Our marriage has reached its breaking point. Wife is still home. She was told in joint therapy to be honest and tell me when she has contact with OM. Om is also married and has said he is not leaving wife, she knows this. Has told me that relationship is wrong and this one also.<BR> sHE HAS SEEN AND HAS HAD DAILY COMMUNICATION WITH OM since therapy. So what about the honesty. She has told me this is going to be hard for her to do, to break it off with him but she knows she has to do it. She also saids that it will be done by our next appointment in 2 weeks when she feels the time and place is right. She said she may not be able to do it on a phone at work she may have to do it in person. <BR> Ok this sounds sincere, but she has been lieing about seeing and having contact with him so how do I believe this.<BR> What can I say to her, where do I go from here. The therapist said this is it we both have decisions to make.<BR> Is she making hers?

Will...<P>Have you and W done plan A? You can help her draft the letter and send it with her? If she has to do this in person, both of you should go. I imagine he has not told his wife of the A, and has no desire to do so either. Make sure and read Plan A and Plan B, also Surviving an Affair here. It will give you some direction as to where you can head. Best of luck!!<P>*Out of our greatest fears, come our bravest deeds!*<P>Trueheart

The only reason a person lies is because they do not want the consequences of what the truth may give. She obviously wants to have her cake and eat it too, unless you are not giving her her cake...It seems that she is very attached to this married fella and does not WANT to let him go. Find out why. Ask her what makes him satisfy her more than you do. Ask what does she get from him that she doesn't get from you. Perhaps if it is not him, it will be someone else in the future. You need to find out why she feels she should be in another man's arms and address that directly. If you are not satisfying her in some way, you may never have that capacity within you and need to move on to someone that you can. Nevertheless, you need to let her know that you are not going to settle for this treatment and let her go find herself. Remember, if you love something set it free, if it comes back to you it's yours, if it doesn't it never was. Good luck. ~FLgal~

will12 - I am the wife of Sad_n_Lonely. Your situation sounds identical to mine. My H lives at home still, he is contacting the OW everyday, many times. He has told Jennifer Harley counselor of MB, that it is almost over over the past 2 months. He keeps telling us that it is very little, it is almost over. She does not want to talk to him until it is over now. <P>Jennifer told me, to start thinking of Plan B this past thursday. On the phone she asked husband how much more time. He said 4 weeks, Of course I replied NO, H asked for 3 weeks of course NO. Jennifer came in with how about 2 weeks and H asked for 2 weeks with a possible extension. Of course NO, I can't. Anyways we sort of POJA at 2 weeks, not quite POJA, but husband can't seem to accept this totally. I am planning on Plan B. H and I talked about it last night, and we both agreed that I will leave, the BS spouse. We run a business out of our home, and he said all his stuff is here and it would be easier for the business. I really have no choice, he won't leave, therefore I will sacrifice myself, the kids, the environment of our home. I love seeing the interaction around the house. <P>The lies keep coming from my husband everyday. He tells me just yesterday that he only contacts her through voicemail. Will I found out today, that was a lie too. I could tell yesterday that something was not right with his personality. He was not nice on the phone to me when I talked to him with service calls. I run the phones, business, paperwork, billing, etc. He was short on the phone, quick phone statements, at home he would not sit down to eat dinner, stood by the TV and ate. He knows to sit at the table and eat is important for the family. Even if it is only him and I. <P>Now I know why yesterday he was out of sorts. He told me that was the first day he did not talk to her on the phone. He only did voicemail. All the other times were lies, and that hurts. We got into a big argument last night. I didn't want to go somewhere with him to pick up something. I said I don't need to go, to a friend of mine and pick up a couch and loveseat. I said take one of the kids, teenagers. I could sense this was not going to be fairplay. He insisted that I go, we talked some, could feel the tension. I was afraid to speak and sure enough, things did explode. He blasted me with ugly words and body language so balistic. He took off when we got home and I said we need to talk. Why couldn't he say to me, Honey this is the first day that I haven't heard her voice beside voicemail. I may be out of sorts. But no, he put me in a situation that was really ugly. <P>The conversation, was blamed on me for not listening to him. Him and OW have good conversation. He called me ugly names because I talked about myself. He said I am tired of hearing about you I want to talk about me only. I invited the talk of Him and Debi. I tried to be there, I actually listened to what he was saying, even though it was hard. I asked towards the end of coming home that we have a conversation without her in it. To talk about him and I, to talk about the future, etc. It escalated to pure burn wife to the core. The words came out very strong and hurting. <P>I don't know what else to tell you, but I am still on Planning on Plan B. I feel this is the only route to go. If husband is so unhappy with me, then he can see how it will be like in this household without me around. I know it will be difficult for me, cause I love my husband and want this marriage. He does not want the marriage, with all that is wrong between us. <P>We are in the same situation. The OW is married and is staying in her marriage. She doesn't want her marriage, as I can see. She is still talking to my husband. She lives many many miles from where we live. But what takes another role in this is my H has been paying for her cell phone bills, I found 2 of them, he says he has been sending her cash. He told me the day before, he will not send her any more money. Now last night he is contemplating paying her upcoming phone bill. <P>Also, her husband does not know of the affair. I asked Jennifer if I could send him evidence and she said no. As long as we are together (husband and I) no, if plan B comes into effect, go ahead. The OW I guess from what my H says, has no intentions of telling her husband but knows she should. H asked me to not say this, this is the OW's 2nd <BR>affair. I guess she told her husband and he of course is not happy with that and reminds her of her unfaithfulness.<P>I am concerned why my husband fell in love with this OW, who can't seem to stay in a marriage faithfully, she according to my husband is dumping my husband. They talked of marriage and stuff. They got quite intimate on cellphone and e-mail was quite graphic. Why is she so attractive to him, he is in a fantasy of life with this woman being so passionate and no external problems. <P>Our chances of marriage holding together, are quite slim at this point. Counseling with the Harleys, we have not even got past block l to follow path recommended to a wonderful marriage. Also, H has not opened his heart to accept me in. When he took off mad last night, I feel he went and used his cell phone and talked to her. She is his confidant, soulmate, oneflesh, and etc. Seen the words he uses towards his OW. <P>Just to show you I am in the same situation. I feel probably the best thing is Plan B. I am not happy with Plan B, but I feel this will be the only way to get my face away from reality. To know everyday husband talks to the one he loves, and not have to face it. And also to not know that we are in the same house as roommates and not lovers. Therefore, Plan B probably is best for you. The lies are surrounding you everyday. The WS doesn't care about you or the lies, only themselves and their OP.

I need to go over what I typed. The OW has not told her husband of this affair with my husband. The OW did tell her husband of her first affair, that is why husband is still using that against her.<P>We also, did the Plan A letter. That did not work in our situation either. If possible, talk with your counselor about Plan B and also the consequences.

Thanks all for the replys, nothing does change hear. So iam finally starting to loose hope.I ran across something where I think there planning to meet tonight. I dont think she has any intention of ending it with the OM even though she tells me she knows it is not right. Well I have a strong decision to make, I dont know if I can wait out the 2 full weeks the therapist requested. Thanks all!

will - what is the decision you think you need to make?<P>WAT

Well my decision is going to be a lawyer. She told me she is going to break it off but I just see more lies. I cant stand the dishonesty when she was told to be honest in therapy. She was told 2 weeks to end it. We are rolling up on the 1 st week saturday with not a trinket of honesty and nothing but the deception I have been dealing with for over a year, and out in the open for the past 6 months. I just cant do it anymore!

Will???<P>Have you done Plan A or B according to the MB rules??<P>Trueheart

deleted<p>[This message has been edited by worthatry (edited July 12, 2001).]

will - if you don't want to save your marriage, by all means, give up and soak your wife for all you can get.<P>If you do want to save your marriage, tell us and we'll help you.<P>We understand your frustration. This fixable.<P>WAT

Im so tired i just cant anymore, she's meeting with him tonight. but i dont know that.

will - she sounds no different than many other WSs. The track record is that they will not become completely honest all at once. If she's going to therapy, you're better off than many others here. Sure, you're experiencing the most emotional event in your life, but this can be salvaged - there are no guarantees, but many others have done it.<P>Have you been evaluated for depression. Very common among BSs.<P>WAT

Will - stay with counseling and say things like I would love it (appreciate it) if you would be honest with me when you see the OP. When she tells, say thankyou for your honesty, how can I help you in this situation? The time will come when the affair will die its natural course. My H is having an affair with the OW. The OW husband does not know of the affair. Last night, might be the most positive thing I have seen in over a year. My husband says the affair is dying its natural death. He actually said the communication is becoming uncomfortable. It should be over by the next time I am to talk with Jennifer Harley. I was in a bad mood, depressed and thinking too much. But I still have not been able to sleep, because of what he said. This time he seemed to mean every word. I was sort of in shock and didn't respond very positively. But now I have been thinking all night and I would love to give him a big kiss and hug and say thankyou, I love you.<P>My depression comes easy. I was at my parents and my dad suffered 4 mini strokes 2 months ago. He has been difficult to deal with, my mom has a lot on her daily schedule to deal with. I was with my dad alone and he actually was nice to talk to today. But he still said things like, mom always has to have her way. I will show her, and he chopped out some of the garden. He is unstable with the hoe and walker. So I know this was his mental state and not my dad. I hoed 4 rows while he damaged one row. I went over what he did and helped fix things up. I told dad, that mom is stressed out and he said he knows, he isn't much help anymore. He feels useless. I told him look dad, a month ago you couldn't even stand in the garden and look at you now. Your right eye is starting to open, your double vision is leaving. This garden was planted for you dad, lets enjoy the fruits of our labor ok. He went in the house. So I considered this a good day, he was out doing something. <P>Be patient, and try not to LB. I am going to work hard at it and be what I would like to be to my husband. Give your wife the love she needs, give her cards, make special cups of tea for her or bring home something special she likes, doesn't have to be expensive, maybe just one flower. Or better yet, pick a bouquet of wildflowers. She will know the fruit of your labor went into the bouquet. You picked the special ones for her. Give her a hug anytime. <P>The WS has a hard time breaking up with the OP. They will tell you they don't want to. But if the OP is staying in their marriage, they have no choice. I told my H that if he truly loved the OW you would let her go to make her marriage work. Love is hard to leave, (even the fantasy love). But love can be regained by 2 who married with the love in the first place. Pray for her love to you. I am still praying for my husband to love me.

Thanks for the pick me up and advice gang. I have my demons to deal with telling me to run, I have family telling me to throw her out. Well she told me she spoke with the OM after I nearly dragged it out, she saids he knows that I know and that she wants to end it. But she also doesnt know that I know she is still in contact with him. I have a week according to the therapist to make a decision, her also. But she is telling me one thing and doing another. This is why iam so torn, I say go and I say stay but the therapist says someone has to do something at the end of this week. I dont know thanks all....

Is the OM married? If he is married then I would inform his wife? Why not also follow your wife and confront both of them? You have a right to happiness and I hope you find it with or without her.

Will,<BR> You say "the therapist says do this by this time, blah, blah, blah" I'm not sure if this therapist can help you at this time. You need to read everything on this site. Read all the articles. Read all the Q & A columns. Read everything. When I finished reading all the stuff on this site, I felt like i had been to therapy! It is better than most M Counselors.<P>Do yourself a favor, and spend the next week reading all this stuff and doing a good Plan A. Do you know what that is? I know you're upset right now. But, listen it's true. You are in a better place than a lot of us right now. My H took off, MOVED OUT 8 weeks ago. I haven't heard from him AT ALL. He left divorce settlement papers for me to sign and now is living with OW, who is not M, so there is no chance there that HER BS will "see the light" and kick my H's butt. So I don't know what it will take to get him out of the A, but time. <P>You, on the other hand, still have your W IN YOUR HOME, and it is easier to communicate Plan A with her, and to show her your changes and let her see you want to meet her needs...don't be in such a hurry to "make a decision" like the therapist says. Just let time take over, while you start implementing the Plan A stuff on this site. This is free, and BETTER than most counseling sessions. Stick to it. Things can change, but stop being nervous and worrying all the time. Make a plan and do it and stick to it, and you'll see results.<P>Maybe you need to FIRE that therapist and start talking to Steve or Jennifer from this site. Their number is at the top of the page here Under the link "Counsel", and you can do it over the phone. Please think about that as an option before a divorce attorney.<P>Lupo<P>