Should I not take all of this affair stuff too personally?<P>Does the time spent away from home and family for TDY/TAD and deployments really the issue? Is the loneliness and boredom REALLY a big factor in fooling around, or is it the particular guy who is lonely and bored?<P>I can understand living in the barracks with a lot of young people who just want to have fun, and wanting to either fit in with them or else sit in your room. I can understand there being little to do on off-duty time but go to the clubs and drink. I can understand being in a foreign country where everything is weird and depressing. I can understand the curiosity and intrigue of carrying on with a foreigner for a lover. Having served in the army, I have been there myself. It wasn't enough to tempt me into betraying my husband, but I could see how it can happen, and I saw it happening all around me.<P>So am I not cutting him enough slack? Are these stupid questions?<P><BR><p>[This message has been edited by Bernzini (edited May 08, 2001).]

Hi Bernzini<P>I think what you describe is the temptation. There's a lot more to it than that. For 20 years of our marriage, my H was in various military assignments. Granted, he was not away from home a lot, but there were many times he was away for a couple of weeks at a time. He has always maintained that up until this affair, he was "straight arrow". He has lied to me enough lately, that I can now usually tell now when he's lying. In my situation, my H admits that he is terrified of growing old, and of death. He was at an all time low in his life (although he didn't bother to talk to me about it), when OW entered the picture and pursued him relentlessly. His self esteem was nearly non existent, and OW who was his boss at the time, gave him glowing performance reviews. He fell into the trap, hook, line and sinker. Now, he feels even worse about himself for what he's done and he doesn't have the wherewithall to break free of her. <P>As much as we try to not take it personally, it still cuts very deeply, and slowly erodes our souls. It is intolerable, and we should not have to put up with it.

I know what you mean by all the sudden being able to tell when your spouse is lying to you--now, I can tell, too. I can look back into the past and know about lies he told me then, as well. It's amazing how you can tune into that.<P>I also know what you mean about your spouse not coming to you with his problems--just taking it somewhere else when you should be the one that he entrusts his problems with. That's what hurts--I was willing to bear my husband's burdens, if only he had let me. I was there for him, I wanted to be there for him, anyway, but he pushed me aside and went to someone else. <P>Sidney--your husband's OW was his boss? If so, isn't that something that would definately get him into trouble if you came clean about it all?<P>That's something else that I am bothered about. . .<P>I have been seeing a counselor, an Air Force counselor, and in the last session I had, he just stopped me mid sentence and started laughing. He said, "Do you know that you could burn your husband SO BAD with all that you have on him? I have seen lots of wives do it. They go to their husband's command with sacks of photographs, panties, and e-mails. . . They leave the marriage well-off, too."<P>I got really upset with him. I said "Why would I want to do that? I came here to heal my marriage. I love my husband. I don't want to destroy his career. What you have described is not what I came here for."<P>The particular counselor I was talking to seems to approve of divorce, however, and I kept that in mind. After talking to him a couple of times, I decided that he was a jerk.<P>I am scared now that all I know is something that could get my husband into trouble, and he knows that too. So does OW. I don't want that.<P>I am really scared now.

Hi Bernzini,<P>What are you afraid of? I know that what I "have" on him could ruin his retirement benefits (he's out now), but it would also hurt me. Evidently, the rules changed recently, and he could be prosecuted as much as her, even though she was or is (don't know if she's still in)in an officer position and a position of authority. I did talk with someone from the AG's office about this. They gave me the impression that this happens A LOT!! I'm like you, I'm not out to destroy him, or anyone for that matter.

What I am afraid of is: <P>Him being found out.<P>Him being found out for maybe what I have said indiscretely (ie, the counselor, the chaplain, my friends.)<P>Him blaming me for ruining his career because of what I have done by talking about it, since we are already playing the blame game.<P>He has done well in the military--he is highly regarded and has worked very hard. I don't want to affect this.

<B>Him being found out.</B><BR>He did something wrong.<P><B>Him being found out for maybe what I have said indiscretely (ie, the counselor, the chaplain, my friends.)</B><BR>Again, he did something wrong. Covering it up will NOT make it go away.<P><B>Him blaming me for ruining his career because of what I have done by talking about it, since we are already playing the blame game.</B><BR>He did it, not you. Don’t play the blame game. Let him say what he wants. Don’t respond to it.<P><B>He has done well in the military--he is highly regarded and has worked very hard. I don't want to affect this.</B><BR>He has done well. So? He still screwed up. Should we say it was okay for Bill to (not ) have sex with Monica because he was a good president?<P>I’m not saying you should slam him & start telling everybody everything. But you have said some things so just let it be. Don’t fan the fire anymore.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

The ultimate tab from his decisions and perversions isn't your cross to bare...<P>I agree with Chris...<B>HE DID IT TO HIMSELF !!</B><P>The thing is....You are choosing to be in a loveless marriage because it is the <I>right</I> thing to do, and you know how much I admire that in you <P>But...how much are you willing to take??<P>Eventually your giver will stop giving and then you will be an extremely scorned woman...<P>IMHO....Hell you my opinion of his character...I won't bash him anymore...<P>What you need to decide is this...Ultimately will it be worth it for your son to grow up with this example of how to treat a spouce....By no means am I telling you to stop, this is marriagebuilders and I want to see your marriage thrive more than anything, but what I hate seeing is someone squashed by this form of abuse...I pray he will change and not let his ego continue to run his life...<P>You have a very long road ahead of you...pray often, God will show you his will...<P>Much love,<P>Bill

He did do this to himself, but it is my responsibility as a wife to support him and help him suceed.<P>You can understand my confusion: Help cover up a crime/Be a good wife to my husband.<P>Never mind that he ditched me for another woman, he wants me back now. . .and yada yada. I can either accept all of this, or go my own way. I chose to accept it, thinking that it was the right thing to do.<P>Forgiving is hard enough. But not having the luxury of going to couseling, seek help, talk to friends because of revealing a secret is awful.<P>If I ruin his job, it will take away the one thing that I know that he does love for sure. I couldn't do that to him, no matter how spiteful I felt.

Bernzini,<P> This is the first time i have lurked in GQ. I am usually in child/preg...lucky me...lol.<BR> My H was inthe army when he had his A and he was HER superior. Talk about trouble!<BR> I felt the same way you did. I didnt want him in trouble bc I wanted my M to work. Not to mention the military doesnt pay crap and i certainately didnt want our pay cut either.<BR> I wouldnt have needed pics to prove the A. She had his baby.<BR> When he cut off contact with her (we were now at another post) she threatened to call his CO. He told her to go for it and hung up on her. She called him at work. He hung up and went straight to his CO and told him everything. They told him that it was up to the co. each party was in to determine what the punishment was and if it came to blows they would give him the least possible...like 45 days extra-duty and little stuff like that. She never did so we didnt have to deal with it. But if I had gone after them they could have been in deep stuff. THat is basically it./ No one cares about the A unless someone raises cane to a superior and they have to address it.<P>My H was TDY when the A took place. He was supposed to only be gone for 3 months and ended up being gone for a yr and a half. When he first got there he could not believe what people were doing . He was actually disgusted with all the cheating and what not. How ironic now. They started out working together and then get this...some guy took advantage of her..so she says (not rape, just other stuff) and she called her my H called her to find out why she didnt coem to work. He felt sorry for her. They became "friends". They partied together..he was partying constantly and he got drunk and wham bam. It happens very often. MOre than anyone would like to imagin. But the military sets you up for it. They constantly seperate you from your family. Everyone is always stressed. The men are bored. All there is to do is drink and whatever else comes with it.<P>Didnt mean to go on and on, but it is all to real. I hate the army and in a lot of ways blame it for what happened. I know he takes responsibilities for hi sown actions but the army makes it real easy.<P>Email me is youd like..saderangel@hotmail.com<P>Love and Prayers<P>broken_wings

I don't know what is going to happen with my H... My H had sexual encounters with two women who are wives of military men. One of the men is someone he works with occasionally(the other man's wive already told him). I decided that if God places this man in my path is such a way that I feel compelled to tell him the truth then I will do so. I will have no regrets whatever the consequences because this man has a right to know, he should know, I wish my H was couragous enough to do the right thing on his own. I can't be responsible for my H's actions. He built his military career and if his actions destroy it then that is something he will have to live with, learn from and hopefully become a better person for it. If I lose my H over my actions then I haven't lost much.... Should my H lose his career and still have me and his children then he has more then he should have hoped for and although I know he would be devastated over his career, I hope eventually as the pain of that lessens he sees the value in our family. Well I will be seeing this man at the ball park when we travel to another county to play. There is no question that eventually I will run into him and his wife. There is no way I can act as if everything is fine and dandy, so he will know that something is up and if he questions me then .... well lets just say I'm praying daily for wisdom, direction, protection, and guidance. My H is deployed but he is aware of how I feel and what might happen. I know he doesn't want me to tell, but he accepts that I have to do what I feel is right. He believes this man deserves to know also but is afraid of the consequences. I say you don't sacrifice honoring other people to protect yourself....

Thank you all for your insight.<P>Chris, you are right, he did this to himself. <P>I am wondering, they talk about the "fog" that blinds a person in an affair. It had to be one HELL of a fog that caused my husband to not pay attention to what he was doing. . .I am wondering 'how could he?' Was he crazy? He had to be.<P>My husband is uh, well, a bit 'high-ranking.' With a high clearance. In my absence, he introduced his girlfriend to his buddies. He took her to his workplace. What were they thinking when I called and his roomates took messages from me? Once, I called and a guy answered. I told him I was the wife. The guy says "Uh, which one?" and started laughing. I thought,"Ha ha. Funny." HE WAS SERIOUS!!!!! She had to have been pretty darned special to parade around in front of people that my husband worked with, you would think. I asked him is she was THAT special. He said "Well, WE weren't." (The blame thing again--take the blame off him, put it onto me.)<P>The Clinton scandal, his impeachment trial, was going on the whole time my husband was carrying on with Miss Kitty. Wouldn't that have kind of scratched his brain a little?<P>William:<P>G, you know that I am OK, brudderman. I'll be alright, don't worry about me, silly. You just worry about getting your house painted. I would help, but I am a little far out of your neighborhood now, I am sorry, Hoss.<P>Broken Wings:<P>What a sad story you have--I count my blessings that there were no OC's involved (Miss Kitty made it a strong point in advertising her sexual availability by making it clear that she could not have children. Good for her.)<P>I can understand why you feel resentful towards the army. I was in for almost ten years and I loved every minute of it--however, I loved my husband and kids even more and the two just did not mesh compatibly. After having been a soldier myself, and then being a dependant wife, I see both sides of the deal. There is often a strong pressure to place your mission before your family, and it sometimes seems that the people who assert that they would rather go home to their families than spend an extra 5 or 6 hours in the motorpool are "undedicated." Especially in times when the military is so understrength and one person has to do the job of six. The same people are sent out to schools and on deployments constantly because there is not enough people in the unit. And there is so much pressure to excel, or at least to get all the work done (impossible.) I remember a couple times coming home from work, sitting down in my recliner and thinking "Gosh, I have absolutely nothing to do tonight except spend time with my family. . .this feels so strange. Well, time for bed."<P>And now, my husband is gone to another country. I don't know where he is, what he's doing, or who he's with. (I used to not worry about who he was with.)I don't trust him, given the turmoil we have been through the last couple of years. There is no time to build the marriage when he is gone all the time. Even when he is in garrison, he doesn't come home until late, he has to squeeze that extra pt in and then a buttload more of paperwork.<P>The job is what I have accepted about my husband. I understand and I support him--but I refuse now to take it as an excuse to distance himself from me. Or cheat on me.<P>And you are right--the cheating goes on everywhere in the military. I have seen it happen SO much, among my own aquaintances and friends even. I have had friends as victims of it. I have had friends involved in scandalous affairs. I have seen people burned and had their lives absolutely ruined by it. I had a good friend receive a reduction in rank and denial for re-enlistment for coming home from the field to find their spouse in bed with a lover. . .and then beating the crap out of the lover. (Everyone really pulled hard in favor of this person, he was actually a very wonderful individual.) That was really sad. I have seen a lot of young female soldiers have get out of the military, pregnant, to go where? Their boyfriends are on the other side of the world at home with their families. (What goes TDY stays TDY, right?) This is bad PR, I guess to say it. But it really is common, and all the more terrible because people can be punished for it. That doesn't stop it. And the different branches of service work hard to provide family advocacy and other programs in order to prevent stuff like this. That doesn't stop it, either.<P>What makes the difference is the individual, though. I have also seen a lot of people who are faithful and loving and who make time despite the hectic schedule to spend time with their spouses. They take time to write letters make make phonecalls when away from home. They are catious of where they go and who they are with in order to avoid the temptations. I have even seen guys who figure out ways to take their wives TDY with them, at their own expense of course, and count it as another vacation. So it's really the individual. The problem of being away from home and lonely a lot is just terrible temptation that cause some people to falter.<P>I am just wondering if I should really cut my husband a lot more slack because, I guess, he hasn't done any worse than many have done.<P>Broken Dreams:<P>You are planning to inform the other betrayed spouse of the encounter, is that right? You should seek a lot of counsel before you do that (I am not saying it's wrong, but I am thinking that you should be careful.) You probably have thought long and hard about what you will say and what may happen to the other family and to your husband.<P>Be calm, be nice, be mindful of emotions. (I didn't inform the other BS in my case, but I did verbally abuse my husband's girlfriend. I am a little ashamed of that now. Just a tiny bit--because it made ME look like a witch, too.)<P>This hurts like heck, doesn't it? I am sorry that we all have to go through it.

Bernzini,<P>Yes you are right it is all up to the individual. My H fell and he fell hard.<BR>I put the blame on the army. He doesnt put the blame on anyone but himself. The main stress factor for both of us is that he went TDY to go to school. He never actually went. He was waiting on a top secret security clearance. Fort Hood lost his paperwork so Fort Huachuca had to start it all over. THey kept telling him that any week now he would be able to go to school. In the meantime, they had him in charge of the Honor Guard, which is where he met her. Some Honor Guard, right. It was any week now any week now. I put my life on hold bc I just knew the moment i went back to college they would finish his clearance and put him in class and I would end up having to drop class and waste time and money. We tried to move up there, but they would not allow it. They told him that he would not be allowed to move out of the barracks (supposedly). I still have questions about that bc I believe that is when the affair started.<BR> H e was gone a yr an da half. Can you imagine? The only way he finally got out of there was by threatening. One of the high ranking officers had done some illegal stuff and my H said get me the hell out of here and I do not care how you do it. I know this and this and this. He was out within a week. <BR>I just think it is all bs. The crap the army pulled on us.<P>It seems to work good for some, but in our case I dont think anything went right.<P>How long does your H have left?<P>Love and Prayers<P>bw<P>