We have been married 14 yrs> My wife now wants t divorce. We have two wonderful children ages 6&4. They are suffering as well as me. My wife has used the courts to remove me from our house and then I have found out from my children that my so called friend and her are seeing each other and have actually been in the same bed together. This is what my children have seen. It has been very painful to accept this. She refuses to go to counselling and has convinced herself that the kids will be fine! She has also wanted full custody of the kids and I refused. And just won a temp. order to 50/50 just today. I also have bought back our home and she has to move out in 14 days.<BR> I am sorry to go on like this, I just have never felt this kind of pain before. When this all started back 2 mths ago I taped recored some of her calls, and found out then that she had an affair(Brief),then she got very upset that I did this/invaded her privacy. We also had a pushing and shoving incident that I am truly sorry about. I have always just wanted a chance to work on our marriage and family! Is that too much to ask for?<BR> My questions are. I can force her to go to counselling through the courts(3 Seesions) Should I? Should I confront htis so called friend about how I feel and to see if he will back-off. Should I sign the divoce papers, I can wait for two yrs in PA.She has never read any books and what can I do to, to get her to?I just am lost for answers and I need to find away to release this pain my kids and I suffer. Pls Help!!!

I can't tell you what you should or should<BR>not do. That is, unfortunately, something<BR>you have to determine. What is best for<BR>everyone concerned? Although extremely painful, sometimes divorce is the answer.<BR>We can't "Force" another person to do a thing/make a decision, whether right or wrong. Begging, pleading, and applying quilt,<BR>simply don't work on an individual who is<BR>determined to do something. Another form of<BR>VERBAL/non-confrontational, communication has to be tried. Forget the other person involved. (Hard to do, but it took two). If<BR>your wife wasn't going to have an affair,<BR>NO ONE could have persuaded her to do so. <BR>You don't mention what your marriage was like<BR>prior to this terrible event. Did she work<BR>outside the home? Were you working late hours, tired all the time when you came home?<BR>Did you have many outside interests that took<BR>you away? Was she always with the children,<BR>never with other friends (women)? <BR>

We had a good marriage. We were planning on building a new home this fall. Yes! she started to have new friends both men and women that are younger than her. She does work full time. I was always involved with the kids.What do you think I should do about the counselling through the courts and do you think I should confront this so-called friend? I am not willing at this point to give up on my family! I am hoping that by me getting back into our home and now that we have a custody aggreement in effect that she may now come around. She from day one has not been out of the home and was basically controlling the custody of the kuds, letting me see them when she wanted etcc.. I don't know if this will make a difference or not? We also have the holidays comming up that we always spent as a family, and now it seems that we will not this year. Thank You! for your reply.

I am sorry that I was not online. <P>From what you have written, it would seem<BR>that your wife has developed "NEW" friends<BR>and "NEW" interests outside the marriage.<BR>She (from what you have written), has grown<BR>apart from you both mentally and physically.<BR>How did this happen? Were you too tired to<BR>go places with her? Did you feel that you<BR>could not share her interests? Did you do<BR>anything together (without the children), on a weekly/semi-weekly basis which might have involved your interest/interests? <P>I DO believe in counceling, when both persons<BR>agree to it. When someone is ORDERED to do<BR>something, they do so unwillingly. They feel<BR>confronted, and their attitude becomes <BR>defensive. Could you not tell her your self, that this would be an excellent oportunity for her to voice her own problems with your marriage,or problems pertaining to other things going on in her life?

SECOND PART OF LAST REPLY:<P>You did not mention whether this other person<BR>is married, or single. You also didn't <BR>mention whether she is still seeing this <BR>other person on a regular basis. NO! You<BR>should not confront the other person.That <BR>would merely inflame the situation.<BR>YOUR WIFE WANTED TO BE WITH THIS PERSON, OR SHE WOULD NOT HAVE DONE SO! IT IS AS SIMPLE (AND VERY PAINFUL),AS THAT! If we don't want to cheat, we don't! This entire matter is about you, your children, and her! The other person is simply an adendum... Albeit a very painful one.<BR>If your children saw your wife in bed with another person, the shock must have been tramatic. The children need help through family therapy! WHO, OF THE TWO OF YOU ARE THINKING ABOUT THEM? How does she have custody of the children? Why are you out of the house? I can't imagine an attorney allowing such a thing under these circumstances, unless there is something more to this.<BR>

Hi !chasinec<BR>Thanks for your reply. We did do some things together, but I feel some of our problems were because we didn't have our kids on a schedule. This made it hard to find time together. As far as custody goes this is a interim court order, to be followed by a pyshiatric evaluation. Which I am hoping she comes out unfavorablly for what she has been doing. I am out of the house because she had a court order. We also had a pushing and shoving match one night, and my soul is paying for that every day.This other guy is a person that we knew through friends. The reason I am so angry about this he knew how I felt about her because I was crying like a baby in front of him one day.I feel strongly I need to confront him.He is single 25 yr old , she 34. Yes, he sees her pretty much even when the kids are there. We have only been seperated for 3 mths. She now tells me that we will never get back together because i listened in on her voice mail at work, and taped recorded her phone calls at home and beat her up. The last part is over blown. I was trying to get the children to come with me and she keep getting in the way, this was our day together. I have never done this before.I have been trying to get my son into counselling, but she says he don't need it. I was wondering also should I sign the divorce papers or wait until the two years. I still feel I need to hang in ther for my kids, but it is becoming very hard to do because of the way she treats me. It is hard to believe that this is the same girl I feel in Love with. I have told her that I felt this same way about her 4 yrs ago, but didn't walk away, what kind of father or man would i be? That was when we were having problems with my step son who is 18 now. She has become this cold evil person. She is now very mad that she wasn't awarded custody. I am thinking since I have been out of the house until now and will be going back at eom because i bought the house from her and now that there is a custody aggreement so that she can't control the situation this might wake her up. Nothing has changed for her since this all started, I pray that this might change her mind.Should i call this guys mother and explain the situation to her? Pls adise.

Your situation is tearing your heart out from what you have written; but your young children (I am certain), are hurting right along with you. They are probably<BR>acting up, not paying attention to parents telling them to behave, and generally a bit of a handful. That is a child's way of demonstrating resentment, anger and hurt.<BR>If this younger man is seeing your wife on<BR>a regular basis, even though he is fully<BR>aware of your heartache, and your feelings on<BR>the matter, do you really think his mother is<BR>going to be able to control him. He is, after<BR>all, 25 years old. Not 18. He is obviously<BR>not concerned with anyone else, but himself.<BR>Your wife will discover this eventually. <BR>Right now, I am sure, it is all still "NEW".<BR>"NEW" wears off within a short amount of time. People stop trying to be on their very<BR>best behavior, and their real personality<BR>displays itself. She will eventually come to<BR>see him for whom he really is. He will come<BR>to see her in a different light. I wish I<BR>could tell you "Yes, file for a divorce."....<BR>or..."No, don't file for a divorce". You<BR>must make such a painful decision. I could <BR>tell you that you should wait it out; but <BR>for how long? They might be together for <BR>only a few more weeks, or painfully longer.<BR>When you move back into the house, where will<BR>she go? Will they move in together? If so,<BR>they will have reponsibilities beyond what<BR>they presently have. Those responsibilities<BR>will either unite them (if they are truly<BR>serious), or tear them apart, if it is just<BR>a "fling". I am so sorry that you are going<BR>through this. And terribly sorry for your<BR>children as well. Your wife made a very<BR>concious decision to cheat on you with another man, and has continued to do so openly, and infront of the children. In so<BR>doing, she has certainly displayed no respect<BR>for you, the children, or the family. She <BR>has displayed a supreme selfishness and<BR>a great immaturity. Why? Has she always<BR>been this way? Has she been running her life<BR>the way she wants to with little regard for<BR>you or the children? Or, is that simply the<BR>impression I am getting from what you have<BR>written? Was she a good wife and mother,<BR>always there for the children and you on<BR>most occasions? Or, was she a bit reckless,<BR>self-involved, and reluctant to be with you<BR>and the children? <BR> <BR>

Hi Chasinec! Thanks for getting back to me. Yes she has in the past been a somewhat decent mom and she was there for me. She feels that she can't depend on me. I really don't know what that means. Do you? Ever since we had this pushing and shoving match, she is now placing all the blame on me. How do you build that trust back? I don't think they are moving in together, but I am sure he will be there. I am struggling with the idea of sharing my children with someone else and it is killing me. She has no remorse for what she has done and takes no responsiabilty for how we got here. She just says you can't make someone feel something (Loev) I tend to disagree with this. When I mention is this the way you want to spend the rest of your life with the children going back and forth, she either gets mad or hangs up. She then will tell me that was my choice to have the children spend their lives like this. And I will tell her that is her choice! I don't want this family to break up. It is like I am to blame for fighting to see my children.I should just walk away and let her have them and then just "visit". This OG has said that he doesn't want any trouble, what do your think of that? Do you believe that once I get back into our home and she has to find a new place and now that we have a court order on the custody that she will wake up? I am just becoming to tired. She keeps putting all the guilt back on me that if I only left her alone and now that all the things that happened tape recording phone calls and found out that she screwed someone, checking her voice mail at work, another guy calling her! and that night that we got into that fight. She says that she will never come back. Have you ever had your spouse say that they will never come back? Thank You! I feel much better after you reply. In PA it will take two years for the divorce to be final and I thinking that after we split the assets I am going to drop the divorce papers and then she will have to file, do you think this is a good idea? I also can force her to counselling through the courts for three sessions, I know it isn't a good idea to do this, but I was thinking that during that time i can deposit some big love deposits, because as it stands now all she does is hang up or get very short.One last question when I mention that I never thought you would cheat on me, she says that in her eyes the marriage was over, is this her way of rationalizing or what?<p>[This message has been edited by DJB (edited September 15, 1999).]

djb- well I am not an expert on the Harley principles, but I am learning more every day. Your wives behavior sounds very typical of someone who is newly into an intensely emotional attachment affair. Have you read the book Surviving an Affair? It pretty much told me exactly what my wife was doing, thinking, and processing with her thoughts about our marriage. It sounds like you did alot of love busting after discovery, (justifying her actions in her mind about you and marriage), and now you must decide if you can do some type of Plan A behavior. I really believe that women in affairs have to be treated with care and understanding from their husbands. (YES, even if it kills us). For women the affair is really more about emotional needs and not really about sex. Have you sought any counseling and maybe with Steve Harley or Dr Chalmers as offered on this website. Hang in there, if you don't want divorce don't do it. With you having custody of children, I believe you have a large advantage over the OM, not to mention his age. In my opinion, these days that generation 22-25 years old are scarily immature in life. It will die, but you have to be patient and wait for that and then be ready to reconcile. You do have to show you are willing to make changes and rebuild your marriage, though.