Hello All,<P>Thought I'd send my update since last week. My last post was I was supposed to go to a joint counseling session on Monday afternoon. Well, I did go.<P>My H arrived in the parking lot and an anger took me over as soon as I saw him. In our walk to the office I asked him why he's calling and leaving sad msgs. He didn't answer. I asked again and he said because he misses me. I started to cry.<P>In counseling we discussed why he was so uncaring and horrible to me when I was sick, he said he wasn't at all and helped me and took care of me. [I almost threw up] The counselor sd that's not what you told me in our solo session last week. He sd he didn't remember what he told her. She sd you told me you WERE horrible to your wife because you didn't care and didn't want to be sucked into caring. He sd I don't remember that. <P>Then I asked him why I deserved to have OW call and harass me, counselor chimed in and told H that to allow that to happen for months on end without doing anything about it, and then to leave your wife for the very person who was doing it is very hurtful and an insult to your W. Counselor asked H, "do you understand that?" H sd yes, but OW was angry and that's why she did it. I sd "you know Steve, I'm hurt and angry and I have never done anything to OW". H sd I know, you're not like that. <P>Counselor tried to get him to talk about his drinking, he lied and sd it's very minimal. Toward the end of the session I asked H if he was coming to counseling to work on our marriage, he sd no, I'm coming because I sd I would. I sd then you don't have to come anymore if you're not here to work on our marriage. The "deer in the head lights look" came over his face.<P>Out in the parking lot he said he wants to call me PLEASE. He sd he felt he's an embarrassment to me because of the lowlife things that he's drug me into. I told him I'm not embarrassed of him in the least and love him, every bit of him. I told him the things he does are hurtful and I wished he stop them and work on our marriage. He sd he'd have to make some BIG changes to do that, I sd if and when he's ready we can start counseling again. He asked again can I PLEASE call you. I sd whatever you want. I told him I was afraid I made a withdrawal from his love bank by bringing up what has and is happening. He sd I didn't. Then he kissed me like he's hasn't kissed me in a long time and looked into my eyes and sd "I love you Joanne".<P>That kiss weighed on me all the way home. And there was something about it I couldn't put my finger on … until later that night. He was kissing me differently … it was the way he and she kiss!<P>I didn't sleep all night, at 3:00a I started to page him and leave him voicemails, one aft another. I was upset and crying and told him everything I was feeling. Told him he lies to everyone but most of all himself. Told him he and she aren't going to last because of it being based in deceit, told him he has jumped right from the frying pan into the fire. Told him he is manipulating me by telling me how much he misses me and loves me but still is w/her. I spilled my guts. I didn't yell or scream, I just cried. I know, LB LB LB! I'm sorry I couldn't help it. I feel like I'm being tortured.<P>It took me two days to recover from that visit. Until Thursday I felt defeated and dead inside. Now I know why I was so resistant about going.<P>So that's where I am,. I'm not going to talk to him until I feel I can. I miss him terribly, desperately, unbelievably BUT I don't miss the crap. If OW calls me I am going to play the tapes for all three of my SILs. I have told my H that and hope he tells OW that too. I'm hoping that will detour her from harrasing me because I know she wants to get in good with SILs so she can someday become a welcome family member. <P>I don't know if this is a Plan A or B. I just don't know what I'm doing now. I feel like I'm protecting myself from anymore hurt and protecting my H from my anger.<P>Jo<P>------------------<BR>Josie_Res@Hotmail.com<P>"Remain flexible like a reed, as opposed to an oak which can snap in the wind"<p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited June 24, 2000).]

Jo,<P>You're not in Plan A...<BR>You're not in Plan B...<P>You're LB-ing to the hilt..<BR>...and if you can't control that...<BR>...it's OK.<P>But then... if you really want to follow the MB principles...<BR>...you've got to break away from you H for a short time! (mini-Plan B to give yourself time to time to think)<P>Access whether you can do a Plan A...<BR>If not... be satisfied with a Plan B... (and less of a chance of recovery)<P>I think your H can be reached with a Plan A...<BR>...but you have to have that resolve...<BR>...that "Plan A is not for wimps" resolve!<P>All this is very hard... <BR>I'm sorry for your pain.<P>I don't mean to be course...<BR>...but just responding to what you've explained.<P>Prayers... <P>Jim

I am right with you on this one Jo!! You know my H was doing the same things....<P><BR>I felt sucked in...I finally needed a break because I would lose it and vent my emotions....and even when I was just saying how I felt...he's say something like "I only moved out because you gave me such a hard time for 3 months." I knew then that this is truly a sickness. <P>I told him to his face I couldn't be his friend while he was friends with OP. That I needed to separate myself from him...I told him I knew OP was not THE problem but a big complicating factor.... I told him when he wanted to TALK.....and work on the marraige I would talk.... He panicked...followed me around...said "is this it" I said "it will be up to you".... He tried to e-mail me in again.... even putting "us" in the subject!!!<P>I really needed some emotional distance...plus my H is in individual counseling.... I am praying so much and asking for guidance and getting stronger and learning a lot about myself,,and missing my H and realizing that I do really LOVE him and hoping and praying that I'll get a chance to plan A him again....when he is ready!!! and so am I....<P>I'm so sorry for what you ar going through...it is so painful...they call and keep us almost plan Aing us so we won't leave them to force them to make a decision. It is such an awful position to be in. You just have to have faith.

Thanks Jim.<P>You're right, I was LBing to the hilt. I thought I could control my pent up anger and that's the only reason I did go. I was wrong and lost control.<P>I need a break from H & OW to think. I was on the right path at first and then the anger of the betrayal comsumed me. I know I need to resolve to what has happened and look ahead to "what do I want". <P>I am working on my anger, I'm trying to understand this whole thing and what part I played in it. I am 100% responible for 50% of my marriage. <P>I don't want to go to Plan B, but I feel as though my H is addicted to me. It's like he has to satisfy a "fix" by talking to me, like I'm his security, not his wife. After talking to him I get really depressed and have trouble even going to work. It hurts.<P>I almost drove away as soon as I arrived at the counseling session Monday. I wished I would have. This is not who I want to be.<P>I need to think and read and pray.<P>Thanks for you words, Jim.<P>Jo

Hey Jo...<P>How about some books...<P><B>Anger Management:</B><BR><OL TYPE=1><BR><LI> <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0806509376" TARGET=_blank><B>Anger : How to Live With and Without It</B></A> by Albert Ellis <BR><LI> <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1879237970" TARGET=_blank><B>Angry All the Time :</B> An Emergency Guide to Anger Control</A> by Ron Potter-Efron, Ronald T. Potter-Efron <BR><LI> <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0800786467" TARGET=_blank><B>Getting the Best of Your Anger</B></A> by Les Carter <BR></OL><P>and a link... <A HREF="http://www.anger-stress-marriage.com" TARGET=_blank>Anger & Stress Management Communication Skills for Marriages and Relationships in Conflict</A><P> <P>Jim

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Resilient:<BR><B>That kiss weighed on me all the way home. And there was something about it I couldn't put my finger on … until later that night. He was kissing me differently … it was the way he and she kiss!</B><P>Oh gross! How repulsive. <P>I am sorry you are on such a roller coaster. Do you know what you want to do yet? I guess until you know which direction you want to go (and I can't really tell though I have been following your posts), you're going to go in circles. That's the hardest part, isn't it?<P>I know what it is like to burst out with all your feelings. I've done that too. Don't beat yourself up over it. We all feel the need to be heard. Despite the fact that it is a love bust, I think the betrayers need to know how we feel sometimes. Of course, it is better if they discover this through love than a tirade, but... it's done. <P>I hope you find some peace today and are able to start over with an open mind and new perspective. I know we've all said this to each other, but here it is again: Do something nice for yourself and lose yourself in the beauty of the experience. There really is nothing like living the joy of life to help you see that there is more to life than our own personal hell. Once you are able to compartmentalize the hell and enjoy the good things in life, it really does take the significance out of the hurt and minimalizes it into small manageable chunks.

Hi Jo:<P>Sorry to hear things are so yucky right now. As you know, I am in the same boat. Only, my h will have nothing to do with me. <P>Yesterday I had a psychic party at my house. I had been to one a few months back and all my friend and family wanted to go to this woman so I decided to have her to my house so she can read everyone one by one. It was a fun day.<P>Anyway, my mil and my 3 sister in laws all came to the party. Now, no one told this woman that they were related to me or to each other. Well, she picked up on just about all 4 of them that there is an older brother/son who is beyond help at this point. She told my mil that she has 2 sons and that the oldest has a temper. She said that he is having problems in his marriage and that there is alot of hate surrounding his marriage. She told my sil that the older brother has many issue and that they should not try to get thru to him because he is not capable of hearing anyone right now. <P>It was so strange. They each went in one by one and not even back to back. They don't even look alike. This woman was right on with everyone. <P>My friends from my support group (seperated/Divorced) also came and she made3 of them cry with all that she told them about their family, ex h , new love interests, etc.... So was so on with all of them<P>I did not have a reading. But, she came up to me and she said I want you to know that you can't continue to let your h treat you the way he is. She said that in time (6 months) he is going to want to come back to me (she told me that the 1st time I saw her) and that I might not want him anymore. <P>At any rate, the day was alot of fun and very interesting. <P>Hang in there. I think you have a big plus on your side because your h still wants to call and talk to you. My h can't stand to be around me at all and I never did anything....

Jo, another book you might want to try is "Life Strategies".... Lostva suggested it to me. The book has many exercises designed to get you to examine the patterns in your own life.<P>ANger is a problem for me too...If you knew me you wouldn't say that about me because I don't yell or scream....but I can have a tenseness when I am not sure what is going on and even be alittle passive aggressive in showing anger (slamming a cabinet, facial expression etc)<P>Therapy (mine) and that book have helped me sort out the causes.....if anything it is helping me as a parent...and helping me like myself better!!!!<P>You know....my H is a conflict avoider...and always acted like nothing bothers him...I think I mentioned to you the incredible amt of stress in his job in the past two years. (embezzlement being only one of the things)<P>He acted like "as long as I do a good job thats all that matters" (of course OP was right by his side)<P>But the things that happened to him HAD to hurt him......he withdrew...I reacted..and our whole house became tense. (esp. kids)<P>How we relate to each other in any relationship is kind of a dance I guess and sometimes we are out of step. Changing ourselves may make a change in the other.<P>When we react...it's so overt !!<P>That's why I backed up or retreated..I have to work hard on myself. I think my H was doing the same with me......using me as a safe harbor while he is sorting out his confusion.....To be quite honest...I want him to KNOW!!!! In the meantime I am going to be a better me!!!<P>"THe greatest journey is within ourselves. The greatest discoveries are waiting within our own hearts"<P>Keep saying that 100% of 50% thing to yourself every day....I do..