Well I'm back giving an update... Three weeks ago she moved back in and now I'm wanting her out again... Here's the deal. We have had a number of bad situations since she moved back but they all fall to one main underlying reason. Her EA/Pa with on man was put to an end by her and this has become a non issues. Another PA/one nighter was with someone not from my area and is a non issue. BUT the other Pa/one nighter was with a co-worker. I hold huge anger to this man because not only does he know me but he is married himself with 3 children. Not only that but he knows that I'm aware of the PA/one nighter. I asked my Ws to not have any more personal contact with this man. The only thing acceptable would be work only. The other day he came to her office and wanted to talk. He shut the door and told her he was devestated over an affair he was having with another person that ended it with him. My Ws didn't offer me this info but told me when I asked. I told her I have problems with her letting him talk to her this way and need her to close the door with this person. She got upset and said he doesn't matter and can't see why I don't get this. She said the next time he talked to her she would tell him... Well last night she started talking and mentioned this person. She was saying how she felt sorry for him because he was all confused... Here is a man with a wife and 3 kids at home who has gotten on woman pregnant(she also was married so had to have an abortion), slept with the secretary at the office, slept with my WS and also had an ongoing affair with someone from another area and my Ws feels sorry for him!? This man is the scum of the earth! I asked her why she didn't feel sorry for his wife and children. She didn't respond. She was getting annoyed so I dropped it. The next morning I addressed her calmly and said it hurts me when she has contact with him and that she feels sorry for him. She blew up and left the house. Asked when I would get over this because it doesn't mean anything... I'm very confused on how to handle this. If I'm in Plan A and trying to meet En and avoid Lb'ing how can I possibly address the wrongdoing here. She should not be allowed to be disrespectful to me. We cannot make any progress in putting our lives on the right path until this comes to some sort of closure. I am very quickly starting to have huge feelings of dislike for her when she continues to show no care for me and how I feel. Her contact with this person who means nother to her is more important than working on our marriage. How can you get the horse to drink? I'm quickly feeling like Plan B is my only option. Move her out and give her a good taste of reality... Start protecting me. I'm actually considering going on Anti Depressants to help me cope with the swings. Anyone have any ideas? I can't continue to drain myself only to have any progress made shattered when this situation pops up again. Not only that but as she stormed out she said she won't tell me if she talks to him again because I can't handle it... Now the trust issue is back on the table. Anyone ideas would be appreciated. Crick

crick - first, look after yourself and see a doc about anti-deps. They can smooth out the edges. Secondly, it's looks clear that she's not ready to really work on the marriage with these outstanding issues. Having more concern for OM instead of his family is obviously a skewed viewpoint. Instead of asking her to leave and Plan B, consider a counseling session with the Harleys first. There are plenty of advantages to having her under your roof.<P>But first, take care of crick.<P>WAT

Wat,<P> Actually we have had 6 sessions already with Steve. The part that is confusing is she was with 3 different people. In her eyes the only one that matters is the one she was emotionally involved with. Actually I have let this one go because she put closure to it in telling this person it was over and done. She did this because she needed to for herself... She simply cannot understand why the one nighters would bother me. I tell her I can put closure to it if she would make it clear to this person that any friendship is done and that it can only be work related. I don't see this as a big request. Problem is in order for her to do this she would have to do this for me and not herself. When I go back and look at our 8 years of marriage she has always been like this. To me if anything hurt her I would move the world to fix it... To her if it doesn't affect her it doesn't matter. Problem now is she's home and says she wants to work on the marriage but that means me do what she wants and if I have any issues just shut up and deal with it. I see very quickly we are going right back to the rut. I have worked very hard at improving myself in her eyes. I recognize the need to change and be better for her. She doesn't want to change. I can't tell you how many times she has said "That's just the way I am". In 10 years of knowing this person she has never once said I'm sorry, I love you without me saying it first. In our last session we talked to Steve about an argument we had. He asked how it ended. I told him I gave her a hug and said I'm sorry. He asked her if she said she was sorry and she said no because she didn't do anything wrong. I irritated her and she blew up at me... Not her fault. Steve had her tell me she was sorry and was trying to teach her how to say it... She was rolling her eyes and making faces while she was doing it. After that session she told me she thought we should quit taking them because they cost too much money. This is the first session where we addressed things SHE needed to do better. She really liked the sessions where he discussed what I need to do better and that I am partially responsible for our failed marriage but she doesn't want to hear anything about her and how she may have to change. I honestly question at this point whether I even want her back. My stomach goes into knots the minute she comes home. I can't sleep and have lost a bunch of weight. I'm afraid this is going to kill me before we can ever make progress... She's quite content in how it is if I would just quit letting things bother me. Of course she wouldn't want to do anything to help make me happy. She just wants me to shut up about it. I feel like I'm to the point where I need to save me so I can take care of my children. We were supposed to have a session tomorrow but today she decided she would be too busy and wants me to cancel it. I have decided to get on it myself and discuss some of this with Steve. Sorry for rambling.. By the way I have a Doctor's appt next week to ask for Anti d's.... Crick

crick - I think I understand, and my wife is similar. Tell me if you think so. She's a perfectionist and is very stubborn. She has a hard time admitting when she makes a mistake. Once she makes up her mind about something, that's it. Nothing can change it. She has a very high strung personality. She can find the faults in everyone else, but not herself. Never says she's sorry. Sound familiar? If so we're in the same boat and I don't know what to do about it. Maybe we can't change them.<P>You will feel better with the anti-deps. I became more laid back. Please consider not making any big changes until you've been on meds for about 6 weeks. Your tolerance/demeanor may change. Also, your doc will ramp you up on the dose until you get what works. Trust me on this.<P>Dave (WAT)

WAT,<P> Are you sure we're not married to the same person. The problem I feel is I can't change her... In fact I know I can't. I compare it to being an Alcoholic. You can't change one. They have to realize they're one and want to change. I held out hope when she said she wanted to come back.. She took the counseling and thought it great. Problem is it was as long as they told her it wasn't all her fault and that I needed to change. The minute change for her was mentioned she decided counseling is a waste of money. I have come to the conclusion that I cannot changer her and honestly unless she changes I don't want her... She's self centered, greedy, disrespectful and mean... She is a very beautiful woman and thinks this is what is important... I'd trade her in tomorrow for an average looking nice person. I plan to go on anti deps but quite honestly don't plan this for more than a few months. Just enough time to see if she shows signs of change. If not the rope will be cut and I'll move on. If I have to drug myself to stay with somebody that certainly isn't someone I want to be with. I am finalizing legal seperation so should things go south I have legal custody of my children. Money is very important for her and she'd take the children just so she didn't pay child support... She doesn't have time to raise them but has made mention in the past about getting a roommate so she could afford a full time Nanny so she can do what she wants when she wants... Hope for the best but prepare for the worst... Crick

crick/WAT,<P>I'm dealing with a similar flavor. Stubborn and not very open to looking within herself to ask "what can I change". Not a fan of counselling, and is very quick to judge someone else. Doesn't like to say "I'm sorry". The biggest problem we have is that she alters her core beliefs on a dime and expects me to follow suit. She decided 2 years ago to switch religions one day and informed me this with fire in her eyes, said the kids are coming too, and we cannot have a Christmas tree anymore. Not quite POJA. But the next month that was all forgotten as she was buying new decorations. She has (should I say had?) plenty of wonderful qualities to go along with these less than optimal ones, but over time they took their toll. Like WAT said, if my wife makes up her mind about something, you can't change it, regardless of logic.<P>She is in search of something but I don't know what. The next thing is always the answer to everything. Anyway, I'm rambling, but I can relate to your sentiments. My fear is her not wanting to change at all, even if she does want to come back.<P>