Hello friends,<P>Well, I guess everyone here knows about our (firestorm and me) situation now. After reading more posts over the past week I am certain we are not the only recovering couple to face this kind of setback. For the first few days I thought our marriage was over, but now I see plenty of possiblities.<P>My questions: How many of you have also been in a marriage damaged by an affair, believed the affair was over, and then discovered it had reignited or never really ended? How did you handle it the second time? Did it happen a third time?<P>I'm looking for hope, but I want to be prepared for what might happen. I guess I want to know if it is possible for a person to make the same mistake twice, but then to really change and become a faithful partner.<P>Thank you for your input and honesty.<P>Peppermint

Hi peppermint<BR>Do you want the long story or the short one? <BR>My H's "friendship" with the bimbo was always an EA in my mind. It started in '92 and in '96 I was led to believe they were no longer in contact.<BR>Dec. '98 D-day 1 of the physical affair and that contact had never stopped during those years.<BR>Feb 7 '99 he ended it.<BR>March 6 d-day 2. He hadn't even slowed down.<BR>"Ended" it again.<BR>April 21 D-day 3. Very little phone contact and probably nothing in person but still lies.<BR>July '99. I listened to his phone messages and he was on his way to help her get her truck fixed. She had initiated contact because she "needed".<BR>That was the last contact I know of.<P>My H is now doing everything he can to change things. He was never as educated as Firestorm. He did not look at a book. Did not try to understand what he needed to do to make recovery happen. <BR>I see things working much better for you. Firestorm can understand what "no contact means". <P>There are windows of opportunity for healing. I think you still have that window and you both want to keep it open.

Hi Peppermint,<P> I was so sorry to hear of your setback but that seems to be the norm. DDay my H insisted it was over and wanted to be at home. Found out 21/2mos. later it was still on , told him to leave.. He begged and pleaded and ended it again.....2mos. later found out he was still seeing her. Went to Plan B, reconciled and then moved 6hrs. away.<BR> <BR>Ok, here's the kicker, found he was still calling her for 7mos.....but it is finally truly over. His attitude and personality have change considerably.<P>What did it do to me? I grew more angry and lost more feelings for him....some days I hoped that he would just leave. The continued contact seems to erode loving feelings fairly quickly. Now, it's been 6mos. since it really is over and I think I'm starting to feel better towards him....but will never trust him.....LU

Hi Peppermint,<P>I am one of those who believed (or wanted to believe) that the affair was over, only to find out it wasn't. Although, the physical part seems to be over, the emotional part is still ongoing.<P>I'm not in a position to offer any hope or advice, as I'm very lost right now.<P>H is living at home (since end of May), but isn't interested in filling any of my needs, and admitted in one of our conseling sessions that he's "emotionally divorced me". Yet, he swears up and down that there was/is nothing I did or didn't do to cause this to happen. So, I have no clues as to what 'needs' of his I'm not meeting.<P>Even though, he says that he's disconnected from me, he tries very hard to keep tabs on my whereabouts and activities. It almost seems as though he doesn't want me, yet he doesn't want anyone else to have me either.<P>I know that I can't continue in this situation too much longer. It's very destructive.<P>Sorry that this isn't very positive. At least, know that you are not alone. I'm really beginning to believe that as long as he 'has his cake and eats it too', he will not end the affair. So, it's going to be up to me to take the next action. And when I do, and he comes back and again says that it's over, I don't think that I'll be able to believe him.<P>My thoughts and prayers are with you. I can feel your pain.

wasstubborn,<BR>Do I read correctly that you have basically been dealing with this since 1992? Do you think it is possible that it truly was just a friendship for a number of years until it evolved into an affair? I believe that is the case with firestorm. He knew the other woman for 14 years before their involvement crossed the line. I've only been dealing with this for sixteen months, so I really admire your perseverance. Thanks for the words of encouragement.<P>Lu,<BR>I am beginning to believe that you are right and continued or reoccurring contact is the norm. It is certainly more common that we all want to admit. Firestorm's attitude is so very much different this time. As weird as it sounds, he actually seems so much happier since I found out the truth. I hope this time is really the end. Thanks for sharing your story.<P>Sidney,<P>I am so sorry for the situation that you are in. It has been so hard for me to understand that firestorm continued to love me throughout the whole affair, and he has never wanted to lose me, yet I know that it is true. I can't imagine the devastation you are going through. I wish I could be of help or comfort to you. Please know that you are in my thoughts and prayers.<P>peppermint<BR>

Peppermint,<P>Sorry you are going through a second discovery.<P>Unlike the majority of the women here all my discoveries are centered around different women. Each and everyone has to do with some new woman he met on the Interent. Well that is not true. this last one while I was working and he went away on vacation to Nantucket in July. He got drunk with his sister and her best friend. Well that night he decided to try and pick up Meg's best friend. <P>He told me he had just gotten drunk but then while we were on vacation a week ago he decides to tell me he tried to pick her up. <P>I have no idea how many times I have had discoveries. I have stoped counting. I have stoped caring. After this last discovery I just told him that if he could not get aboard my train than he needed to get off the next station and leave for good. I did not yell I did not threaten. <P>I have come to the end of the line and just have nothing left. I guess you should ask yourself what you want for proof that it is over. I mean Fire seemed to be trying to prove the first time that it was over. Nothing hurts more than to find out that the deceptions were still on going. <P>I am so sorry you have to go through this. You are such a woderful person. Sometimes it is a shame that the people closest do not see that. Hang in there and take it one day at a time.

Yes peppermint, you read correctly. H met the bimbo in '92 and it became a problem immediately. It was an exclusive friendship. She would call the house and ask to "borrow my H".<BR>Yes I believe it was only a "friendship" till '98. It was wrong though because he was aware that it caused me pain from day 1.<BR> <BR>The difference I see for you is that firestorm wants to do the things that are necessary. My H wanted things to get better. He just didn't want to do the dirty work. I still have paranoias. Fears that could have been put to rest by some closure.<P>You and firestorm are a team. His part of the team screwed up but you are a team. That's something to build on.

Pahakissa1,<P>I'm very sorry to hear that things have not improved for you. Thanks for taking the time to offer your thoughts. You are right in saying that firestorm SEEMED to be trying the first time. Of course, I wanted to believe him so badly that I overlooked lots of little setbacks and broken promises. NOT THIS TIME!<P>His attitude is completely different this time, but so is mine. This time he is taking the initiative and doing things because HE wants to, not because I nag him into it. And this time I am being cooperative, but not taking the responsiblity on myself. I also realize that it is much easier to find proof the affair is ongoing that to find proof that it is over. I'm taking it much easier on myself this time.<P>Firestorm screwed up, again. Though I am not perfect, his choice was not and is not my fault. He knows fully well that this is his last chance with me.<P>I hope that things will soon be resolved for you so that you can move on to a happier life.<P><BR>wasstubborn,<P>You are truly an amazing person. Thank you so much for your encouragement.<P>You are so right about firestorm, and this time seems so very much different. The first time, he wanted things to get better too, but without any real effort on his part. Like your husband, he wanted the results without the work.<P>So far this time is totally different. I hope and pray it is for real and lasts.<P>Do you thing that this "friendship" thing makes recovery even more difficult? It seems that it would be easier to recover from a breakup with someone you have only known and been involved with for a short amount of time than to end a relationship with someone you have known for many years and that has been a part of your life for so long.<P>One thing I have certainly learned is that it will only be over when the betrayer decides he/she wants it to be over. Neither the betrayed spouse or the other person can put an end to it until the betrayer is ready.<P>Thanks again for your positive support. It means a great deal to me.<P>Peppermint

Hi Peppermint,<P>Thank you very much for your kind reply. I am glad to know that fire is working on it. <P>Tony really has been working hard on the relationship. He is even going to see a therapist on his own to work everything out. For Tony he needed to know I think that I had it and was ready to kick him out. The sad thing is that I am just am not sure I really care anymore. I have been hurt way too much for too long to really want to try anymore. <P>I think I am taking a wait and see approach. Plus I am really trying to work on a lot of areas of my life. <P>Sorry not to prattle on in your post. I wanted to uplife you and not go on and on about me. Do forgive me. Hang in there I think you are going to make it. Something inside me just says you are.

Let's see, Guard affair began in 4/98, I was suspicious, yet believing his denials until his disclosure 1/99. <P>He moved out 8/98, broke it off with her, moved home 11/98...resumed "lunches" almost immediately. <P>Moved out 12/98, disclosure 1/99. <P>He had intermittant contact until 7/99 when it went full-blown. I confronted him 8/99. Contact last a couple more months, until she began dating his housemate (not me, the other house).<P>They work together, but last known non-work contact was 2/00.<P>I really have no idea if it was sorta continuous or what. There are at least 4 times he or she broke it off for awhile.<P>And...now she appears to be out of his life & we're doing fine. The eggshells are gone. We're easy with one another. There are times I would believe the past bad times were a rough dream, except for the fact that we make sure to connect on a real "checking in" level nearly everyday. It's work, but it's good work.<P>------------------<BR>Lor<BR>"A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger."<BR>(Proverbs 15:1).