I'm in a hard withdrawal period right now. Also, I haven't told my wife about the A yet. But I would like to go through the ENQ with her. Would that be crazy at this point? Am I able to go through the questionairre effectively, given my emotions at the moment?<P>One of the hard parts of the withdrawal is not having an opposing positive activity with my wife. It's difficult to participate in "normal" things right now, and there are many things in which I have no interest at the moment. One thing that does interest me is the ENQ. So much is made of the it I would really like to see if it reveals anything about our relationship.<P>She's been very supportive of my moodiness of late. I do understand that almost all of you would advise me to tell my wife about the A, but I cannot do that just yet. I'm sorry that that will frustrate (or anger) you. But if you are able to set that aside for a moment and answer my question, I'd appreciate it. <P>Ivory

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ivory:<BR><B> <BR>She's been very supportive of my moodiness of late. I do understand that almost all of you would advise me to tell my wife about the A, but I cannot do that just yet. <BR>Ivory</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Hi Ivory, I held off on posting to you the other day, but, now, I have some free time. I am also the WS, but, I am in recovery. You say that she is supportive of your moodiness. How supportive is she going to be when she realizes why you have been so moody?<P>If my H handed my a questionaire like that, I would want to know why, whats up, etc....<BR>As you can plainly see, you are now in a corner, and you don't know which way to go. Take the higher road. Tell your wife. You don't know how I wish I would have had the courage to tell my husband. <P>My h and I took the questionaire, after about two months after the discovery. Funny how they were both almost identical. What is it that you are hoping to gain from the form? That you two are alike or are not alike, and that further justifies your actions?<P>Take Care<BR>PJ <P><p>[This message has been edited by PlainJane (edited January 06, 2001).]

Ivory....<P>Be a MAN! Tell her! You are not going to get anywhere with "lists" and questionnairs until you both know what the heck is going on!<P>No excusses mister! Tell her .... if you love her!<P>The lies are what hurts more than the affair.<P>Quit lying ...... every day you delay telling the truth is another lie!<P>Be a man! Be honest. Take a risk!<P>I'll be praying for you!!!<P><P>------------------<BR>~*~*Yesterday~*~*<BR>all my problems seemed so far away~*

PlainJane,<P>In the past we have worked through questionairres from a workbook we were taking ourselves through. We also have worked through the LoveBusters questionairre, for example, but none of the LBs applied, frankly (SHE said that first; I agreed). She is already aware of the ENQ so if I were to bring it out it would not raise alarm on her part, as you suggested. In fact, she would be happy that I took the initiative.<P>I appreciate your reply but you stepped over the line when you inferred that my intentions for the ENQ were to somehow justify my actions. The ENQ is referred to almost in every other paragraph of many of Harley's articles and answers; many claims are made about the good that it can do; also, supposedly it reveals unmet emotional needs, and Harley claims that when those emotional needs are (1) uncovered and then (2) met by OS, that the relationship can be restored. You think I wouildn't have an interest in that? Yes, I acknowledge that he also speaks of the need for honesty and confession. I did not say that I refuse to tell W, but that I have not done so yet. I rather expect that it will be this week sometime. It's not an easy thing to anticipate doing and I'm not all that courageous (or perhaps you would say principled) right at the moment.<P>However, I have found in the past that even though working through some of the other questionairres and engaging in the discussions that followed was not particularly something I looked forward to, I had to admit that keeping the lines of communicationn open did some good, and sometimes warmed up the relationship. It provides a starting point for conversations about important things. Perhaps that could gently lead into my telling her. Right at the moment we don't have a lot of communication going.<P>(I also should point out that I am still learning here, or trying to, and that includes learning enough of the concepts to be able to talk to OS about them when the time comes.)<P>Ivory<P><p>[This message has been edited by Ivory (edited January 06, 2001).]

Yesterday,<P>I realized that I was opening up myself to your sort of criticism when I posted my question, so I'm not surprised by it. Maybe I was disingenuous to think someone would reply just to my question. And maybe everyone else so strongly believes that the first step is to confess the A that they find it impossible to answer my question. <P>But just in case someone can offer the opinion sought, I'd still like to see it.<P>Ivory<BR>(At least I'm here and participating.)

Ivory...<P><BR>I am sorry for hurting your feelings.<P>To answer your question ~~~~~~ my opinion only:<P>No, I do not think you would be able to go through the questionnaire "effectively" given your emotions at the moment. <P>The whole point of the questionnaire is to HONESTLY open up to your spouse.<P>Better wait awhile.<P>Take care dear Ivory ..... I'm still praying for you .... and I love you as a brother!<P><P>------------------<BR>~*~*Yesterday~*~*<BR>all my problems seemed so far away~*

My W has filled out the ENQ but I feel it has not been effectively done. Yet... I am the BS and filled it out over the period of several hours on my own. I don't feel you can do it with the required thought and emotion that it takes unless you are completely honest with her and yourself. That is a decision you must make on your own but I have to give you credit, you have made the move to try!!!!!!!! When you gather the courage, which I know you have, tell her and whatever you do, try and understand why she reacts the way she does. Never know, she may say she suspected and is glad you told her or she could be really PO'd. That's the chance you take when these things come about. Be strong and do the right thing.

Ivory<BR>I am not going to answer your question...only you can do that.<BR>I think it's good that you want to find an activity with your wife. <BR>I have a question. Why they ENQ? Do you want to know if she meets your needs....or are you interested in her needs. You really don't need to answer me. I just hope you will examine your reasons.<P>I do encourage you to open up to your wife ASAP. It will be better for both your sakes. I haven't posted much for a long time but you remind me very much of my H and I really wish the best for you and your wife. Congratulations on reaching out for help.<P>And don't be too defensive.....there are some really great people here.

Dear Ivory,<P>I am a BS. Yes, I think you should tell your spouse as soon as possible. Having said that I will try to answer your question. My WS and I did the ENQ during one of his periods out of the fog a couple months ago. I know that my answers would have been very, very different had I not known of the A. I also would have felt like a dupe and like I was being manipulated if H had suggested we do the ENQ and then told me about the A the next week or soon after. I would have felt like he was tring to lock me into answers or feelings before he sprung the bad news at me so that I couldn't react so negatively to the bad news.<P>I would strongly advise you to not do the ENQ until you have told her about the A and given her some time to deal with it. In the meantime, you probably know enough about her ENs to start meeting them now so you can start building some credit and get into practice before you explode your bomb. The longer you wait, the worse it will get!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Good Luck!

Ivory,<P>I'll address only the question leaving my opinion of what you should do out.<P>The ENQ concerns what your most important needs are. It doesn't ask who is to meet these needs. Of course, your spouse should have the exclusive rights to meeting those needs. It's just a questionnare of what your most important needs are. Obviously the OW was meeting them and your wife was not. <BR>Are your needs consistent? Why would your top need change? My top need might be honesty and openess no matter whether my H could meet it or not. Am I making sense here?<BR>I think you could do the questionnare and provide reliable responses. I think what gets everyones dander up is that you seem to be working through the steps but just haven't told your W yet.<BR>I know that when my H filled out his questionnare, he was not in love with me. He had committed to making things work but still was not in love with me. <BR>I hope this makes sense. Sometimes its so hard to get a point across when you are just typing.

Thanks all for the various responses after my last one. I do realize that everyone wants to help and also that an affair is a deeply hurtful thing. Thus it might be hard to be trying to react reasonably to a BS, and to see him (me) trying to custom build the mold he wants filled.<P>Anyway, I am leaning toward not doing the ENQ until after I tell her, but I think I will look over it thoroughly myself even now (it's been awhile since I first reviewed it). <P>I do recall, though, that when I reviewed it the first time, I did not spot anything that I would say she is not *willing* to meet. The first time I ever posted here (in October), in fact, it was with the question of wondering why I was unable to accept what she was more than willing to try and do (this feeling existed prior to the affair). It seems that the ENQ helps uncover unmet emotional needs so that the faithful spouse could start trying to meet them. Harley suggests that when that happens, the relationship can be restored. <P>I think someone also suggested that my focus may be only on my own needs, not those of my wife. Well, think about it...if I *could* find it within myelf to try and meet the basic emotional needs of my wife (or any woman), I suspect that I wouldn't be in the situation I'm in now. With her willingness to respond not in question, it could be blissful. But..there is some sort of barrier, and it's not only the affair, because this was the case before I met OW. So yes, I would be interested in discovering if there is some unmet emotional need I have that does not seem immediately apparent on the questionairre, because as I understand it, if this or these need(s) can be identified, it might be a little easier to put my feelings for OW in the correct perspective, thus easing the transition away from her and back to my wife.<P>Otherwise, folks, there's the tendency to call it "luv," with a big ole' red heart in the middle of it...and we all know that's not likely. But in the absence of better understanding, that's what it seems like. You all know that.<P>Right now I'm trying to do battle with my brain, DESPITE my heart, not out of my heart. My heart is with OW during this withdrawal period. (It hasn't been very long since we ended things, so it's all pretty raw right now.)<P>Ivory

Ivory ...... <P>How about you discuss all your confusion and your emotional turmoil with a therapist BEFORE you try to work things out with Mrs. Ivory?<P>Your pain is palpable in your words. Put your pride on the shelf for a bit .. and get guidance from a pro. <P>One of the things Mrs. Ivory is going to ask you is this .... "Why did you do this to us?"<P>You don't sound at all ready to answer that question. A therapist referral (from your church perhaps?) can help you prepare by helping you to examin your motives.<P>Take care brother Ivory<P>------------------<BR>~*~*Yesterday~*~*<BR>all my problems seemed so far away~*

Ivory,<P>Just a thought...<P>You sound like a logical man. My H is very logical. I gave him the book His Needs/Her Needs, he read the part about why affairs happen. I think he was already contemplating staying home but this just cemented it for him. He later told me that after he read that it made sense that the A could have happened with ANYONE. She just happened to be the one who was around the most and lent the emotional support. He realized that it wasn't the special thing he thought it was (those are his words). He genuinely thought that this was his one true love etc... After reading the who and why of an affair he realized there were logical reasons that this happened and that he could be in love with his wife again. I think this made his withdrawal period much shorter than not having been armed withthis information.<P>cleo

Ivory,<P>I suppose doing ENQ wouldn't hurt, but at this point, would it really help? I'm not sure that it would. I am both BS and WS.<P>It is hard for a couple to work together on anything unless they are "pulling in the same direction together." Your wife can't pull in the same direction with you if she's in the dark about some things in your life. I believe the ENQ results at this point in your recovery would be skewed and unreliable, especially if your emotions are more with OW than with your wife. I also think that once you reveal your secret to your wife, any good the ENQ might have done would be destroyed by her shock, rage, anger, despair, hurt.<P>Stephen Covey puts things succinctly: Put first things first.<P>My suggestion if you want to hear it? Bite the bullet: reveal the affair 1st. Ride out the commin' storm. Then when your betrayed wife wants to work with you in restoring your shattered marriage, she will be ready to accurately and honestly work through the ENQ, and you will both be on the same page together.<P>Sounds like your heart is headed in the right direction. Keep it up. We are here to help, listen, commisurate and share with you. Nothing speaks more truthfully than first hand experience.You have come to the right place!<P>Rockaway

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ivory:<BR><B>PlainJane, <BR>I appreciate your reply but you stepped over the line when you inferred that my intentions for the ENQ were to somehow justify my actions. The ENQ is referred to almost in every other paragraph of many of Harley's articles and answers; many claims are made about the good that it can do; </B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Sorry if I stepped over the line. I was not intending to do so. Another word that is refered to over and over again in Harley literature, is Openess and Honesty within the relationship.<P>Ivory, I don't mean to sound harsh. I have seen first hand how devastating a betrayal is, remember, I am the betrayer in the relationship! If the A never took place, and you and your wife were looking to fix your marriage, then by all means the ENQ would be a wonderful tool, but she only has half of the information. Its kind of like taking a test, then revealing you changed the questions, but the answers remain the same.<BR>PJ<P>

PlainJane,<P>FWIW, I have decided not to do the ENQ unless she has been told about the affair, and then it'll be up to her if and when we do it. Thanks for your reply and your concern. I had missed the fact that you were a WS.<P>Ivory

Ivory<BR>It takes a lot of courage to disclose an A. I don't know if it is better to be discovered or to tell before hand.<P> I will tell you to be prepared because the amount of pain she will feel will be something that you might not recognize. All of the BS here can attest to that. She might not act herself at all. I sure didn't.<P> Put any defensiveness on the back burner until the shock eases for her. Good luck and keep reading post for we are all in the same boat, none are "special" none worse none better. Jenni<P> ps. the sooner you tell her the sooner the healing can start. It won't get any easier and the timing will never get any better.