Lori - in your reply to Adrian you said: <P>"Your strength will make him strong, your confidence will build his, your belief in yourself, him and your love will make it real for him as well. It all starts with you and though it's slow, it IS contagious!!!"<P>Are you saying to essentially act as if nothing is wrong with the relationship, or act as though you're past it and life goes on without it?? Certainly you don't mean to be aloof or present an "I can take it or leave it" attitude? Can you expound a little more, please?<P>Thanks,<BR>Dave (alias WAT, worthatry) <P>

Hi, Dave...what do I mean? Now you've opened a can of worms and I was trying to be brief for once!!! LOL<P>No, I don't mean any of those things. Hmmmm...how did I act? I acted the way I felt. I loved him. I believed I was a good person and so was he. I believed we had the chance for a great marriage. I believed that he was as hurt and confused as I was and that if he could work through that, just as I had worked through some of my issues, there was great potential for the two of us. I wanted to be his friend, his wife, his partner and I believed I could do a good job of it. I did NOT really believe he would be back. But I knew there was always a chance. Robert left. He was living with PT and I saw him only rarely. He would not kiss me, demonstrations of affection made him run like crazy. I told him it was the rules that he had to hug me when he left. Made him uncomfortable at first and he'd act like he had been burned, but eventually it became a joke "You just want me to smell like you so the deer won't come close!". I told him I loved him every time I saw him or we talked , right before we said goodbye. Only once each time. I got nothing, or uh-huh and eventually "I know", "I don't know why","I'm glad" and FINALLY "I love you, too." Took a year or more.<P>But.....I never took off my rings. He noticed. He said something about it once and I told him that I was his wife, I loved him, no matter what and I had no intention of removing them. He said only, very quietly, "thank you, Lori." I noticed he checked my left hand whenever I saw him.<P>Hard to pretend that nothing's wrong with the relationship when you're hubby's living elsewhere! But when I spoke with him, or saw him, I made sure we BOTH enjoyed each other's company. Sure, I'd cry after he'd leave, I didn't want him to go. But I really did have a good time while he was here. Made sure he did too. As much for me as for him or us...I loved this man and wanted our time together, though brief, to be fun.<P>There was no doubt in my husband's mind that I loved him and wanted us to begin again. There was also no doubt in his mind that I would forgive him, forgive myself and not throw this in his face forever. He knows me. There was no doubt in my husband's mind that, even if we DIDN'T get back together, I would be fine. I would hurt, I would grieve, but I would not collapse. He knows me. Not take it or leave it, but not weak and clingy either, I guess. Just me.<P>Once he talked about coming home, the first months of recovery were perhaps the most difficult and that tested even my faith. Our little PT did EVERYTHING (I mean, you cannot even imagine) and Robert doubted his decisions on a regular basis. I was strong, happy, damned close to perfect. During that roughest time, I did keep my tears to myself...he wasn't ready...it wasn't time. I had to be strong for both of us. But Robert told me later that my faith in HIM made him strong, my belief in us made him believe and my strength and committment showed him what was important. He was surprised that I was so strong....that's how he saw plan A, eventually, not as weak, but strong....committed in the face of obstacles.<P>I'm not superwoman...but Plan A fits my general personality. I believe in decisions...deciding what you want and following that decision for a course of action. I believe that we have complete control of our own behavior and I don't allow myself "I couldn't help it" as an excuse for any of my actions. It's not true. I could help it, I am in control of me and there's no excuse if I don't do it. That does not apply to emotions, however. What hurts, hurts. What makes us angry, makes us angry (however, I believe that's an expression of hurt as well). But we can allow ourselves to FEEL and acknowledge it without letting it control how we treat others.<P>So I decided what I wanted for me...to become a better person and to be the kind of wife, mother, daughter, employee, friend that I could be proud of. I worked for that. I decided I was NOT gonna give up on my husband. He was devoted, loving, considerate and my strength for far too many years....he was not all of a sudden a piece of crap. Together or not he deserved my respect.....for our past anyway.<P>You know, Gary Smalley says that the most important thing to building a relationship is honor. According to him, it's absolutely essential. He also notes that honor is something you convey upon your partner WHETHER OR NOT THEY DESERVE IT. Like forgiveness, I believe, it's a gift. A very important gift.....to yourself and your spouse. So, I guess the short answer to your question is...I honored myself, I honored my husband and I honored what I believed in. And once I reached that decision, life became much much easier.<P>See, told you I'd talk too much! Sorry. Hope I helped just a little.<P>Lori

Thanks, Lori, that helped a lot. I think I'm doing these things. Being strong, being a good father, taking control of things at home, reminding her that I'm here for her, and letting her know that I see potential for a new relationship even if she can't right now.<P>An interesting thing happened yesterday. For the past few weeks, I have been going through the ordeal of selecting a new au pair since our current one departs in January. This is a time consuming and tough job, making a decision on very little info for a stranger to come live with you and help care for your child. I pulled some slick moves that got us a much sought after girl. Anyway, yesterday when my wife was over, I showed her the info on the new au pair and commented that she wouldn't believe what it took to get this one. My wife looked at me sternly and said, "maybe now you appreciate what I went through last year when I had to do all of this." This really was unexpected because I have always tried to communicate my appreciation for her efforts, I guess not well enough. I was surprised she snapped at me like that and I just kept my mouth shut. Maybe she doesn't like me filling her role so well.<P>Thanks again,<BR>Dave

Sounds like to me you're doing a great job. And that's all you CAN do.<P>Keep it up.<P>Lori

Lostva<P>What a great insight you have given to the process of recovery. You have put in to words beautifully how the process of recovery as professed by the Harleys can and should work.<P>Like yourself, I am totally committed to trying my best for my family to be reunited. A marriage of 15 years is far to long a bond of love to have broken in a period of 15 - 20 months by a new kid on the block. <P>I love my W very much and as such am able to put the A in to perspective (I sure wish she could). We are still living together at this stage and still very much doing things as a family which I believe is important.<P>Like yourself I am constantly showing my love for my W, not drowning her with affection, not in a overwhelming way, but by acts of kindness and thoughtfullness on a consistent basis. LBing is not even an option. <P>There are times when I am constantly lied to and times when I am treated with disrespect when she is arranging a meeting with the OM. It would be so easy to LB in a big way at these times but it would serve no purpose. This is not to say that I am a doormat and don't draw boundaries. I do draw boundaries but when I do I handle them in the least LBing way and we manage to still move forward.<P>I think to not do so would be to lose a certain amount of respect from my W. <P>I find that we can talk quite freely most of the time and even get down to talking about intimate details of our relationship. On a regular basis we show affection by way of hugs and sometimes kissing. The scene has been pretty well set by me that our relationship is a "safe" place to be. I think this is of utmost importance.<P>She is however still determined at this stage that her happiness lies with the OM, but I believe the desire, though still quite strong, is diminishing as time goes on. <P>I am hoping there will come a time where a crossroad is reached for her, where the allure of the OM starts to fade in comparison to the long term bond and commitment that we have in the marriage. That when faced with accepting the changes I am making as permanent, she will chose the right road. I am not convinced of this but it is, I believe, becoming a stronger possibility. <P>Given all of the above I would like to ask what you think of the following line of thought. <P>I am convinced that the success or failure of our marriage hinges more on the behaviour of the OM. He holds most of the cards, and it will be his behaviour that will determine ultimately whether we get back together.<P>All I can do in the meantime is become a safe and tempting alternative for her to fall back on when and if such a time comes.<P>Did Robert ever discuss why he gave up the OW and came back to you? An answer to that would indeed be the full answer to recovery.<P>Colin<P> <P>

Interesting question, Colin...and one I don't have a great answer to, I'm afraid. Not because we haven't talked about it, but because I'm not sure he really knows...and what he thought, thinks, depends on how far along he's come (and he's come a LONG way now).<P>I do know that PT was doing a lot of lovebusting for a few months and, like you, I just made our relationship a better place to be. Remember, Robert left me because he had finally discovered what real love was. I'm not making light of that. I do believe he loved her, just as we all have loved many people in our lives. The love just never progressed past "new love" to that deeper more abiding love. <P>When he came home, he told me it was because he "should". He heard a song and it made him think that he wasn't where he should be and he felt that if he was ever to look himself in the mirror, he'd have to come back to make things right. What I didn't know at first was that it was a six month trial. Glad I didn't. He and PT had worked that out. He still claimed she was a sweet girl who didn't deserve what had happened to her and what he had done to her. He worked his butt off to soften the blow. I actually HELPED him do it ....and found a way for her to know I did (through him and my MIL - casually.)<P>But...now we're almost a year down the road (he asked to come home last January). One of the guys at work has been flirting a bit with PT at the office (she rarely works where Robert does anymore - no biggie) and found out they had spent some time together. He asked Robert about her. Amazing what the guys told me. The man who always defended her to the death told this guy some VERY uncomplimentary things about her and the kind of person she really is. She's currently living with someone else and Robert told him that the guy she's living with is the best type for her. Her magical image, over the months, has disappeared. (Mine, however, has grown amazingly stronger! )<P>Please remember, it's not a steady climb. Up and down, up and down, progress followed by terrible disappointment. But, one day you notice that you really are ahead of where you were at sometime in the past. And, when you think about it, the steps forward are just a bit larger than those backward. <P>Good luck to you. <P>Lori

Lori<P>Thanks for your reply, you in fact have answered my question.<P>When I stated that provided you are achieving a good Plan A, the ball is really in the OPs court with respect to the long term viability of the relationship.<P>If the OP does indeed fill all the right ENs of the WS and is able to continue the relationship without any major LBs then the outlook for the new relationship is very hopefull and hopes of reconciliation doubtfull.<P>This obviously happens in some cases and no matter how good the BS Plan A is they will never win the WS back as the comfort level in the new relationship is very high so there is no incentive to reconcile.<P>In effect it is a gamble that the BS must take and indeed put his/her life on hold for what seems an eternity with no guarantees of the outcome. Consistency holds the key.<P>This is where I am at. Our relationship has been ON/OFF/ON and now OFF again all in the period of 20 months. The OM is certainly the flavour of the month at this particular time.<P>The OM is determined not to lose my W and is making every effort to achieve that end almost to the point of desparation. He is single and my W is certainly quite a catch. He would never ever be the one to severe the relationship.<P>It is very hard, but I think in the last 3 months I have turned it around just a little and I have noticed the signs you mention of things moving slightly more positive.<P>I firmly believe that time is mostly on the side of the marriage. At least that is what I want to believe. <P>It certainly worked for you and what a great success story you have. I can't wait till the day she wants to recommit, as from that point on there will be no turning back.<P>She is far to far precious to me to ever lose again.<P>Thanks once again for your insight and inspiration.<BR>Colin<P>