerio this is the 6th time he has moved out(this time at my request) since April 1999 after I discovered affair with a co-worker. Affair ended at that time. However also discovered he has a large predilection for hard core bondage porn at the time. I did not realize the significance of this until the second MC told me that this can be a precursor to violence. I found a program called Spector that videos all computer activity. About every 6 -8 weeks he would go back to it. <P>Before he moved back the last time, he told me all he needed was my trust. We have 20 years together and most of the first 18 were good to very good. I gave him my trust, I turned off spector. I felt good about him about us. The kids were doing much better. about 4 weeks later I picked up our e-mail and a girl he had approached in a bondage porn room was emailing him to finish. Several e-mails, she found him, she found where we lived, she described one of our daughters. I was numb, he swears she was stalking him (He is a Cop) He wanted to know what I was going to do. <P>I asked him if I should give 18 good years over the 2 bad years. I reminded him of his request for trust before he moved back in in February. He said he did not want to lose me and that he was sorry that he had broken the trust again and that he felt terrible after he had gone back in that site again but that he gets lonely and bored when he is home alone. He told me to turn Spector back on the computer, then he knew that he would not be tempted to go back there, so I did. No problem, I did but I resented the watchdog feeling it gave me too, so I only check it once in a while. <P>Things appeared ok but there was still some tension. Because of the shift work we often are on different schedules, I would call him 2 or 3 times during the day if he was home and talk to him. I liked hearing his voice, just talking about trivial stuff. Two weeks ago he told me that I called to often and that I only called to check up on him. I can honestly say that on a few occasions yes he was right, I did but hearing his voice set me at ease and it would fade, but the other calls were pure me wanting to talk to my love. I told him this but said ok, I won't call, you call me at work.<P>A couple days later he said I bother him to much at work???? I only page once a night shift and normally with reason. We set up a code long ago for an emergency call or just when you have time. Then one day last week he called me at work and said "you paged me?" I said "no, I did not" He said "you put in the house # instead of your work #" I said "that is (our Daughter) she must want to tell you about her report card" (She recieved one of the best reports in years and she was very excited)<P>But it was my fault, then last Wednesday he just plain told a lie, in relativity it was small yet significant. I bother him, he wants his privacy. It hurt my feelings, cut pretty deep. Initially we argued but I backed up and asked if we could relax about it and have a marital meeting on Saturday, the next time we had some time together. He said ok. Things cooled down, then events neither of us had control over moved our meeting to Sunday. Sunday he woke up in a disgruntled mood, decided to go have breakfast first, then he remembered something, so it kept getting put off until sunday night, when he rolled over in bed to go to sleep, no good night, no nothing.<P>Yep, sorry MB I blew, initially I just asked if he was going to bed for the night and he said well I did not get my nap today. I said well, could you say good night, a kiss anything?? He said well can I have a kiss good night now! Yes, ok fire works and then a calm came over me, I could look in his eyes and see nothing there, no emotion, no me, nothing, I need peace. I realized that I was beginning to turn into what he had started to tell the OW that I was a year before. I like me, I am down to earth, I love to laugh, I don't expect more out of other people than I do myself. Yes I would like more money but my life has been happier when I had less! He wants a Motorcycle, a boat, my only wish is to fix the floors in the house and I wish I had better vision, but my priority is to have a happy family. My 2 daughters and I will be a happy family, I do not know what the future holds.<P>I will tell you all that I miss and will always love the old "H", with my whole heart and soul (20 years) but I do not miss the current occupant. <P>This is probably a bit garbled, and opinions are welcome. Hello to all of you who tried to help me last summer, well we almost made it. <P>God Bless All of you, All of us, he is still carrying me.<P> <P>

Hi Lila -<P>I have thought of you so often...am so glad to see you post!!!<P>BIG HUGS for you, my friend!!<P>I am on my way back to work, but will come back later tonight. Clarify something for me cuz my old brain is a bit squishy lately....is is out of the house now? Have you confirmed another OW factor? <P>I will talk with you later....<P>Have Faith and here're some more BIG HUGS!!!<P>Sheba

Hi Sheba, so nice to hear from you, I am so sorry I dissappeared last September but I had to try and it seemed to help him relax.<P>Yes he is out of house now, he is living with friends of his who think I should be institutionalized but I am not supposed to know where he is living. The OW was confirmed last April 1999, that was undeniable and we have even spoken to each via e-mail or phone on a few occasions. <P>HUGS to you too Sheba!<p>[This message has been edited by lila140 (edited May 10, 2000).]

Just re-read your question, this last woman, I sincerely believe, was only over the internet and a one site stand, excuse the pun. He said he was bored and he thought it was hilarious that these woman would get off on him just because he talked dirty to them. If he thought about it, she was probably laughing too, thinking he was getting off on it.<P>How are you doing Sheba, I have read a few of your threads, especially the last one, can't believe he thinks you will always be his wife!<P>Well, my daughters bird died today and she is feeling bad, that on top of this, so I need to go give her some hugs. <P>Stay Safe, lots of hugs to everyone<P>

Hi Lila -<P>Ok, I know that the OW coworker was the April discovery.....what about this bondage room girl thing? <P>With his recent attitude changes (yet again UGH!!!) do you think that he is getting too close to this type of woman connection? <P>Have you looked at that Spector to see what he has been up to since this change in behavior? <P>He is definitely an avoider....no counselor, no talking, etc.....<P>So, by saying you blew it, you mean that you told him to go if he didn't face what you two needed to do and talk....right?<P>You know that he is in major confusion still....it never stopped from before really because he has not faced anything and dealt with it yet. WHAT we need to think on is how to do this "go-around" in such a way that he HAS TO face what his problems are. <P>How about you - are you currently in counseling? How's your strength and self-esteem? You sound pretty good to me!!!! <P>Have you ever talked with Steve? Perhaps he can give you an edge on how to formulate a plan.....<P>I know that you can Plan A and I think that it definitely works...that's why you got as far as you did with him. He just has some personal issues that are deep and without counseling (and GOOD counseling!!) he won't be able to completely recommit.<P>Perhaps, like mine.....this is a long process to achieve growth and self-awareness for himself. It may take a lot of factors to get him to start to help himself. Can you continue to Plan A even while separated? It is actually a lot easier and with your D you will have more contact than I am able.....<P>What are your thoughts?<P>BIG HUGS,<P>Sheba<BR>

You posted as I did!!!!<P>Yes, my H is still a nutcase!!!!<P>He is not nice right now , I Broke my <BR>toe and he is in avoidance - can't handle it if I might NEED him for something!! It's actually kind of funny now that I know just why he acts the way he does!!!<P>

Good Morning Sheba,<P>He definitely is in avoidance, he pays lip service to the words because it sounds good but he does not really mean it. His normal words are: "of Course, it's all my fault."<P>I was in counseling and still take my daughters in, the counselor told me to call if I needed him. So far I am doing pretty good. H and I have no contact, the girls are 13 and 16, so when he calls I let them talk to him. <P>I go to the gym and work out, bicycle ride, I work full time. Self esteem is better now than last summer. I actually look very good for my age and I know that I have tried, however I can not excuse this "habit" he has or lies. I learned that he was setting up an efficiency before we even had a disagreement, he thought he could get one for a bout $300 amonth. So he was planning on leaving when he got paid, I just up'd the calendar when I asked him to leave.<P>Trying to talk with him is like being in a courtroom. Even the counselor saw that on our last visit with the girls and told him that Cops fell into that all the time.<P>I don't want to give up but after the repeat cycles every other month for the past year I need peace in my life. Peace of mind. Friends of his have told him that they think I am nice, he told them that they should live with me for 3 years and then see what they think. Well he was here for 20 years. My point being is I am going to lose me in this and I don't want to do that. He has to find himself and right now at least it is not with me.<P>Well, God Bless everyone and Stay Safe

Sheba,<BR>I am catching 1 question at a time in here, I tried to e-mail Steve Harley once last summer however it was returned because he was overloaded at the time. <P>How would I contact him?<P>Lots of Hugs, Stay Safe<P>Lila

Hi Lila -<P>Sorry it took so long to get back here.<P>The phone # is 1-888-639-1639 to schedule an appointment with Steve Harley.<P>For more info....click on Counsel under the MB logo at the top of a page....<P>Then click on Scheduling and it will give you instructions.<P>I think it would be great for you to get some insight from Steve....let me know what he says, especially if there's anything specific about cops!!! I could sure use some input with mine!!!<P>I know what you are saying about what it is you need for you and the girls. Sometimes it is best to separate and remove all the built up tension and anxious way of life.<P>As far as the lying, blaming and "court voice" thing......just keep in mind that he has issues and will only get back to "normal" when he has dealt with them. Nothing you have done keeps him in this mess!!! <P>I was thinking....have you ever written him to express your concerns, etc. Since you say that it always turns into something else when a face-to-face starts, this might be a good route to take. He can't redirect a letter!!!!<P>BIG HUGS,<P>Sheba

Sheba,<P>I am going to the counselor today for myself and my daughters are going next week. I have written him in the past, however, he claims that they are only designed to throw the past in his face. I was questioning the repeat performances. I recently saw a news cast about Bipolar Disorder, which my "H" had mentioned the name of many months back when he found me looking up mental illnesses.<P>I don't remember what stopped me from looking further then, however, this time I actually looked it up. It gives me chills on how much fits. But then I realize I am grasping at straws again. What ever is going through him, he has to make the move towards help. <P>I can only help myself now and my daughters. There is still seperation of brain and heart here. My heart cry's and wants him with me, the nights are long and lonely but my brain says I do not deserve to be lied to, I deserve to be treated better and if I can't have that then I can have peace, peace of mind. <P>I am no angel, I have a temper but I have tried and tried. I forgave and meant it, I needed healing time too, I am human but when trust is continually broken every other month well he either just does not want to be there or he is calling out for help and then fighting the help off. Is it a subconcious way of getting punishment?? I want to love and be loved not punish. I started to become the warden, the punisher, no more. I want to be me!!!! Happy, Laughing, Caring and Care free and one day hopefully soon, I will be agian! Ok, I am tearing up now I still remember good times, part of me says not to give up but I can only fix what is mine to fix and that is me!<P>Do I make sense?<P>If my "H" decides that he wants to be here, then he will have to show me in actions now, not just words. <P>God Bless all of you and Stay Safe! I say a prayer for all of us each night.<P>Lila<P>

When does it all pass!! I started out the day feeling kind of blue but then I really applied myself to my work and started feeling better. I actually had formed an outline that I could have the divorce done and over with by the end of June, transfer my job and move back to my family and friends by the end of July. Still take a small vacation with my girls.<P>I went to the counselor's office, actually feeling good for the first time in weeks! I told him how I wanted off the Merry-go-round and by the time we got through, I ended up in tears. He wants to call "H" and he wanted to know what my decision was. I told him it's over, he won't come back. again he says so what is your decision. Damn! My heart and my brain are running in two different directions!! Finally I said I don't want to be a quitter!! but I will not get back on the Merry-Go-Round, I will not live that way, I am not a Warden or jailer! If he wants me then he is going to have to invite me back into his life and he is going to have to ask for the help he needs, I can only fix what is mine to fix and that is me! AND you can tell him that I am not MY MOTHER!!<P>(which is another story all together but holds a lot of meaning) <P>PS!! can you believe I checked our email when I got home and the March Porn Girl actually emailed again!! She heard he is getting a divorce and was so excited!! I replied back to her with a CC to his email account where she could reach him and Good Luck!!<P>Anyways, I feel better right now after writing this out, well at least until I try to go to sleep. <P>God Bless you all, Stay Safe, and I will say a prayer for all of us.<P>Lila <BR>

ARRRGG! Quick update, I have not been able to write. If you read the previous thread, the porn queen emailed Thurs. Then she actually forwarded me thier responses to each other on Friday where he gave her his pager number and a place and time to meet. I could not believe it, well this was my response, probably a major LB. <P>TO: (H)<P>Well, I wish you both the best! No other email accounts, huh. I had no<BR>reason to be suspicious? Why didn't you just tell me you did not want me<BR>anymore! I never thought you could be this cruel. I loved you! You were<BR>the man that rescued me from an old hell's angel, you adopted a child<BR>because you loved her, you helped my sister, you drove like a maniac to get<BR>me to my father when he was almost fatally injured. You were the one man<BR>who stood a head taller than all the others. I don't deserve this.<P>At least ask her to not include me in her emails! I am not interested in<BR>anymore details! I am off the Merry-Go-Round, I am not a warden or a jailor<BR>and I am out of your life!<P>Goodbye<BR>From: (Porn Queen)<BR>>I can't wait! This is going to be the best!<BR>><BR>>--- "H" <@hotmail.com> wrote:<BR>>> Well I see you contacted me at the family<BR>>> e-mail again. Not good!My<BR>>> pager number is ----- and I will be at Refuge<BR>>> after 9:30 tonight.<BR>>><BR>>> My new e-mail address is @hotmail.com.<BR>>> do not use (email address)!<P>He called said he only wanted to find out who she was and tell her to leave him alone. I ran away for the weekend, went to my parents and saw my girlfriend. I changed the locks on the house. Our daughters did not know what happened but picked up on some of it. My 16 yr old told me that "Mom, he is never going to change" and I can not even print what the 13 yr old said.<P>I don't know what to think, I have not received anymore email and why send me the e-mails anyways! What did I do that was so bad? What kind of game is this? <P>Any input or ideas? Stay Safe all, I pray for all of us.<P>Lila<BR>

I am wondering if this is his way of trying to make me file for divorce. One of his questions has been when he is going to be served? Is that what all this could be about?<P>It would certianly help him look a little better at his job if he was filed against??<P>Any thoughts?

Lila<BR>I am so sorry for what you are going through. It sounds like your H and his "porn queen" are getting their kicks at your expense. You have said that the only thing you can change is you. Is it possible to try and remove yourself from the middle of them? Even if you see an email from either--can you delete it before you open it?<P>It sounds like we are in very similiar places. My H is not a cop, but holds a high position in a company and makes good money. People do what he wants all day long---my H also is into internet porn--the extent I do not know. <P>I do know that I have made a concious decision not to look in his computer and it helps my self esteem when I keep my promises to myself. We also have been married 20 years and have children close to the ages of yours. <P>Stay strong and be there for your kids.<BR>You and I cannot change our H's. They have to want to change themselves. Be civil to him for your kids sake.<P>OH, how can it look good to his employer to be divorced for adultery? It seems to me that you have some good evidence--is that not an option in your state?<P>My prayers are with you!!<BR>

This is a no fault state for divorces so there is little there that would actually help. I have not received anymore email since that one on Friday and you are right, if I do, I will just delete it. <P>I don't know what the intent is, if this is what it is all about but I will continue on my path of taking care of me and my children. He calls the girls everyday and he was actually upset Friday that they sounded happy. <P>Who is confused?

I keep praying for strength, somehow I keep going. My D's and I had a meeting with the counselor yesterday. All the pent up stress from all this started to show in that meeting. The 16 y/o covers it in laughter, and that causes friction w/13 y/o who refuses to talk about anything w/counselor present yet showed how opinionated she is w/o the control of an adult. It carried so far that I finally stepped in and had to tell her that she needed to join in respectfully, she actually turned her chair away from everyone and put her back to us. Now I am more worried about them, they are both scared of an unknown future, I understand that and agreed to give them a weekly update of where things stand. The 13 y/o refuses to go back to the counselor, she talks to me and she talks to her friends and I am not sure whether to let her continue that way or to bring her back anyway. I don't want her to hold this all in and become more troubled but I don't want to force this on her either. What is the right thing to do? <P>It is so much like "H", avoid, deny, refuse. The 16 y/o repeated a comment "H" started saying about the 13 y/o last year and 13 y/o started crying in the counselor's office that that was what daddy always said about her and she resented it: "Telephone, Telegraph, Tell "D"" (she talks (gossips) a lot) <P>They are afraid to tell him what they think because they don't think he will call or come see them if they do. But 16 y/o said well he does not come now.<P>I feel like I am falling deeper in the abyss, I don't want my children to hurt like this. They are supportive of me and I am trying to be there for them. From part of the talks, they left me feeling like I am accomplishing at least some of that. I am going to call the counselor today and ask him if he thinks I should bring her back in even with her current attitude. I think the attitude may apply to all counselors but I will see.<P>Please pray for my children, they are good girls and I want them to be healthy emotionally as well as physically.<P>Stay Safe all and God Bless us all<P>Lila