Thanks everyone for your posts on my other thread.<P>My H gave me an ultimatum to call him by 1pm today or he is going to do something with his lawyer. He finally gave his mom his phone number for me!!! Amazing, so now I don't have an excuse not to call other than I am in plan B (which legally doesn't hold water).<P>He called his mom this morning (liason) and said it is illegal for her to be in the middle cuz' a court has to appoint a mediator. She tried to set up visitation with him and he just said no, he wants to talk to me and what I am doing is highly illegal by not letting him see the kids. !!*&$@#!<P>So now I am stuck. I either let me lawyer handle it since he won't go through his mom like I asked in the plan B letter, or I call him and he'll probably yell and scream and I dissolve the no-contact.<P>He also said he re-read the plan B letter and had his lawyer read it and they both agree I am being manipulative and not letting him see the kids. How??

hbh, as long as you are not keeping the kids from him, it is NOT illegal. Do NOT give in. You even have HIS mom as the liason. He is just baiting you. Don't bite.<P>Stay calm. There is NO law that says that you have to see him. Let him see the kids as much as he wants. If he's like my immature H he'll most likely start to pump the kids for info. "what's mom doing"..."where's mommy"....<P>It is so aggravating.<P>It is wonderful that you have his mom as your support. Hang in there.

His stance is that since I am not contacting him (after 1 phone call that he said to call him back) and his mom is not the official mediator that I AM keeping him from the kids.<P>Even though she has tried many times to set up visitation with him. <P>I think the real issue is that I want them supervised and he says he doesn't need them that way. But you would think if he really wanted to see them he'd take whatever and whenever he can and at least talk about it and try to work it out...

He is baiting you and i doubt he had any lawyer look at your letter. My XH used to pull this type of stuff all the time. The courts realize how volitile such situations are. I believe that they would understand your point here. There is no law that says you have to let him in your house to see the kids.<P>I believe that Plan B allows for people to communicate via email or letters. Just not on the phone or in person. There is no law that says you have to talk to him.. none. In your case having all communications in writing is important because he is twisting things terribly.<P>He provided his mother with a phone number. Tell his mother that you need an address. He can always go out and get a mail box if he does not want you to know his "home" address.<P>It is not illegal for his mother to be a mediator. However, if he does set up visitation. She cannot keep him from taking the kids on an outing. Until the court orders supervised visitation I do not believe you impose that. If is lawyer is worth 5 cents the proper advice is set up visitation then just pick the kids up from your mom.<P>HE IS BATEING YOU. <P>Contact a lawyer today and have them handle the visitation issue. This will take the wind out of his sails. <P>Z<P><BR><P>------------------<BR>He loves not who does not show love.<BR>----William Shakespeare

Bating me for what though? I don't even know what it is he wants. <P>I agree, I cannot legally setup supervised visitation, but I was trying to do it without getting lawyers involved. If my lawyer did handle it he would go for supervised visitation anyway.<P>I tend to think he did actually see a lawyer, but I also think he twisted things around so terribly that he could make the lawyer believe he was a saint. He also kept telling his mom that I abused the kids and trying to threaten me with that. I am not worried about this though because I didn't, it just bugs me.<P>Since my deadline is 1pm today, I think I will leave him a voicemail but will not talk to him and re-iterate that I need no-contact right now. I will also call my lawyer and get him prepared incase my H does do something.

Baiting you for what? To get his way of course. The 1 pm "deadline" is no more court ordered than supevised visitation, so what are you worried about exactly? He's behaving like a two year old who didn't get the cookies in aisle 5- treat it as such and ignore it is what I would do.<P>

Yes, but what exactly is his way? Getting me to contact him? I don't know. This whole thing is so draining. More mind games.<P>I did leave him a message. Told him what was up, was really nice and said to stop contacting me so I could get over him. If he chooses to go through a lawyer - so be it - it will all be the same in the end anyway. Hopefully he'll accept the no contact now and let me live. I figure this is sort of like email/letters in that I didn't actually have to talk to him (that's my excuse).<P>(Even better I hope he'll leave OW and go that route...)

Hurtbyhubby, why is he doing this? CONTROL CONTROL CONTROL! He wants back the CONTROL over you and by you actually moving FORWARD for yourself is getting him in a tizzy that he doesn't have CONTROL over what you do, what you say and how you act. It is a scare tactic. For you to leave vm or otherwise is giving him back the CONTROL. If you are not prohibiting him from seeing his kids so you have NOTHING to worry about. Don't do anything but sit back and watch him hang himself with his own rope. You went to Plan B knowing that the WS would react in a negative way, he is reaching for whatever he can to get control back, don't fall into his trap again. Make sure you have all copies of your Plan B letter showing proof that you are letting him see his kids via his mother, and he declined.

Thanks guys. I can live with myself now that I left that message. I feel much better inside just knowing I told him the way it really was. If he chooses to still believe I am being manipulative and this other stuff, so be it. He can talk to my lawyer from now on.<P>Otherwise, if he gets his head on straight he can work things out through his mom.<P>Either way, I now feel like there is no longer any chance of miscommunication (he said, she said). He knows how I feel and can't try to read into it or pretend I'm doing something else. Well, he can still do this, but at least I will know for sure that he is just being an [censored] and it's not due to miscommunication on my part.<P>I feel peace with myself and I know that I will not stray from plan B again.<P>Yes, I do have a copy of the letter, and I also have his mom who has tried many times to set up visitation with him.

hurtbyhubby,<P>Is way is to keep things exactly as they were, where he can come and go as he pleases and give you crap. This is all about controlling you.<P>You know the incident the other day where he came into your house and left all of your doors open, look some minor food items, did his laundry and made phone calls?<P>I described this to my counselor... it came out as part of a discussion about how loudly people's actions speak. She has been a play therapist fo years. Here's her assessment of what he did. It's fasinating.<P>House entered <BR>... he will not respect the boundaries you are establising (he will not respect your boundaries and will do whatever he pleases to you) <P>Doors left open <BR>... he will not ALLOW you to have boundaries (again he is trying very hard to break down the boundaries you are trying to set.)<BR>....he will expose you to the world (he is doing that by telling his mom and other that you abuse your children, and other "bad" things about you)<P>Doing his laundry<BR>..... he's going to bring his "dirty laundry" (emotional garbage) to you. She made a bet that he did his underware as that is the most symbolic form of laundry.<P>Taking food<BR>.... you have to take care of his basic needs, as his wife it is your responsibility no mater what he does.<P>The phone calls<BR>.... more boundary breaking and spreading the word about how terrible you are<P>Interesting?<P>After all of her analysis,the conclustion is the same as the original one that came to my mind. He whats to control you. So he cannot allow you to have boundaries of any kind. He wants to do what ever the h*** he wants and expects you to be there to take care of him and pick up the pieces. She also agreed with me that what he did was a very dangerous warning to you. <P>My XH is like your H in this manner. Five years after the divorce he still tries to be controlling. I usually will not talk to him. Most of our communication is through email and letters. He fought my setting up boundaries just as your husband does. He ever kidnapped our son and disappeared for several days to JUST SHOW ME. <P>From my experiene there is no way to deal with a person when they are in this mind set. Your voice mail telling him is probably quite appropriate. What I found in dealing with my XH is that I had to avoid "conversation". Voice messages are ok because it is not direct contact. You and he will have the separation needed to step back and think about what was said before responding. Though I'd keep the voice messages to a minimum. <P>Your H is proving to be a tough cookie to deal with I my bet is that things are not going to get any easier for quiet sometime. <P>Don't know if this helps but your situation reminds me so much of my XH that it is making my stomach hurt. I know how hard this is to deal with.<P>Hang in there and keep posting.<P>Z<P><P>------------------<BR>He loves not who does not show love.<BR>----William Shakespeare

Hi HurtbyHubby:<P>Hon, I deal with this stuff everyday. Please go tomorrow and see an attorney to get some temporary orders in place so that you are protected as to who has custody of the children. Right now either of you has the right to have the kids...if he wanted to he could come and get them and you wouldn't be able to stop him...legally, until you could get a Temporary Restraining Order set up. Temporary orders could give you the right to set up visitation without having contact with him. Getting supervised visitation is more difficult because you have to prove that there is a actually physical or psycological danger to the child from the parent and the surrounding he might place them in. Once there are legal orders entered then the officers can force those orders to be followed, but not without them. <BR>These kinds of actions are pretty uniform from State to State but that's the law in Texas.<P>Faye

Buffy is right. Please do this tomorrow for your children. Although a divorce can take a very long time, the inital orders can usually be done very quickly. My attorney was able to get it done the first day ... they are fairly standard.<P><BR>Z<BR>