Can you believe it? I don't know why I allow anything to surpise me though. I didn't know that I was in line for the roaller coaster with the loop-de-loops on it.<P>Quick history-we're not married, been together 5 years. He has been like a father to my 2 D's. He recently took a job in another state-which I supported, thought it would be good for his self-esteem. But first, he moves out in Nov. '00, says he's not ready, OW follows right after (right before?). Stays involved w/her until he moves-then he ends it (she's LBing all over the place). Tells me he's made up his mind, it's me he wants, we can have a wonderful life together, gives me my ring back. Then, fear sets in. . .he's running again.<P>About a week ago he tells me it's moving too fast, tells me he needs to concentrate on his new job, we don't need to talk on the phone everyday-it's too expensive (then proceeds to still call me everyday anyhow??). I back off, do the best Plan A I can. . tell him how much I love him, try to be understanding of his feelings of confusion. So last night he tells me he talked to OW (pretty sure he called her), says to me "I don't know if you're still the way you used to be-making mountains out of molehills, but" (anybody smell a test?)-she wants me to go to a party with her next Sat. when I'm home visiting. Talks about how they are just friends. I said that it looked to me from the way she was acting towards the end (??), that she did not see him as just a friend, but that he had to do what he thought was best for him. I told him that I wouldn't like it & that it hurt, but it was his life & his decision. He tells me a bunch of mixed up stuff like, I don't want you to think that I don't love you or anything, I do. More about how they're friends, she was just upset b/c he didn't stay in touch with her when he moved. Says he doesn't know what it would feel like if I stopped loving him, won't know until it happens. Says he doesn't see them being together as a couple or anything. Says it's pretty hard for him getting used to living down there.<P>He is still so mixed up, still so afraid of me. Letting his fear run his life. I guess I'm just going to wait & see what happens this weekend, see if he goes w/her. His thinking is just completely illogical. How can he think that it should be ok w/me if he goes with her (can't I have any friends that are girls?)? This pain is horrific, although I am proud of how I am handling it this time.<P>What is this man thinking?

Bitsy,<P>Do you remember a month or so back when I responded to a thread and told you I regret marrying my H after I found out about his PA just 2 weeks before our wedding (I found out before the wedding, but thought he was sincere in his remorse)? <P>Please let this man go! I am still finding lies and my H thinks it's okay to have secret email friendships with women. He is a master of deception!<P>I know the pain is great - I'm experiencing it now bcs I just told my H of 16 months I'm done with the games, it's over. I wish I went through the pain of a broken engagement rather than untangle our finances and go through a divorce (a 2nd for both of us).<P>You say you're handling it well this time - go with that and tell him you don't want contact with him. Take a sabatical to really get in tuned with your inner soul.<P>I can't tell you what is best for you, just as my PASTOR (of all people for me NOT to listen to) couldn't talk me out of the marriage, but I can tell you my experience.<P>This man is giving you so much crap! I am so sorry you are going through this!<P>Good luck and God Bless!<P> <P>------------------<BR><B><I>RECOVER * REFOCUS * REGENERATE ~ BREATHE * RELAX</I></B><P>By Eleanor Roosevelt ~~<BR><UL TYPE=SQUARE><BR><LI>"People grow through experience if they meet life honestly and courageously. This is how character is built." <P><LI>"No one takes advantage of you without your permission."<BR></UL>

Bitsy,<P>I honestly believe that you need to cut this man loose and out of your life. You aren't married to him and he has proven that he is unable to be committed to you. He isn't your daughter's father and I think that this coming & going will not be healthy for them...and neither will it be for you.<P>There are plenty of available men out there. You deserve more than this rollercoaster ride.<P>Please consider getting out of this relationship. You & your girls don't need this drama in your life.

Morning Bitsy,<BR>Ahhh, my dear, your life is so complicated right now. I feel for you. ((((((((hugs)))))))<BR>Step back and look at this situation. Why do you love this man? You have been in plan a, and doing a great job in spite of the long distance issues and his fears. <BR>Think it is time to take a real hard look at what bitsy wants. Listen to you heart and your head! Time for some self-reflection, hopefully before he arrives.<BR>Hang in there, cl

Excellent advise from those who have posted to you. Most of our situations are quite different.<P>Our H's were (we hope) faithful and made a grave mistake with their A. We have lives built around a spouse, we have years of investment involving marriage, children etc.<P>I too , agree with the others. Follow what you feel in your head. If it were me I would take a different road in life.

Bitsy,<BR>I agree with the other posters...cut this guy loose. Your daughters deserve a much better "father figure" than that.<BR>If after 5 years, he still cannot commit he will not. As for "going to a Party" w/ OW..Because they are "friends"...that is just hogwash...he wants you as a fall back while he finds something better...this man cant stand the idea of not having "anybody" in his life to "love him"...He has alot of problems..and you cannot heal them...he has too, it just does not sound like he wants too..why should he??? He has OW to date...he has you...pledging your undying love for him, waiting out his "dating phase"...and God know who and what else in the rafters...ask yourself this question? once he gets past this OW, can you handle it again?? I would listen to free2bme...she has lived it...JMO MC

Thanks everyone for your caring responses. I'm tending to agree now. It makes me feel very sad that I have to protect myself & my girls from him. He is so very confused, so afraid and he continues to make his decisions based on those fears. I keep believing in him, keep having faith & he just keeps letting me down.<P>This is very, very sad for me. Obviously, it takes a lot to make me give up, but I think it's time for me to now.

Bitsy (((((((((hugs))))))))<BR>You are not giving up, you are growing up! You are learning that you are a very valuable important person that should have someone very special in her life. You are lucky that you see it now rather than later. Some of us mistakenly wait until we are into our sunset years before we recognize our unique selfs.....happiness is already with you bitsy. It is in your heart, in your family. Someone special will come along to share your love and happiness as soon as you are ready. (((((((((((hugs))))))))<BR>

Hi Bitsy,<P>Me again, I must be getting old, slowing down. I just read your post from the 12th and only responding now. Since I can't seem to keep up like the others, I'm going to throw in my 2 cents now. <P>I see that your situation has changed, I originally recommened you go to plan B. I think you still should and consider the info here. Remember plan B is to protect the interests and needs of you and your family. There is no one to do this for you but yourself. <P>I went to plan B and told H I was ready to go on with my life. You can't make a statement like that unless you really mean it. I did. Legal work still needed to be done but once that ball got rolling for me it would be like a point of no return. Well, since I am not a 'threatening' type (like OW - queen of threats), H knew I meant business. Even though he had made a decision (not really telling either OW or me), he kept waffling and after about 3 weeks, made the move home. Oh, OW tried real hard. <P>Let's see 27 voicemails in 4 days, 2 e-mails to H (1 of her big e-mails accounts got shut down, hmmm....), at least 5 phone calls to H, many hang up (clicks) on the answering machine service and the topping is as of this momment - 3 lovely voicemail messages to H but primarily directed to me (because she knew that I am the one monitoring the answering service). What a gem (stand for gross, egotisical menance)! <P>See, that is after the waffle. The point is that you need to step out and let him know that. Let him waffle on his own. Focus on other things to make you and your family happy. There are other things. Find them. <P>If he wants you back, he will come after you. If not, you have your self respect and know that you deserve the man who will also respect you. <P>Please take care. Pulling for you out here on the West Coast.<P>Hey, if you want to chat, my address is listed in the JFO.<P>L.

Thank you all for not leaving me here alone. This is very hard. I intend to tell him the next time we talk. I don't necessarily view this as Plan B (to protect my love for him), it is not a threat, an ultimatum or a punishment for him. It is just what I have to do, for me. What will I feel for him 2 months from now, I don't know. What will I do if he asks to come back & says he's made up his mind, has worked thru all his problems. . I don't know. A small part of me still has hope that I will hear that from him, but that is not why I am doing this. A small part of me also feels some relief, but mostly I just feel sad to probably be loosing what was a huge part of my life.

(((Bitsy))))<P>I re read my post and it seemed harsh, I am sorry. I am in the anger phase of my "recovery" I have been married 17 years, with 3 children. My H had the A while I was PG...that A produced a child. My H had been faithful for years, and this was his only A (lasted all of 3 weeks) I only believe him (trust is difficult) because I made him take a lie detector test (there are co. out there...in the yellow pages). I guess by my Harshness, I just wanted to "save you" from this unbelievable pain...but from reading your posts, you are already in unbelievable pain.<BR>I am glad you are going to move on. The one thing a friend told me when she was going through her divorce ( H was a nice man..no A...but he was a alcholic) she told me her reasoning was her two kids Boy and a girl ages 7 &9...she said to me...I dont want my son to grow up to "BE HIM", and I dont want my daughter to "MARRY HIM"...she was a psycologist by degree..but was a SAHM. This was so profound to me...because it is true....we are attracted to what we grow up with...You are saving your daughters from being emotionally abused by a waffling man (when they grow up)...because that is what this guy has done to you. You are a very brave woman, and you are putting you and your daughters first, as painful as this is for you. You are to be commmended. I think too if your told him that the waffling is not good for your D's he may pull his stuff together...But then again...5 years is a long time, and old habits can be hard to break...But you never know..just stay strong...and peace to you and your family love MC

Thank you all again, I just keep re-reading your posts. I'm going over in my mind what I want to say to him. (Hanging up the phone when we're done is going to be just awful). I'm thinking something like this:<P>I love you. What I'm going to say is not a threat, ultimatum or punishment to you. Almost every aspect of my life right now is out of control (name a few, but he already knows), then there's you. You who I keep believing in, keep having faith in and keep getting let down. I keep needing you and you are not there for me. I continue to feel humiliated, abandoned, alone, afraid & not good enough. My girls love you and continue to be hurt also. OD is asked by her counselor to draw her family and it's you. And right now what you are thinking about is going to a party with OW. I truely care about the struggles your having. . and I know the man who you could be, but you won't let him out. You keep running and you keep hurting. I feel a special bond between us and this is very difficult for me. I cannot continue to live with this uncertainty. It's very sad. If at some time you decide that it is me you want to be with, and you want to move forward, you can let me know but unless that's how you feel I can't continue anymore.<P>Thoughts/suggestions?

Hi Bitsy,<P>I just put a long post out there about my feelings of plan B. Some of it may be helpful. You are right to share your feelings with him. Then he has to digest it and decide. <P>He needs to see that the needs of you and the girls need to be of primary concern. If he chooses to be selfish, you are only hurting yourself, the girls and him by holding onto him. <P>Basically I am saying give him his rope and see what he does. Use as a rope of safety to come back to you and the girls or a rope to hang his life with you and the girls? <P>Please take care, <P>L.