Hi all. Thanks for reading.<BR>My W had an affair. It went on for about 7 months and I found out about it this June...father's day no less. We had been married for 23 years...HS sweethearts, no other partners ever.<BR>Lots was going on in the marriage at the time. Our kids (2) were going off to college, we had moved to a new neighborhood and missed a bunch of our friends. She was having lots of problems at work and I was showing signs of a mild depression. I'll be honest, I was not doing much to feed her emotional needs nor was she satisfying mine. We had gotten really stale.<BR>So her longtime friendship with a guy at work crossed the line and I think she fell "in love" with him and out of love with me. When I found out about it she said she would not see him anymore...that did't last. She swears they are no longer sleeping together, but she sees him often for lunch together, and they phone each other nearly every day. Last month we had it out again, about how her contact with him was so de-stabilizing and painful to me. She promised to cut it off...lasted a few days and she's back seeing him. Maybe not as much but she still needs him in her life. I've asked her if she keeps seeing him because she can't stop, or won't stop. She does't know.....I don't think she's being honest even with herself!<BR>My questions? Am I a fool to stay here? Am I being selfish to insist that she not see OM anymore? How long do I let that go on before I do the Plan B thing? How do you negitiate that separation? Where do I get the strength for Plan B? I have a thousand other questions but these are a start.<BR>Thanks.<BR>John

Hi Johnny:<P>I'm sorry for your pain and confusion. You came to the right place.<P>Start here! <BR> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum29/HTML/000553.html</A>

BrambleRose,<P>THANKS! I am all over that site and lots of it helps alot. I have been trying the Plan A approach but I feel like we are not really getting to the heart of it, like were glossing things over a bit.<BR>I guess I just have an almost overwhelming urge to just bolt. Mostly to protect myself from investing so much emotionally then getting clobbered. If we are going to end our marriage I want to do it, I don't want to be the one that's left....EGO...I know. Eager for any other thoughts.<BR>Thanks again,<BR>John

Johnny, some quick advice from someone who let depression ruin his marriage. You need to seek counseling for yourself as well as for your marriage. Antidepressants can also be a big help. And I want you to know that it ain't over until you both give up. By what you have said, she has not given up on you so don't give up on her.<P>Now I want to share with you a couple of things I have learned. When you were first married, you loved each other very much and she was in love with you. When you had children the family grew and she loved er childeren but she also loved you. She did not loose any love for you when she also loved her childeren. She may well have "fallen in love" with the other man but I want you to know she DID NOT stop loving you just because there was someone else there to love. I know that statement stings but I want you to know this: she still loves you. She has not stopped loving you. She may not know how to reach you anymore but the love is still there.<P>Also as long as therre is one to one communication, the relationship is not over. This works for both the relationship you have with your wife and the relationship she has with OM. This one to one contact she has with him needs to stop. Unfortuantly, you can't force this but you can apply pressure. The recent move and having few new friends doesn't help matters because she may not have "someone to listen to her who will accept her as she is without passing judgement" -- (to use the words my wife told me). First off you need to become her best friend. Listen to her but don't try to solve all her problems. Accept her for who she is. Do not pass judgement and that can be hard right now but she must feel safe talking with you about sensitive topics. I would reccomend cultivating new friends as well but the 'bestfriend' is your job. You need to be that for her.

Joe in Tx,<BR>Thank you so much for the thoughtful advise. I really do appreciate it, and much of it does resonate.<BR>I did the counseling and anti-depressant route. It did me a lot of good. I was carrying aroung alot of unexpressed grief over a pair of deaths in my family. I got very cold, unemotional and sad. I lost interest in my joyful side, so naturally my W found me difficult to be around. So I do understand the role my behavior played in the A.<BR>I like what you said about how love evolves and grows in a relationship from the beginning. We do indeed still love each other...and we have managed to say that a few times in the last 8 months since D-Day.<BR>Tonight we saw a basketball game together, saw an old friend then we came home a just talked for two hours. No TV, no music, no relationship talk. We looked at decorating mags together, talked about work and had a good time. (Still working on the "best friend" thing you mentioned.<BR>I havn't yet given up. Neither has she, so there IS still hope. I just hope I've got the strenght to keep fighting for my marriage, and the strenght to keep my ego in check.<P>Your suggestions are terrific...Thanks!<BR>John<BR>

First let me say that my heart goes out to you and your wife. This is some of the hardest stuff anyone will ever go through.<P>I am mirroring your experience right now and frankly will track your progress to find understanding and support too.<P>Isn't it amazing that at a time like this when you feel devistated and betrayed that the right thing to do is be her friend. The strength that takes is unreal. I am still trying to find the strength to do just that. <P>In my opinion, your wife is not in love with the OM. She merely has gotten some support from him that she missed in you and now is conflicted on if she can risk letting that go. Habits and safety die hard. It's not love.. it's fantasyland.<P>Show her very clearly that she can get those things from you and it is safe to do so. Focus hard on proving that. Show her that the risk is minimal. <P>However, don't stop being firm that communication with OM has to END. Compassion and love with firmness. <P>I am not sure if it's the right way, but the approach I took is that the communication has to end and she needs to be committed to trying. Otherwise the consequences are immediate divorce. I wasn't mean about it, but I was honest and said I just can't go on knowing that he's in the picture. She will resent you etc.. but I don't think she can really commit and be open while leading a double life. Your path has to be unique to you.<P>In the meantime, I hope you are doing plenty of things to keep yourself balanced and sane. Get out, have some fun.. get close to your friends. Love yourself, it will help you love her. It helps.<P>So hang in there, stay put, focus and love. But set the ground rules for success.<P>Good Luck and I look forward to hearing about how things progress.<P>K

Let me asy you all this.<P>How much contact with OM constitutes "zero contact"? And how do you "negotiate" this? Negotiation to me means a give and take. Each side give a bit until an accomodation is reached. <P>Where is the give and take in zero contact?<P>I know intuitively that I don't want her to see him in any way. How do I get there withourt seeming to be controlling and other LBing attributes.<P>Any help would be welcome....THANKS.<BR>John