Had another counseling session and thought it went well. H didn't hesitate to schedule appointment as he did at the previous session (a tough one). <P>We always go to the season opener of the local university football game and talked about going together this weekend, but he couldn't say. He says OW also asked him to join her and her gang, but he wants to go with our friends. Only our friends haven't made any plans for it yet. He is considering going by himself and sitting alone. He feels pressure because if he says "yes" to one, the other will be hurt. I could care less if she is hurt, she's the outsider!! Am I wrong?<P>Anyway, he wouldn't commit to any dinner plans either for this week because he didn't have his calendar in front of him. It's not that he didn't want to have dinner, but I wonder sometimes feel if he uses "the calendar" as a reason for not committing to any plans in case something better comes up.<P>He mentioned that he feels a lot of pressure and is afraid to fail if we get back together. He doesn't want to fail if we reconcile. How do I deal with this? I don't want to fail either and I don't believe we will if we both want it badly enough to do whatever it takes to make things right and make it work. I guess I'm more willing to take a leap of faith than he is at this point.<P>What else can I do?

I guess the key is NO pressure. Let him be the one to approach. THe WS's seem to be the one in withdrawal from the relationship not us. They probably need to be the one to reapproach.<P>Keep up the plan A especially in taking care of yourself. I guess they won't see until they are ready.

Many tears,<BR>Doesnt that make you mad that they make such an effort to avoid hurting OW when they think nothing of toutoring us for months? Maybe its because they know that the relationship with OW own't stand up to real life disappointments. But they know and deep down trust us to be there through thick and thin. Maybe, or else they are just thoughtless jerks. <P>I'm not sure how to make him feel less pressure, maybe just being understanding about the game, let him know you understand how hard it is for him.<BR>Lora<P>

Tootrusting and Lora<P>I know how important NO pressure is, and I'm trying my best. As far as I can figure the best way to not pressure, is to have little contact. But, that's so hard!<P>Being understanding about the game, I did. I kind of just shrugged my shoulders and said "I guess you feel pressure, huh?" and pretty much left it at that. <P>Lora- I do feel hurtand angry that he feels badly for her, but I know he feels badly for me, too, that's why he would rather go alone. I guess his guilt is really working overtime. How long can they live like that?<P>Many Tears

Hi Many Tears,<P>Thanks for posting on my thread...twice. You give good advice...wish I had some for you.<P>Hope none of our MB men take offense to this, but, I think (especially after this latest thing with my H) that guys need to have things be their ideas. I kind of wonder if they want to woo us back and we make it difficult by being so eager.<P>You and I should go to the Plan A...a meaning Absolutley No Annoyances! Yep, they are filled with guilt and we can't really help them with that. I know when I call my H (very rarely) the conversations are only so-so,but when he calls me and is in the mood to talk it goes really well. Yeah, let it all be their ideas...dates, conversations, sex...oh yeah, you're not doing that...way to be strong! I'm a weakling in that dept.<P>Go to the game, have a great time with your freinds and don't worry about him. Let him sit alone and feel sorry for himself a bit. He will be wishing for you and his old buddies and his old life. Just a little at a time...it's all they can handle.<P>Now, if I could only take my own advice.<P>allison

I agree totally with Allison on the idea that men want to have things be their idea!! If I suggest something, my H is very hesitant, and usually doesn't seem interested. However, in the last couple of weeks he's suggested that we spend an entire day shopping together (which is tomorrow, and I can't wait), that we go to dinner together (which is Saturday) and he has a business trip at Disney World and planned for all of us to go along! If I would have suggested any of the above, we probably wouldn't be doing any of them. <P>Control was one issue in our marriage, and I think that this makes him seem like he's more in control.....

Hi, MT! I'm gonna address the "afraid to fail" issue 'cause everyone else has given great advice on the others and I think that's a real biggie!<P>This was a big thing for Robert...and is a very big thing for many WS's. You have to remember, MOST of them really do believe that they gave the marriage everything they had for a long, long time and it just wasn't enough. They don't realize, like we do, that a lot of effort can be wasted by doing the wrong things! Soooo..if you can understand that they're not only afraid that WE'LL let them down again (because, I'm sorry to say, lots of times we really did), but also afraid that THEY won't be "good enough" either. And you know what, we can't "educate" them on the facts at all. They already feel as though they've failed in so very many ways, they simply can't take another one.<P>Soooo....you have to believe. You have to be positive. You have to know, deep down in the core of your soul, that this marriage WILL be great! You have to approach reconciliation not as though the two of you are "trying" again to make it great, but that the two of you ARE gonna make it great. Take the if's out of it in your own head and heart. If you truly believe this, it will show and it's contagious! But you can't fake it, it's got to be real.<P>You know, once Robert said to me "It's your belief in me that makes me believe in myself." You can't THINK he's capable of being a great husband, you have to KNOW he IS a great husband. You can't think you guys COULD have a great marriage in which both of you could be happy, you have to KNOW that you'll both find everything you ever wanted in your marriage. <P>No amount of counselling, reading, statistics, whatever can take the place of your rock-solid belief in yourself, your husband and your marriage. I promise you that. You KNOW that. Don't you remember all the times in your life that you were around a very positive person whose very presence convinced you that you could do anything??? They didn't have to say a word! That's who you need to be. That's what helps him the most.<P>Just my 2 cents.....<P>Love and prayers,<P>Lori

Allison and Hurtinginil,<P>Thanks so much for your advice about having things be their idea. When I think about it, you're absolutely right. He tries really hard when we are together to have fun and make things light, but sometimes our conversations gets so deep and heavy that it gets exhausting, too. <P>It will also mean more to me if he initiates things. I just miss him so much that when I don't hear from him, I go nuts! Then I'll see him with her, and I just crumble. <P>Lostva--<BR>Your advice is great! I do believe that we can make things right again between us. I guess thinking it and knowing it, makes a world of difference. I will need to show him that I believe in him and us.<P>Thanks a lot all! You're just the greatest; thanks for being here.