(To get a full story, read all post. There are not that many.)<P>To make it quick, let me just say that after my wifes second affair (one PA one EA) I find myself in the awkward position of still seeing if there is a way to make this work. She says she still loves me and it was a mistake and she still wants to work it out, yada,yada,yada.... The way I caught her this time was by taping her phone calls.<P>Anyway, I stopped taping her calls now, whats the point, she was already caught. I came home the other day to find that she was searching for the device I used to tape her. This struck me as strange. If she has nothing to hide anymore why would she be doing this? When I asked her she says she was just curious how I did it. I also found the history on the PC cleared. She was doing this to cover her e-card trail. She swears she did'nt do it this time. The kids don't know how to so...<BR>I got this feeling of doubt now that I can't get rid of. We are trying plan A and that call for no contact and complete honesty.<P>Should I be worried?<BR>What should I do?<P>Thanks,<P>Jim S<p>[This message has been edited by Jim S (edited June 03, 2001).]

I would be concerned. I hope you both are in counseling.<BR>She has been in a PA and an EA. She wants to know how you did it so she would not be caught again. It does not sound good. Get into counseling immediately or the chances will probably be great that this will occur again.

Jim S:<P>I read all your posts. As I read them I found similarities<BR>to another post I had read. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think this other post was from your W? I don't know if you are aware or not? If this is your W and you didn't know I should hope you won't view this adversely. I certainly wouldn't want her to feel vulnerable or hinder her crys for help if she posted privately. If this is the case, she is also looking for help, which is a good sign in rebuilding your marriage. Nevertheless, we are all here suffering and need support, help and encourgement. <P>As a BS I can certainly sympathies especially when children are involved. I know too well the terrible feelings your having. <P>Take care and I'll check back later.<BR>

Hurtwife, <P>She posted on my advice.<P>Jim S

Jim S:<P>That's good, I didn't want to step on any toes. Did you read her posts. Sounds like she wants to work it out. I had written her unfortunately my computer kicked me off and lost it all. I'll write back.<P>Since I read hers it give me a little different of a perspective with her problems. I want to write you back also with some information. Just don't have time right now, but I'll be back.<P>Take care.

Hurtwife,<P>Sometimes I think she does, sometimes I don't. Sometimes I'm not sure if I do. It's a real trust issue. I cannot be sure that it has ended. Believe me, I have been through it before. The promises, reassurances, only to find out later I was played a fool. I really think the only reason her PA ended before was because time OM got tired of the Bull#@$%. So I really don't know. How do you trust again? How do you believe again?<P>Hanging in there,<P>Jim S<p>[This message has been edited by Jim S (edited June 03, 2001).]

Jim S:<P>It appears in your w post that she was diagnosed as manic depressive. Manic-depressive illness also known as bipolar disorder, is a serious illness that causes extreme shifts in mood, energy, and functioning. If your wife was recently diagnosed and not familiar she could benefit from this information also. Her illness could be attributed to her marital infidelity. <BR> <BR>The disorder typically emerges in adolescence or early adulthood, but in some cases appears in childhood. 3 Cycles, or episodes, of depression, mania, or "mixed" manic and depressive symptoms typically recur and may become more frequent, often disrupting family, and social life.<P>Depression: Symptoms include a persistent sad mood; loss of interest or pleasure in activities that were once enjoyed; significant change in appetite or body weight; difficulty sleeping or oversleeping; physical slowing or agitation; loss of energy; feelings of worthlessness or inappropriate guilt; difficulty thinking or concentrating; and recurrent thoughts of death or suicide. <P>Here are some sites I had found about bi-polar disorders when I was researching trying to figure out what my H's problem? <P>Surprised me that a lot of the symptoms fit my H, relationship problems, which include destruction of personal relationships. Sensuality is pervasive, the desire to seduce and be seduced is irresistible (I thought this might account for the A's). Excessive moodiness or irritability, and impulsive or reckless behavior overwhelming confusion, racing thoughts. There are more listed on the sites.<BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Pulled from one site:<BR> <BR>Often people with bipolar disorder do not recognize how impaired they are or blame their problems on some cause other than mental illness. <P>Descriptions provided by patients themselves offer valuable insights into the various mood<BR>states associated with bipolar disorder:<BR> <BR>Depression:<BR>I doubt completely my ability to do anything well. It seems as though my mind has slowed down and burned out to the point of being virtually useless....[I am] haunt[ed]...with the total, the desperate hopelessness of it all... <BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ <BR>Some other symptoms are: <BR>Persistent sad, anxious, or empty mood <BR>Feelings of hopelessness or pessimism <BR>Feelings of guilt, worthlessness, or helplessness <P><B>These site have a great deal of information:</B><BR> <BR><A HREF="http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/bipolardisorder.html" TARGET=_blank>MEDLINE PLUS Bipolar Disorder</A> <BR> <BR><A HREF="http://www.helioshealth.com/mental_health/bipolar_disorder/" TARGET=_blank>Helios Health Bipolar Disorder</A><P><A HREF="http://www.brainconnection.com/topics/?main=cc/bipolar-print" TARGET=_blank>Brainconnection Bipolar Disorder</A><P><A HREF="http://www.suite101.com/links.cfm/1073" TARGET=_blank>Suite101.com Bipolar Disorder</A><P><A HREF="http://www.mhaccess.com/bipolar/index.html" TARGET=_blank>Bipolar Disorders Information Center</A><P><A HREF="http://www.lorenbennett.org/" TARGET=_blank>Bipolar Disorder Digest</A><P><A HREF="http://www.mentalhealth.com/fr20.html" TARGET=_blank>Internet Mental Health Bipolar Disorders</A><P><A HREF="http://www.psycheducation.org/" TARGET=_blank>Psych Education Bipolar Disorder</A><P>A lot of information to read but this could be benefical in helping you understand and dealing with this illness. I hope she has a good doctor. It can be managed with the proper medications. Please share this with your wife. <P>Best wishes, take care, hang in there<BR>May God Bless you and yours.<P><BR>

Hurtwife,<P>The thing is she might have been diagnosed with depression but they don't know about the manic part. I've been kept out of the loop. Since all of this has happened, a doctor has yet to confer with me. My wife just gets on the web and prints things out on what she thinks she has. Nothing has been confirmed and I have not been informed by any medical personel.<BR>Hard for me to be supportive if I'm out of the loop.<BR>Sometimes I think it is just an excuse for what she did.<BR>I really hope it's not.<P>Jim S

Hello Jim,<BR>What name does your wife post under? <BR>Thanks, cl

Mixedup is hers.

Jim S:<P>I was just going by what she posted that her diagnoses was <BR>manic depressive. <P>Does she have a psychiatrist she is seeing? She said she was on medication. <P>An accurate psychiatric diagnosis requires: <BR>A full physical examination to rule out physical disorders presenting as mentla disorders.<BR>A full diagnostic interview (including collaborative information from family or friends when possible) done by a licensed mental health professional: fully trained in mental<BR>health diagnosis and who has sufficient knowledge of medicine to recognize when the symptoms of mental disorder are due to physical causes. <P> RE: I've been kept out of the loop. Since all of this has happened, a doctor has yet to confer with me.<BR> <BR>It sounds like you don't really know about her medical condition. If a doctor hasn't conferred with you, don't you think you should consult with the doctor. After all usually you have to go to the doctor, they don't normally come to you. Kept out of the loop? You are living in the loop, this is your W, you need to know in order to deal with this. <BR>You will not be informed by medical personnel unless you inquire. I certainly would think you have a right to know. <BR> <BR> RE: Hard for me to be supportive if I'm out of the loop.<BR>Sometimes I think it is just an excuse for what she did.<BR>I really hope it's not.<P>Why are you out of the loop? She tried to commit suicide!!!<BR>She definitely has a BIG problem. People don't try to commit suicide for NO reason. This is a distinct cry for HELP, not an excuse for what she did. She also posted in reference to suicide attempts..."only have tried 3 times though". She needs HELP, this is NOT normal by any stretch of the imagination. She could attempt again and the next time be successful.<P>I realize you are in pain, hurt, feeling betrayed and angry. But, I think you need to try and look beyond that right now and focus on the immediate problems of her mental health. How can either of you progress if she is mentally disabled? Perhaps you both can get into counseling. Counceling could help you get through this also. You most likely have resentment for what she did, this could be keeping you from giving her the support she needs right now. <P>Sometimes you have to make the right decision, and sometimes you have to make the descision right.<P>Take care and hang in there. <BR> <BR>