After telling me again how he still wants us to move to CA together (although he still insists he is going to visit the OW this weekend and it is just a "friendship"). He tells me that it is a friendship on his end but he thinks she wants more. She asked him if he still felt the same way about her that he did in high school (15 years ago!) and I guess he gave her the vague "People change a lot."<P>She is screaming that she wants a relationship, he is telling me that he just wants "friendship" and he refuses to give this thing up.<P>I told him I don't want to compete (he says there is no competition between her and I) and I have explained that there is no room for the both of us in his life. He doesn't get this because he thinks she is a "friend" even though he knows she wants more.<P>I really think he believes they can "visit" this weekend and then he will come back and things will be okay. I wish he would see how he is sending mixed signals to all involved and how destructive his behavior is.<P>He wants me to come home but I am still at my friend's. 3 more weeks and I move. How do I get him to see that I can't have him follow me if he goes through with all this?

Dear Best,<P>Would you please explain whether he is going away for the weekend with her or simply seeing her, for lunch or something. I guess I'm asking because just based on what you wrote, and not knowing more of the story, if he is just going to see this old high school friend who has a crush on him then the situation isn't really all that bad. If they are spending the weekend together then that's another story. Thanks.

He is going to see his grandparents for the weekend but he is going to spend one day with her and spend the night in a hotel room. <P>This isn't an old high school crush, she wants a relationship with him and their e-mail and phone calls have gotten intimate. They talk multiple times a day.<P>My old posts are listed on May 18th if you need more info.<P>Thanks

Oh, sorry. Well, are you sure that even if he does go through with this, that eventually you wouldn't want him to follow you? Or if he does this, that's it, no way to get back?<P>I was in your husband's shoes and repeatedly went through with it, though I tried to cover up. I honestly don't think there's anything my wife could have done. She threatened to move away, but since we have children, had she moved them without my permission I was perfectly prepared to go after her for parental kidnapping. Which, in case you don't know this, is the term for taking kids away from one parent without their consent or without a legally binding custody agreement. There is even an international convention that obligates member states to repatriate children taken to their territory without the consent of one of the parents. Anyway, that was an aside, but an issue worth bearing in mind if you have kids. Once you get nailed for kidnapping, though it's almost impossible to be arrested for it if you do it openly, your chances of getting exclusive custody are greatly diminished, and the other spouse's chances of getting primary custody are enhanced. So she wasn't inclined to follow through and I pretty much had my way and that's precisely how nasty I had gotten.<P>I would just say that the thing to remember is that this is some kind of process for both of you, and you can only speed the thing up so much. Moving away may help, it may shake him up, but unless you are prepared to file for divorce immediately then you should probably be prepared for worse to come and a fairly drawn-out series of stages till you come to the end.

I read and responded to your original posting. <P>Your husband is fooling himself and he's trying to fool you too. He's already in "the fog". The altered state of mind that people seem to slip into when they justify affairs. Some on this site call it the "alien state". I discussed your situtation with my husband (WS). His take was that your husband is nuts if he thinks he can spend the night in a hotel with a woman who wants him and not get physical. My husband went on to say "Been there done that."<P>Your husband is already having an affair. Even though he has not consumated it physically, it is an affair. To make matter worse he is being disrespectful and abusive of you. I know from your previous post that you get all of this. That is why you moved out. He obviously does not get it.<P>Have you read Dr. harley's book "Surviving an Affair"? My suggestion to you is that you get the book and read it before you plan your next move. If there is any way you can afford it I would also suggest that you make a counseling appointment with Dr. Harley or someone in his office. You have a tough situtation here but one that does not have to take the path it's head down. The book is a quick read and will give you great insite into what affairs are all about and how to save one's marriage. And also how to move on gracefully (Plan B) if that is the right course.<P>I know that what your husband is doing is painful beyond belief. I feel that you do have to take a tough love approach you have already embarked on. However, affairs take place in 60% of all marriages. Most marriages recover from the affairs. If a couple will do the work (again see the Dr. Harley books) they can not only put their marriage back on track but can end up with an even better marriage then they had before. I know this from my own experience.<P>I found out about my husband's affairs on March 22. Two months ago today... it seems like a life time. I thought my world had ended. But after much reflection I realized that I had married him "until death do us part." I promissed to stay in sickness and in health. When a person is having an affair they are going through a kind of "sickness" (MHO). So I felt that I needed to give our marriage and him at least one honest shot. Thank goodness I found Harley's book "Surviving an Affair". I am astonished at the emotional growth we and our relationship are going through following Dr. Harley's suggestions.<P>Don't get me wrong, I am not saying here to let him have his way. On the contrary, I am saying be tough with him about this but be wise. And do not put up with the disrespect and abuse. But this does not have to end your marriage. <P>There is an interesting post on this site. I really wish you could get your husband to read it before he embarks on his trip.<BR> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum8/HTML/004357.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum8/HTML/004357.html</A> <P>((((((hug)))))))<BR>Z

Hi Best,<P>You actually sound better than you did before. I still wish you would change that handle. <P>Anyway, My H had said something profound to one of our children just a couple of days ago talking about responsiblity (which surprised me...esp since he too had an A) He said, " we all have to have repsoniblity to people, I have a responsiblity to your mother because I am her husband, and she has a responsiblity to me" because she is my W.. Your responsiblity is to respect and listen to your parents, teachers etc.. mine is to respect your mothers wishes, and to come to compromise, when we do not agree"..My 12 y/o had raised his voice to me (1st time), it seems "Carson does it to his mom all the time so what is the big deal"...well it is a big deal....Do you see where I am going with this???<P>YOUR H has a responsiblity TO YOU, and meeting another woman ANYWHERE, ANYHOW, ANYWAY..is a breach of that responsiblity to you...now mind you my 12 y/o understood this concept in life...I would think if your H graduated HS 15 years ago he is over 30....you would think he could understand this...if he breaches his responsiblity to you...HE HAS NO RIGHT TO TELL, YOU ASK YOU, to "wait for him"....he is doing "WHAT FEEL GOOD FOR HIM AT THE MOMENT" without taking into consideration how YOU feel, or what this will do to your relationship, when he is done. I dont believe for one second that if he had intimate phone calls and e-mails...AND she wants a relationship....and he will be in a hotel room...that he will be there alone....he cant believe for a second that you actually believe that????<BR>He is a real FOG and he best snap out of it...does his grandparents know that he is using their home in a prelude to adultery???...has he respected them enough to tell them?<P>Sorry if I am harsh, BUT your 30 + old H needs a reality check, he is playing all sides here...he is VERY Selfish,<BR>and you owe him NOTHING if he hurts you like this...Let me ask you a question...how would you feel if this OW (who wants him so bad) got pregnant??...it happens, most of the time it is planned and very caculated on The OW part...funny how this is a planned weekend???...well it does happen in fact there is a whole board here that deals with that issue.. Your H has to understand he cant play with your feelings like that...hopefully he will wake up before this weekend....Good luck...and again I am sorry I know I dont have the Harley way of thinking..too hard to change the way I was brought up...My H had an A (3 weeks in length) and he is suffering as much as I...because I am angry, and he will take my anger or leave....that was the choice I gave him...Not a Harley method (no plan A here)...but it seems that it does work (harley methods) just I dont have it in me...I hope he see's the light..

Actually, I agree with MyCross. Like her I never went through Plan A. I found out about my husband's affairs before I found "Surviving an Affair". At that time my first reaction was like yours. It stops here and now or we are through. Luckily my husband knows me well enough to know that would be my position. One of his first remarks to me was that he loves me and wanted our marriage above anything else. He told me that everything stopped at that moment. So far he seems to be living up to his promiss. I've let him know that if he digresses, he's out of here with immediate, short lived Plan B in place. Then I get on with my life without him.<P>I watch what some of the people on this site are going through with Plan A and my heart breaks. It seems to me that Plan A is meant to be done for a very short time, not to linger for months and months. Then it's Plan B time. I do not interpret the Harley material in the way many on site seem to. To me it is a method of tough love. It calls of a strict Plan A. If that does not work in reasonable amout of time, Plan B. Remember that in Plan B, there are two purposes. The first is not expose yourself to any more of the lovebusters the WS is dishing out so that your love for them can be safeguarded until they have come to their senses. The other purpose is to give the BS a safe place to be so that they can fall out of love with WS and move on if the WS does not come to their senses in a reasonable amount of time. Nowhere does Harley advise people to put up with crap at all and just 'play nice'.<P>In my mention above about the benefits my H and I have received from the Harley methods, I am talking about things like his 4 rules (rule of protection, rule of care, rule to time and rule of honesty), meeting each other's emotional needs, personal history disclosure, NO LOVEBUSTERS, etc., etc. We are now living by these and what a wonderful difference. For the first time in my life I know that people mean when they say that marriage is hard work. I finally know what I'm suppossed to be doing. It took me 2 failed marriages and my h's affairs in this, my 3rd marriage for me to discover what might be second nature to some. Why couldn't the Harley's books have jump off the shelves and hit me in the head years ago? Having to go through this mess in my life to discover it is a large price to pay.<P>My husband and I both grew up in troubled families. His father left when he wsa 13. He and his sisters have not seen their father in 34 years. My father cheated on my mother constantly. Neither of us grew up in homes where our parents understood how to make a marriage and family work. H and I keep saying that someone should put the Harley stuff into a Family 101 class for high school students. So that at least once, before they get too much of a chance to screw up their lives, they are exposed to how a healthy marriage and family functions.<P>I know I digress hee. But it's meant to shed some light on 2nd Bes's situation. My point after all this... tough love and don't let him disrespect and insult you. But just always realize that this does not have to distroy your marriage. You have choices.<P>Z