Did you ever tell OWH about MB? If you can afford it, maybe you could buy him a copy of SAA?<P>As far as MIL goes... what a toughie! Have you considered asking her (nicely of course! grin) NOT to tell you these things that she knows unless you ask first? Just a thought.<P>I know the addiction of wanting to know more. It's awful. We get more and more hurt every time. And yet, we still do it. What seemed to be the only way I was able to control it, was when I was ready for plan B. The love I felt for my H was almost completely gone, and I honestly didn't care anymore. I hope you don't have to reach that point, but if you do, it may be what works for you too.<P>Good for you for going out on the weekend and having some fun! The not-at-all-professional counsellor in me (LOL) tells me that you only went out because you knew you wouldn't run into your H. Now, here's something to ponder on: Why are you afraid to see him? Is it that you're more afraid of him seeing you? And if all you're doing is going out with girlfriends, then what's the problem? So long as you cut contact with OWH, then you have NOTHING to hide. If anything, it would do your H good to see that you can have fun without him. Maybe that's the kick in the butt he'll need to miss you. Ooooohhhh... and another thought on it. Maybe him seeing you out will make him so uncomfortable that he and OW won't go out as much. Wouldn't THAT put a damper on their fantasy??? hehehehe.<P>Take care, and plan A your heart out at your dd's tournament!!! <P>Karen<BR>

Bellevue: thanks for your input: it is really helpful and makes me think even more of some things, as far as:<P>1. You fall in love with each other and marry. Just like a movie. And bring the history of H's affair with OW along as part of the "and how did you two meet and fall in love?" story. You have to make arrangements for your exes to share the children's events (baseball games, last day of school, father daughter dance, holidays and weekends) and deal with two hostile exes. They can wreak infinite havoc in their malice.<P>--- I don't really think I can deal with that issue at all, taking it for granted that our daughters (OWH and mine) were in baseball together, same team and all, that would be too much of a reminder at how things got started and stuff like that. I rather not deal with my ex and his ex, especially knowing what went on, and we OWH and myself are a result of that consequence, then it will be the infinite havac that wreaks.<P>2. Or, you continue to talk and share information and feelings, support each other. You don't go any further. But your H and his W spread rumors around town. The rumors are believed because there are reported sightings of the two of you, innocent as they may be, together. The rumors hurt your children.<P>----- One thing that makes this one different is that OWH works out of town, he will be gone for 8 months straight, will be approximately 10 hours away. I don't want to go any further than talking, supporting etc. And my children are the last people I want to hurt. I have made it clear to OWH that if my children ever answered the phone, for him to say it was the wrong number. As far as seeing me, yes he has asked, and I have told him no. He wanted to come over when he was in town this weekend to talk, he did come over briefly and my kids were not home, so we talked. I have since told him that I did not want anything more than the communication thing, I still had feelings for my H, etc. So I guess I'll see what happens. As far as my H, he does not like the idea that I talk to OWH. HE says I should listen to him or even talk to him because of the things he might tell me. H says they are lies. Yeah right, I say. My H and OW still deny any allegations of them sleeping and so forth, now who is living the lie. Last night I spoke with my H and asked him if he cared for OW, if he loved OW and if he wanted a relationship with OW. He just said he didn't want to talk about it. So what should I make of it! Does he really want something more with OW, of course I wish not, but I know things happen. <P>3. Or, you begin dating, bound together by pain that nobody else understands. The core of your love is the shared pain and shame at being betrayed. Your exes will always be part of your lives. Conversations will abound with shared glee at their bad luck, this is not a good glue to keep you together.<P>---- It does feel like pain that nobody else would understand. It feels like we can and do understand each other, it is shared pain, because all in all, that is what brought us together, we started talking about each others findings about the spouses and so forth, we were the betrayed ones, and yes I would like to vent on their bad luck, rub it in their faces that it would not work, but I don't know if they will not work. Maybe they will, maybe not.<P>4. Last, you break off further contact, even by phone, and improve your life, doing things together with your daughter and her friends' parents. I liked the suggestion about painting the bathroom. Go from there. At the end of 6 to 8 weeks instead of emotional exhaustion you will have a clean pretty room, you'll find things you'd lost while you're cleaning (maybe an heirloom necklace or a letter from an old friend, maybe a $100 bill.) Change the lightbulbs to a warm pink. Think what kind of nice person has a well-cared for home. You deserve that, don't you think?<P>----- This sounds good in all aspects that I can think of. This is something I need to work on doing.<P>Don't get tricked into the briar patch that the other 3 are in. Walk away.<P>I have realized that my life at work and at home is constantly talking on the phone if not with MIL it is with OWH, or any other friend, and it is always about the A and its outcome. Frankly, I'm tired of it, but yet I still do it.<BR>Thanks for your advise.<BR>[/B][/QUOTE]<P>

Stranger...<P>Why not just do what you would do in any other case here...write the OWH a No Contact letter explaining that the situation has become increasingly uncomfortable for you, your love for your husband takes precedence over everything, and you wish to have no further contact. It has already been shown to be a LB since everyone in your small circle suspects things. Keep a copy, to show H and even OWH when accusations are hurled again. Be respectful, but firm in your letter. Thank him for his friendship, but ask that he not contact you anymore, and by all means, DO NOT contact him, even about your H and his W. Only talk to your H, and let him know that is how it is going to be. HONESTY!!<P>Trueheart

Thanks Topie: [by the way, you are a great counselor] No I have not told OWH about MB, I'm not sure he has access to a computer, being that he works out on the highways from 6:00am to 5:00pm, putting up road signs. Although maybe I may suggest it to him, not sure if I would buy him a book, sounds like something to think about. Maybe if he read it, he would encourage his W to go with him. That is another issue I don't think I have brought up, he offered his W to move with him for the 8 months. His company will be paying for all housing and moving expenses. He only has to pay for living expenses. His W does NOT have to work. He will be making a little over $4k a month with benefits. She stuttered on his offer, so he didnt take her. My H has to offer roughly $2k w/o benefitts and OP would definitely have to work, and there is no home involved, apt. living at its best. What kind of scale is she using to way this opportunity! I even thought of taking OWH offer for her, HA, HA HA. Just kidding. MIL situation is a toughie, because she asks for info as well. Yes I still feel a strong love for my H, but slowly but surely, is it staying there, I tend to hide it away a little better than before. As far as my going out. IT was a blast, yes I did it because I knew I would not run into H. The story behind me not wanting him to see me, is that back in 1997, during A#2, H moved out, same old thing as this A#3, he went out clubing, I started about 1 month afterwards. My friends invited me and I met this guy named Mark. He was a great dancer, so we were dancing partners, the guy is 4 years younger than I am and my friend introduced him to me. Well, I would go out every Thursday, Friday and Saturday night from 10:00pm until 2:00am, but my H and I would frequent the same club. I would see my H with OW dancing, so H would see me always dancine with this OP (mark), Mark and I were just dancing partners, it never got any further and he was well aware of that, he even offered to watch my children while I attended college and if I wanted to go out at night he would do the same, of course I never took him up on his offer. I danced with this guy for three months. My H didn'tlike the idea of this guy always being with me. He was jealous. Then he started thinking he was my boyfriend. So things stayed like that, we all went out to the same club and always saw each other dancing, H with OW and me with OP, although I did dance with others, but they just didn't pass the dancing test. Then my H would start asking me to dance with him and I would, well then you know how that story ends, with A#3, we got back together after being separated for about 4 months. Now my same friends invite me to go out with them and they go to the same clubs that my H goes to, but my H has this thing that he knows if I start hanging out with these friends that I will eventually end up dancing again with Mark. There is some truth behind that, because this guy was there and I did dance with him and some other male sexes that asked me to dance. But again, I would make it clear to him that dancing and fun is all I was there for, but my H can't handle that thought. So he thinks that. So instead of going out when H is around I don't go, because if I do, then I will want to dance with this guy, and I know H wouldn't like it. So I rather not go. But I had a great time. My H does not go to these clubs with OW, he meets other women, different women and onenight stands them. But I think OW knows about this!? A#2, OW knew I was there and who I was, it did make her uncomfortable but not enough to not go. Even H was uncomfortable and he stayed as well. Go figure! I think he wanted to keep an eye out on me, I remember one time he saw me having trouble with this one guy, and my H came up to me and asked me If that guy was bothering me he would take care of it. HA HA HA. H still cared. So do you think that during this trip with d tournament, should I ask H about OW! or is that a complete NO NO!!<P>[This message has been edited by stranger under same roof (edited July 17, 2001).]<p>[This message has been edited by stranger under same roof (edited July 17, 2001).]

Well I have arrived back from my trip to my D tball tournament. Great news, her team won National Championship, her team came in 1st place out of 10 tball teams. She even caught a pop fly, she was excited. Anyway, all know that this event was going to be a big one, for the fact that my H and I would be in the same city and in the same hotel. I was unsure of how to handle anything while up there with him. Well, some said it was a great chance to make a deposit in the love bank, or something like that. Well, out of the five days we were together, OW kept constantly, and that is an understatment, calling him. She would call no less than 10 times a day. Now that was a definite LB on H part. But OW was jealous because I was the one with H, and not her. I know she hated the idea so she kept calling him. It was fun, we had a great time, definite love deposits. But as soon as we were back in town, that was it. Just like an on/off switch. Today is OW birthday, H is off of work until Wednesday, and overheard him making plans with OW. Defenite heartbreak. But I was strong. The other thing that would piss me off is that he would stay on the phone with her while around/next to me. He would elaborate on his conversations, he kept it short and sweet, or sometimes he would leave and go to another part of the hotel or ball park to talk to her. But Friday, Saturday and Sunday every time his phone would ring, he would just look at it and not answer it. But later when he had a chance he would talk to her. So she kept nagging and nagging on him. Now H would tell me that I was a nag, but damn this OW is constantly calling him like nag, she has him wrapped around her pinky, it reminds me of that movie, with Sandra Bullock "Love Potion #9", the guy had to call her on a set time to keep the potion active. That is what it was like during the week, she called him almost religiously. Except, of course, when he was sleeping. So now where do I go from here? Need some input!?

I have heard that this Sunday H and OW got into an argument re: her being very naggy. He told her to stop her crap, and that she called too much during the day. I am very surpised! Now OWH is coming down again this weekend, OWH told me that that same Sunday OW (his W) called him and told him that she has changed her mind about the divorce, that she missed him, low and behold, I told OWH that that only reason is because my H has given her a temporary kick in the butt. I don't talk to OWH as much as I used to, I have tremendously cut back, but only because he was a nagging person too. They were alike, no wonder they could deal with each other. MIL said that H has booted her out of his life, but I don't believe that, now H is accusing me of sleeping with other men from a date back in 1997, H states that someone is giving him information. What should I read into this?

Read NOTHING INTO IT! He is looking for a way to justify his affair. When he accuses you without proof, just walk away or hang-up.

Welcome Back and hugggz to your daughter!<P>Bingo on what trying said...dont even react to it. If anything, laugh to yourself. This is a classic WS way to make us feel better...accuse you of putting the knife in the butter incorrectly back in 1977...LOL. NO relevance..dont pay it any due!!!<P>Trueheart

Congrats to daughter from all of us in Germany, we wish we could have been there. As for where to go now... the same place you were headed before your trip. He is looking for a reason to justify what he has done, but will not find it, at all. He's prying hoping that you'll give in with some sort of information that he has no clue about. Continue with keeping him out of YOUR house and press on with the divorce. He's going to want back in real soon but you have to remain strong and never forget all the pain that he has caused you, and you know as well as I that he will do it again. Be strong, live happier with that big weight lifted off of your schoulders "remember". Life will always go on.<P>Liebling

<B>now H is accusing me of sleeping with other men from a date back in 1997, H states that someone is giving him information. What should I read into this?</B><P>SUSR,<P>The accusation of infidelity is common from WS. Could be lots of reasons, justification mostly. In the early days of my wife's affair she used to accuse me of the same thing. I would calmly ask her what made her think that or who with or when. You can be sure it's meant to help them selves feel better if the questions are all answered with "I don’t know". It's worth asking, you can never tell, he might tell you about some things that are truly questionable from his view and these type of thoughts over time could be part of his root cause.<P><BR>

I can relate very well to this post.<BR>The OW's H and I had close communication once we both knew about the A.<BR>We would talk for hours at a time. He always had me call his cell phone since his home phone was long distance for me.....he picked up all those bills. How nice of him huh?<BR>BUT......friendship is as far as it went.<BR>I got the feeling that he would like to have made it more than that.....asking me out to lunch.....wanting to know if we could meet sometime....and other things.<BR>It finally got to the point where I just decided that for my own sanity that I couldn't talk to him anymore.<BR>Sure he was a great source for information......but it was added stress for me at the same time.<BR>I'm also to the point where I don't really want to know what my H is up to......the less I know the better I feel...about the whole thing and about myself.<BR>Each time I hear something new....it brings me back down again.<P>My advice......cut off all contact with the OW's H immediately......you will feel so much better. Less stress on you......you really don't know how much more the conversations with him stress you out until your not conversing with him anymore.<BR>You know....as well as everyone else on here.....that talking to him can make matters worse anyway.<BR>If he contacts you again.......politely tell him that you have enough stress in your life already dealing with your WH and your children and that it adds more stress on you to talk to him......doesn't matter wether he understands or not.....you have no commitment to him.

Oh yeah.. he's playing head games with you again. Stay strong.. you're doing awesome! He can't break you when there's nothing to break, right?<P>Congrats to your daughter! She must be on cloud nine! And I"m glad that having your H with you worked out.<P>Here's hoping that this is the final straw between your H and the OW. But it may only be the beginning of the end for them. <P>So... how'd you do on the redecorating front? <P>Karen<BR>

Thanks for everyone's reply: H has not said anymore about these other men he supposedly heard of. Monday was the last word, but I asked him if he found the guy, since he knew where he worked, lived and what he drove, so I told H, good luck and let me know when you find him. And that this OP that I am being accused of sleeping with, better be damn good looking and hot! H was mad. But I thought it was funny. Anyway, no more from him on whether or not he found this supposed guy. I just let him do what he thinks he has to do. Now I hear from MIL that H is brushing OW off, she is hounding him like a dog. She even follows him around town. MIL says that my H is tired of her nagging, that she calls him all day and he does not answer, so she looks for him at his work, which is all over town from apt. to apt. How funny, because I, being his W, never looked for him, only called him maybe 3 times a day. And that was nagging, now this OW calls over 10 times a day, wants to see him constantly, and even follows him, something his own W never did, even when there was cause for it. IT was a waste of time. I just found out that on Monday, which was her Birthday, she wanted him to take her out, but he didn't, he avoided her. On Sunday, the day of the return of the Tball tournament, he went out to a club and she wanted to go with him, and he did not take her. She is mad and furious, said she felt that he was brushing her off. I just hope she doesn't start coming by my house and start trouble with me. I told H to keep his crap and hers at his place, that it better not get close to my house and my children, because a mother's got to do what a mother's got to do, especially if her children are in danger of getting hurt in anyway. As far as anything else, all is well, like my mom always told me "they will get theirs". God does not punish anyone, people punish themselves. I never wish anything bad on H and OW, maybe sometimes[but I think many in my position do, but we hope nothing bad happens], I just hope they realize one day what they did wrong and they will pay for their actions in whatever way is chosen for them.

Dear Topie: My daughter is happy. She loves softball, very surprised. Her allstar team is overwith and we have a 4 week break before her fall season starts. She moves up in her division because of her age, she goes to different level, she was in tball, now she at the stage where the coach pitches the ball to them. But she has me outside or at a park almost everyday practicing with her. Which is good, giving all that has been going on. My son, on the other hand has decided he doesn't want to do sports anymore, he is into that gameboy/nintendo stuff. School will be starting in about 2 1/2 weeks, I'm excited for that. As far as the redecorating, I have not done anything, since this trip out of town, I did not have much time between every day working 8 - 5, practice 6:00 to 9:00pm, dinner and sleep. The weekends were just as busy, we had fundraisers every Saturday and Sunday from 8:30 am until 3:00pm. Afterwards, I would be soooooo tired. But now I have some free time. I have been looking at color samples everytime I go to WALMart. No choices yet. But I will get to it. My bathroom is my goal for now, since my cats gave me a lending paw, they have decided to use one of may walls as a scratching post, it has wallpaper, so it looks pretty bad. Thank for your advise. IT has helped me a great deal.<P><BR> <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Topie25:<BR><B>Oh yeah.. he's playing head games with you again. Stay strong.. you're doing awesome! He can't break you when there's nothing to break, right?<P>Congrats to your daughter! She must be on cloud nine! And I"m glad that having your H with you worked out.<P>Here's hoping that this is the final straw between your H and the OW. But it may only be the beginning of the end for them. <P>So... how'd you do on the redecorating front? <P>Karen</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>

Dear Miss Priss: I see where your coming from. I have slowed down the information highway with OWH. It has gone down from 5-6 times a day, and 1 1/2 hours at night, to maybe twice a day, and no night time hours. It has only been tops about 10 minutes. I do feel better when I don't here any info. When he tells me stuff, it makes me think of everything again and how it all fits with the stuff MIL tells me about H's doings and whereabouts, and OWH tells me about OW doings and whereabouts, and they all fit together like a big giant puzzle. I have told OWH to stop calling me, but still does. He says he is upset and needs to talk to someone. I have been seriously thinking of just changing my phone numbers. The only thing I cannot change is my work number, and he knows that and calls that as well. I will figure something out eventually, and get this stuff overwith dealing with OWH. It is so strange how all this life stuff gets so overwhelming. OWH even told me that he had an attraction to me.

TO ALL: You know, I just want to say thank you to everyone that has responded to any of my posts. I am always so caught up in my problem and situations that I have never stopped and asked how anyone else is doing, SO, how is everyone else doing? It is so strange how your problems get you so overwhelmed that it seems like you are the only one going through a rough time, when that are millions out there in the same situation. Well I hope all is well, and good luck to all. I will keep everyone posted as to what is going on with me, H, OW, OWH, MIL, so forth. I must return to my work, since I have a long day ahead of me. CASI

Rather strange: I have not heard from OWH lately. It has been a day and a half since he has last called? I have not called him either. I wonder!!!!! Last I spoke with him on Wednesday night, he said his W made him made because she still wouldn't confess about her A with my H. She just gives him a bullsh#@ story about that my H and her would just talk. Yea right! Anyway, I heard from MIL that OW is following my H around town and still calling him asking him why he is avoiding her. Also last I heard, he gave her the boot officially, I heard. Since then I haven't heard from OWH. Maybe it is true. Maybe my H fog is rising out of his head partially. But not totally, he is still drinking and what not, still going out, just not with her now. I am not totally sure about the other women. I'm curious to hear from OWH, though. Wondering what is going on? What should I do? Just wait to see if he calls? I know i'm supposed to cut all contact, and when I do, then I feel very curious, and when I do hear from him I get upset, damn if you do and damn if you don't. Well got to get to work. I'll check back later. Everyone have a great day!!!!

Update: I heard from OWH. I told him I had some new info on his W and my H. I told him about the argument and the boot his wife got from my H. I also told OWH that I heard that his W is still following my H around town and calling his cell phone constantly asking my H that she feels that he is "brushing her off". She doesn't get the picture. So anyway I told OWH that he needed to tell his W to BACK OFF, again. After I had already told her when all this stuff started surfacing. Now I told OWH, it was up to him to tell her to back off, and that she needed to leave my H alone once and for all. To tell her to stop calling, following him forever or else she had another thing coming. She has also been passing by my home. Also told OWH that if she ever stepped foot into my fence line that she was going to get picked up off the street like a dead dog (not literally), but I would give her a big chunk of my mind and maybe even fist and foot. My H told me the name of the other man that I have been accused of sleeping with. It happens to be a long time friend's boyfriend. And this person is also friends with my H and my father. I told him to snap out of it. I told him to realize that Sunday he broke things of with OW, and Monday he heard all this bull crap about me sleeping around. I asked him, if that made any sense at all. I told him it was perfect timing to something that OW would want. Since she could have him neither should I. Anyway, H found out that I had spoken with OWH, since of course OW called him again. He asked me to stop contact with OWH and I asked him to stop contact with OW. We both agreed. I asked H to change his phone number and cell number. Not sure if that was agreed on yet. I know H still has other women. Not sure who they are. But in the first of my posts, i mention main OW and other women on the side. So H is still in fog, I told him to stop contact with other women, who knows. We talk lots more now. We are still separated and will stay that way. We have not talked any further on any future plans since he knows that he has hurt me so very much and so very many times. He said he understands if I don't want to get back. He has plans on moving to another city. Not sure on the validity of that rumor. All I know is that as long as he has the job he is currently in, there is always going to be a problem with women. He works for a pest control company and is the supervisor in our city. He strictly does apartment complexes, and has access to gates and all apartments, vacate or occupied. There are lots of women out there that are friendly, you catch my drift, and although it takes two to tango, it only takes one to ask to dance and the other to offer. Signing off!! I must return to work.

Nice to hear that all is well. I am also glad to hear that you are being smart by letting him back into your life, 100%. As for waiting to hear from OWH, you're kinda losing it. As for telling OW to leave your H alone, why should it matter? He's done with, it's over or am I wrong? How many times will this have to happen, him cheating on you? Leave OWH alone and continue with divorcing you H. You have shown all that you are indeed a stong woman and can make it on your own. Congrats!!!<P>Liebling