Ok, thanks to all you fine people who helped me yesterday when I was feeling guilty and very down because of it. Not TODAY though. I'm as angry as I've ever been. I just looked at my W cell phone bill. Even though I am out of the house, I can access her bill details over the internet (kinda cool). Well, Sunday she convinced me that she has not been in contact with OM and that message I heard on Easter from OM was first time he has called since she asked for him to pray for his sister. And she convinced me that it was all my fault that there is nothing going on. Well her cell phone calls tell another story. Calls were made multiple times EVERY day for entire month. Including, a call to a local hotel on a day last month (remember when she asked me back for week)when she was supposed to be at her friends house.<P>What do I do now? Do I confront her? Do I save this information for the divorce? If I call the hotel, will they tell me if OM was checked in on that date?<p>[This message has been edited by sadandconfused (edited April 24, 2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sadandconfused:<BR><B>Calls were made multiple times EVERY day for entire month. Including, a call to a local hotel on a day last month (remember when she asked me back for week)when she was supposed to be at her friends house.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Been there, done that. It sucks. Have you gotten any<BR>anti-depressants yet? You'll need them as the layers<BR>of lies start being revealed.<P>Bama

Yup. See? Believe us when we say they're all alike. Now, before you do anything consider talking to the Harleys to get started right before you make it worse. I wish I had had this opportunity, but I didn't discover MB for the first 3 months.<P>Whatever you do, do not confront her or be angry at her right now. What your actions are in the near term are very important.<P>Advice from others?<P>WAT

Should I call and tell her that I am filing. That's how I feel right now.

Please dont do anything while you are mad..pls.... i know from experience. Really look inside yourself and ask yourself "do i really love this woman?" "do i want to stay married?" if you answer is YES...then pls dont do anything in anger.<P>------------------<BR>Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want.

Yes, I still want to be married to her. But I can not keep letting her have such disrespect for me. I love her. But she continues to lie to me and make me think its all my fault. <P>I am very conflicted right now. I love her and want her back, but on the other hand I have had it with the disrespect. It is probably a moot point, she has probably already filed for divorce. What can I do?

I hope you get some more advice from vets of Plan A and B... but it seems to me that you should look into <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8113_ab.html" TARGET=_blank>Plan B</A> (I hope I did that right, I may have to come back and fix that)...<P>Don't-- DO NOT--- sign the divorce papers (if you get them) if you don't want the divorce!!!<P>By the way, about the cell phone bill -- been there, done that... ick, and I'm sorry.<P>

Well for one thing as hard as it may be you have to accept the fact that she is still in contact with the OM. Now this is the hardest part.....stop digging for proof and information about them. That will only make you more angry, and trust me from personal experience, she thinks everything she is doing is justified and right. So by getting mad and confronting her will only make her point. You need to cool down, go some where and cry and scream your head off. Then keep plan "A"ing, i know it is tough but that is really the only way. Getting mad and angry at them only pushes them away faster.<P>And if your not already. see a couseler. And I know you may not want to but look into anti-depressants. They really help durning times like these.<P>------------------<BR>Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want.

Again, consider talking to the Harleys or consulting a local counselor. Accept the fact that your emotions, as well justified as they are, may be impairing clear decision making. With all due respect for new_beginning, you're not to the point of Plan B yet. See? All the more reason to get professional advice - we are not professionals and can only go on our own experiences.<P>WAT

Yep, WAT is right!!!<P>See, sadandconfused, we all are just human and trying to guide you...<P>Find a professional human! <P>Hope is not lost!!!<BR><p>[This message has been edited by new_beginning (edited April 24, 2001).]

sadandconfused-<P>Good to see you not blaming yourself today Sorry to see what you are going through though. It sure does suck!!<P>I would like to suggest that you force yourself in to not saying a thing until you have cooled off. Please take this advice from someone who has learned patience the hard way. And still learning - I might add <P>You will have by far better results if you allow yourself plenty of time to work through this within yourself before ever confronting anyone.<P>Why can't you take this information-tell yourself over and over again that you are not to blame-and when W sees the change in your behavior she is going to know the game is over. <P>As long as you allowed yourself to believe that you were to blame she got to play the game-see what I mean?<P>I bet you anything she gets pretty scared pretty fast when she sees simply that you no longer take the blame <P>Play a fair game-but please please please take time to sort it all out before confronting over anything-you will be so glad you did. And it is a good thing to learn.<P>Best of luck!!!! I think you are going to be just fine <P>------------------<BR>*heartache*<P>"Life's A Dance<BR>You Learn As You Go.<BR>Sometimes You Lead<BR>Sometimes You Follow!<BR>Don't worry 'Bout What You Don't Know<BR>LIfe's A Dance <BR>You Learn As You Go."<p>[This message has been edited by heartache (edited April 24, 2001).]

Okay, I have not called her yet to tell her I'm filing on her instead of her on me. Now what do I do. Plan A says to try to convince them to give up contact. But she says she is done and wants a divorce. How do I convince to give up contact. I have tried being nice to her (something I have always done FOREVER). I guess just go about it calmly. Should I send her an email of some sort. What should I do??

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BioMan:<BR><B>That will only make you more angry, and trust me from personal experience, she thinks everything she is doing is justified and right. So by getting mad and confronting her will only make her point.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>This is the key having been through EXACTLY what you are experiencing. You cannot yell or scream in her presence. This will substantiate her current reasoning that you're a monster (or whatever it is she is using to convince herself that screwing around is justified).<P>Smile, be nice, tell her there is a family waiting on her. SHE WILL NOT BELIEVE YOU. No matter what you do, she will think is a trick, a ploy, a deceit. That is the world she is in. It will take months for you to convince her that her affair has not doomed her.<P>Get some anti-depressants, scream on a vacant lot somewhere, vent here, and do the right thing.<P>Bama<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sadandconfused:<BR><B>Okay, I have not called her yet to tell her I'm filing on her instead of her on me. Now what do I do. Plan A says to try to convince them to give up contact. But she says she is done and wants a divorce. How do I convince to give up contact. I have tried being nice to her (something I have always done FOREVER). I guess just go about it calmly. Should I send her an email of some sort. What should I do??</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>You can't MAKE her give up contact, but you can "love her back" into the marriage by meeting her needs, and no lovebusters...<P>Do not file for divorce if you don't want one... not to beat her to the punch... not to show her you're in control... not for any reason. Once you do it, it has a tendency to fly by and before you know it, you're divorced.<P>So... be as nice as you can be... and wait... that icky time thing we all hate...<P>

But she seems so convinced at this point. And time is icky its my enemy. I get so upset inside.<P>And when I'm nice she says that I am weak. My counselor suggested not giving into her demands. But not to argue with her.

And I know I shouldn't have done this, but there are 112 outgoing calls to OM on her cell phone. doesn't count incoming and calls made to and from the house.

Right now, do nothing other than get professional advice - at least listen to what we've already said. <P>No, don't try to convince her directly to give up contact. NO ONE BUT HER can do this. Plan A is all about convincing her that she should give up contact, because you're the better choice.<P>Do not call her or send e-mails at all until you have a strategy. Please do not file on her. This should not be a tit for tat situation. Don't do anything that translates into you want an end to the marriage also. It makes no sense to do something that does not promote reconciliation - it will just give her reassurance that she's doing the right thing.<P>Slow down. This is a long process.<P>Leave her alone other than to make sure she knows you want to work on the marriage.<P>Be nice, but don't lose respect for yourself.<P>Educate yourself by reading books on infidelity.<P>Demonstrate your improvements when the opportunity arises.<P>DO NOT beg, whimper, grovel, etc.<P>Browse this site for real life experiences.<P>Hold your head up high and know that you're on the moral high ground.<P>Don't give up.<P>WAT

>>she seems so convinced<<<P>I know. They always do.<P>...and then comes the aftermath...<P>oops. <P>Honest to God, sadandconfused, you will REGRET it if you pursue the divorce when you don't want it. Yes, you will go on with life, and will have HOPEFULLY learned some valuable lessons along the way, but you will wonder.... did I try hard enough? <P>I did it. I know.<P>I have no desire to put myself back into that position now that I got out (my ex had many affairs) and I could NEVER EVER trust him again, but while I was in it, I should have hung on a bit longer, I think. Let it play out...<P>My new favorite phrase: Regrets suck.<P>

Dear WAT,<P>Am I too late. I have already done the begging/groveling thing and you are right - it says it makes her sick. I don't do it on purpose, i just get what she calls a "whipped puppy dog" look on my face.<P>Also I have done the yelling and accusing thing as well and you are right about that - it pushes her away.<P>I know these things were wrong, but is it too late.<BR>S&C

You would all be proud. I just got off the phone with her. (She called me). She was asking for a favor to do with the school play that she was supposed to do but can't finish before she leaves for her sister's house tomorrow. I didn't say a word to her. I simply said I would do whatever she needs me to. <P>Was this Plan A-ing or was this caving?