Upon reading calis last thread "why didnt I have the affair" much the same as alot of replies ther i thought... cause i have to much respect for myself to decieve my marriage my H my kids and myself.......and to be honest if i was that selfish as to have an A (EA or PA) that i would feel like crap (after i got out of the FOG) for all the hurt ive caused ....this got me worndering how my H feels cause he never tells me i guess i shall have to guess.<BR>but my Question for WS's who are out of the fog...... how does your actions make you feel as a person and toward your spouse? Dday and today ? EA or PA and do you consider the impact of EA's and PA's the same?<BR>

LOTR, <BR>I can only tell you that I feel like complete and utter slime. I am so very low. D-Day was more than a month and a half ago. The affair had already ended. My wife and I were already separated. She is now living on the other side of the country. I have taken the route of someone who wants desperately to restore their marriage. I don't contact OW. I don't have any desire to. Once the fog lifted for me, that was it. Now I am allowing God to do everything to change me, so that she can see a consistency. Radical Honesty! I will go anywhere, do anything to get her back. I have a promising career as a reporter in the news industry, I would give it up in a second. I would pump gas. She believes that divorce is her only answer, but she isn't 100% sure so she waits. She says she's wanting to do God's will. Maybe you can tell me what she's going through? <BR>As for my actions, I feel pathetic. I have few days where I feel much joy. Only sorrow and sadness for the pain I have caused my wife. D-day was the worst, but now I think it gets no better, especially when I don't feel like she even wants to try. This is no pity party, only sadness for what I have done to her. She never deserved that.<BR>

MH,<BR>Thank you so muc hfor the honest reply for a minute i wasnt sure if this thread was gonna get any <BR>Your honesty is very heartwarming and not know ing your PRECISE circumstances I will only say that on Dday "I" felt devestated, like vomitting, betrayed, decieved, made a fool of, angy, vengeful, etc...... today is 7 months later and i stil lfeel most of these things but in a lessened density, meaning not as strong as i did on DDay, however i am sure that if my H was remorseful, and willing to work on the marriage (not that hes still with OW its just that his thinkin is ferget it it will go away) as you seem to be than i would probrably not feel most of the described feeling above.... however i think one feeling that will never fade is decieved. and it just might cross your W's mind the theory of if he does it once than he will do it again. trust is a major factor right now.<P>Best of Luck to you<BR>LOTR

Looking back now, 2 years later, I still feel like "WHO WAS THAT GIRL????" I still can hardly believe it was me. I was the virgin when I married and the type that always said I would NEVER do that. It disgust me, but I have to forget the past and press on toward the future.

I also felt like it wasn't me, like I was possessed. It was 15 years ago...But I do feel good about my self cause I made RIGHT decision to stay and rebuild my marriage (it wasn't easy but " nothing is ever easy")...My children were small at the time (didn't even know what’s going on) but I am not ashamed to talk about it even with them today. Yes I've done it, I made mistake (everybody make’s them one way or another) but I made right thing in the end and I did my best to compensate my H for what he was going through...That's how I feel.

LuvOnTheRox,<P>STL is on travel right now so I'm going to answer this for him. He's written a few times about how he feels on this forum.<P>He's told me that he has felt shame, guilt and a lot a pain and remorse for what he did. He was the BS in his previous two marriages. In both cases his wives left him for the OM and alternative life styles. STL says that the pain he feels is far worse then what he felt as the BS. And that's quite a statement because I know that he was devastated by both of his wives leaving him. He says that this is because in having the affairs he broke from everything he believes and hurt the one he loves. <P>He too does not talk about it much. I've had to drag it out of him at first. At least now he can verbalize it some. I have however seen the depth of his pain in his eyes when we talk about what happened.<P>One thing he has said is that he was very self-righteous to his 2nd wife about her affair. Said a lot of things to her about how she had broken their vows and God’ s law’s, etc. On some level he thinks that his affairs were his come-upance; the Good Lords way to make him eat humble pie.<P>Z<P>------------------<BR>He loves not who does not show love.<BR>----William Shakespeare

Roxy, <P>Coming out of the fog is almost more painful than staying in it. The hardest thing in the world is to be honest with yourself about who you are and what you have done. I know that each and every day I think of it, and I still cry over the pain, anger, hurt, and fear I caused. I know that everyday there aren't enough hours in the day to make up for it. I know I can't change it, redo it, or wish it never happened. But I try in every way to show my remorse. I know that by working hard there is a chance to rebuild some of what was torn down. I hate talking about it, but for her sake, I answer any questions she has. I have put my feelings on the back burner, because hers come first. Sometimes she gets angry because my answers don't make sense to her, and I admit, they sound pretty stupid to me too, given that I realize how much I love her. But all I can do is be there for the meltdowns that still occur and reassure her how much I love her and put the bricks back one by one and hope there is enough reinforcement for us to be stronger. I have no contact with OW, and have no desire for any. <P>Hope that helps answer your question. Keep the faith!<P>*Out of our greatest fears, come our bravest deeds!*<P>Trueheart

TrueHeart<P>Just wanted to say that what you wrote sounds so much like what SeenTheLight says. It touched a cord in me. <P>Your comment about it being more painful to come out of the fog is one that BS should take to heart. It does take a special kind of bravery to face one's own deamons. I believe that if the BS can find a way to make it "safe" for the WS to talk about what they have done, the WS will come out of the fog quicker. I guess that's one of the purposes of not love busting.<P>Z<P>------------------<BR>He loves not who does not show love.<BR>----William Shakespeare<p>[This message has been edited by zorweb (edited July 10, 2001).]

zorweb,<P>So is that why when I talk about how my actions over the years led to the A, my W (WS) says, "It's not about you. It's about me."? <P>SG

SprayerGuy<P>The way I interpet it when the WS says that its not about the BS but about them is that they realize that it does not matter what the state of the marriage was when the affair started. What matters is that the WS has the sole responsibility for choosing to have the affair. They had the choice of handling things in any one of several ways. But they choose the affair. That choice has nothing to do with the BS.<P>So that statement means that the WS is taking total responsibilty for the affair. <P>They are not however, taking total responsibility for the state of the marriage. That is a different issue.<P>Does this make sense?<P>------------------<BR>He loves not who does not show love.<BR>----William Shakespeare

LOTR:<P>EAs and PAs are equally affairs, IMHO.<P>In my case, there was a deep feeling of guilt and self-loathing, even pre-DDay. D-Day only heightened what I felt about my behavior (and, no, it was the "shame" of being "caught"). I don't know if this is the case for everyone, but it certainly has been in my case.<P>As for since: zorweb and I have been working aggressively on emotional needs and the four principles: honesty, care, protection and time. So, even though I still feel regret, remorse and shame for what I did, I am more focused on moving forward, so it is becoming (after 4 months) less of an issue.<P>Godspeed,<BR>STL

Zorweb, <P>I totally agree with that last statement...<BR>Taking responsibility to have the affair is a one person decision, how you got to that point has to do with everything else in your life, the state of marriage, work, kids, careers...all the things that make a marriage and life what they are. WE, as the WS, stepped out of a situation that wasnt meeting one or more needs and we are responsible for that decision. It's sort of like taking control of our out of control situation..if you can understand that. We took control and made a decision that we "deserved" to have those needs met...and the WS that are able to realize that they are responsible for that take it upon themselves to see that it is about us...our choices, our mistakes. The WS that are still putting the BS through HELL, are the ones that take no responsibility for it, blame the BS for the affair, blame the BS for the WS state of mind, and end up justifying the A by the actions of the BS, (which in my mind is BS..LOL). Only when the WS takes that responsibility for their actions, and realizes that there is noone else to blame but themselves, does the true D-day and recovery begin, IMHO. I see so many in here that have D-day after D-day because the WS has not yet come to terms with what THEY and only they did! I hope this helps...and thanks all for the great posts!!<P>How do the BS deal with it when they KNOW, beyond a shadow of a doubt that BS is still lying and cheating? Why do you continue to deal with it time after time? I am wondering if the self esteem issues and feelings of insecurity mentioned earlier play a bigger role than truly being in love with a WS?<P>Trueheart

zorweb,<P>Thanks for your ideas. Gives me something more to think about. I'm not sure if what you say makes sense to me yet but it is worth considering. I see the point though that my W questions the state of the marriage before the affair. There were a couple of times pre-A that my W suggested counseling (at least for issues related to the children). I told her at the time to go ahead and check into it if she thought we should. Well, she didn't and she now says that she just got busy and put it off. Bummer I didn't take the hint that she really wanted me to enthusiastically get behind the counseling idea. Now I also think pre-A she was questioning why she wasn't more attracted to me and why she didn't want/need sex before the A. On the other hand, she really didn't convey how bad she felt. Communication.....she probably felt like her concerns wouldn't be received too well.<BR>SG

just bumping up