I've seen several post about people going to Plan B and the WS deciding they want to come home or work on it within a matter of days.<BR>I just wondered......how many of the WS's were still saying that they loved the BS when they left?<BR>How many were saying that they no longer had feelings for the BS anymore?<P>I'm just trying to figure out if Plan B is for me. It doesn't seem like it would work very well for me.<BR>There is no way that I can do anything without a considerable amount of contact with my WH.<BR>I have nobody that will be a "go between".<BR>It also seems.....most of the time....that my H would probably rather me not be around. It's like he can give or take me being there....he's has actually said that....afterall....he can't stand to be around me.<BR>I think that if I were to write a Plan B letter to my H he would totally turn it around to make it look as if I was accepting what he was doing and didn't want to have anything to do with him anymore.....which gives him the perfect opportunity to just do whatever he wants....like he isn't already.<BR>This man is just too confusing.......I'm tired of trying to deal with his changing mind....saying he can't stand me one day and joking with me the next.<BR>He wants a divorce but still....after 3 weeks...and telling me over and over that there is no future for us....his stuff is still here.....he didn't take all of his clothes....and hasn't made one attempt or said anything about coming to get it.<P>It's harder than heck to meet any of his EN's with him living somewhere else. He doesn't like for me to let him know that I still want him to come home.....it always starts an argument. I can't tell him I love him....because the response of ok....always hurts too much.<BR>I've told him to come get his stuff...he says he will.....but never makes an attempt to do it....he's been here at least 10 times since then. <BR>I just wish I knew what was going on in his head.<P>He sounds so serious about divorce.......but then again...the questions...and joking....and being nice.<BR>I just don't get it.

Sorry you're having to go through this. I will tell you this: My H was already living elsewhere when I gave him Plan B letter. He called me 2 days later and said he loved me and wanted to come home. It's now been almost 3 weeks since I let him come back, and I am miserable! He's not taking responsibility for any part of the breakdown in the marriage. He's still in contact with OW (even though he told me it was DEFINITELY over). We have a counseling session tonight, and I plan to tell him there that I no longer feel that he's committed to working on the marriage. I want him to leave again, as he is picking me apart constantly. No matter what I say or do, he's unhappy and tells me so. He's told me he does not feel guilty about the affair, he was pushed into it, he feels justified. In a nutshell, HE WASN'T REALLY READY TO COME HOME!!<P>This is just my situation, but if I had it to do over, I would have waited longer (and I would have INSISTED on a no contact letter) before letting him come back home.<P>Good luck.

Hi MP,<P>Here is my piece. <P>d/d 11/22/00.<BR>Plan C & H - for confused and hurt<BR>H talked about D (e-mails from OW confirmed this was coming,<BR> they were planning it and to move in <BR> together)<P>H moved out 12/31/01<BR>H left 3 nasty voicemails at W's work<BR>H asked to move back within 1 wk.<BR>H talked about D again<BR>H asked to move back again.<BR>Plan A - Jan 20,01 after found out about MB<P>Feb 01 - <BR>H asked to move home<BR>H talked about D again, bought quick D book and cd<BR>OW sent H quickie divorce/cheap sites (about 4 or 5)<BR>H asked for quick and cheap D<BR>OW outlined living arrangements (not see W for 1 year at all, only see son on weekends, WS owes OW $998.00 per mo<BR>living expenses, not allowed to pick up son at W or any relative's home, not even friends must be in a neutral spot, etc.)<P>BS told him to do it himself. LB and didn't care so...<P>H asked to move home. <P>Plan B - March 01 - told H my communication with him will be<BR> limited to mail, child visit <BR> arrangements & financial matters. <P>March 17 - 19 - H had to babysit son while W went on a trip. OW/H both thought I set him up..... short lived thought, he is the father. H now knows otherwise. <P>H asked to come home. Started to move his things, he was not ready. H stayed out in his rented room. <P>April 15 (oooh taxes due and not done yet).....<P>H asked to move home to meet his family's needs. H says he knows he loves his family but also has feelings for OW but that in 1 month, it will pass. <P>H moved home 4/29/01<P>May 01 - <BR>Contact with OW not cut off as promised. <BR>30+ voicemail messages and 2 nasty phone calls from OW. Some truths and some lies. <P>OW setup another secret voicemail account which WS participated in all the while claiming no contact. <P>June 01<BR>W is preg. <BR>OW claims to be preg. No proof.<P>H says he now wants a 2nd chance, will be truthful, etc. <BR>W miscarries. <P>Jul 01 - <BR>OW claims to miscarry (says she is spotting, H says she is ignorant about preg stuff. No proof.<P>H says he does not love family enough, knows he needs to leave, W packs some clothes starts to throw the rest out the front door. H calls police. Police arrive to see clothes going out the door and H pushing W. Police arrest H for domestic violence. H spent 2 1/2 days in jail, charges dropped and released but restraining order is for 5 more days. H opts to go and stay with OW, H claims no money and will not go to relative or friends. OW welcomes him H with open arms and legs. <P>Meeting with H and BIL to discuss reconciliation & financial terms. Starts out ok, H gets mad, go straight to financial, talk about D. H cools down a bit. Says he really wants his family but gets angry at himself. Now says he is starting to feel more for me than he ever has. Hm...... wants to get his things from OW's house. <P>H tells OW good bye, asks to come home after restraining order is lifted. Both say no more contact. OW calls back the next day. Now OW is claiming to get H a job the type that would require H to live with OW. Hm...... what kind is that? Personal butler? yard boy? boy toy? I digress, excuse me. <P>Ow been trying to call almost everyday, now H is not accepting her calls (or so I am told). H is suppose change the last business phone, has to pay for it. Hm..... $$ vs marriage???? <P>Now H is saying that his love for me is growing. H is now home on the 2nd week. His things still need to be put away. I have done some but will not do it all like the last time. H knows this and is working on it. His work schedule has been full and he is looking for another job with better hours so he can spend time with his family. H has been picking son up from school and spending some quality time with son. <P>Overall? It is still hard, now I am having to look at myself. H still is not meeting my needs. Yet his making progress. My patience is being tested. I feel the pressure daily. My needs are now screaming to be met. Will I turn into a WS? I hope not. I am working on focusing on my family. <P>What does all this mean? IMHO, during plan B, set your items for discussion. If and when your H is willing to discuss things in a civil and orderly manner and you are also able to do so, then time can be made to step out of plan B and allow discussion time. But if that is met with anger or abuse, then pull back to that point. Let them (the WS) show they are worthy of spending time with you and have them show you what value they are willing to bring to you and your family. <P>I was not able to do this 100%, but gave it my best shot. Now that I look back, I see where I could have improved. Actually needed to be a bit harder. Oh well..... now I know, these episodes of regression will not last. <P>L. <P><BR>

Plan B changes things! It is about you being in control of your life and removing yourself from the pain and influence of your WS. They don't seem to like it much when all of a sudden BS takes the ball and runs with it and the focus of control shifts from what they are doing and want to what BS needs to emotionally survive and get on with their life. All of a sudden they must question whether or not you will really be there if things don't work out on the other end. Just this little shift can start the ball rolling in another direction.<P>It is my strong opinion that if Plan A does not work after a short time that one should not hesitate to go to Plan B. Plan B is not giving up. Plan B is giving yourself the respect WS refuses to give. It's about saying "no more" and changing the dynamics to make life a little uncertain for WS. If WS has nothing to lose and BS will wait and Plan A for what may appear to WS to be indefinitely, WS has absolutely no motivation to give up the best of both worlds. Human beings don't stop doing something that is bringing them pleasure unless there is a consequence to the behavior. Your strength and courage in going to Plan B will give them much more to think about than if you hang on to Plan A for too long.

I am not an expert on Plan B and never had to get that far. I was lucky enough to come to my senses right away, and thank the stars I did!! Plan B would suck!! <P>I think it sucks more for the BS! You have to be the strong ones. This is like being 4th down and a whole lotta real estate for the game winner! The one common thread I have seen in Plan B with BS that let the WS come home is that they *feel sorry* for the WS. <P>REMEMBER!!! WS can be really goooooood at making you feel bad and sorry for them! "I have nowhere else to go" "I really want to work on things" "I promise, it is over"<P>I am sure there are many variations on the themes and as many excuses/reasons for coming home as you can come up with. I think the other thing here is that the BS feels like they are guilty of something hurtful as far as their WS is concerned?? If they have been having contact, if the A has been still going on and you Plan B them, 48 hours does nothing but scare them a little. That is barely time to blink, let alone think. (I am not BS bashing here, but making an observation that may help other BS in Plan B to not let WS come home to early)<P>I have a suggestion or two that may help. How about a cooling off period of 5-10 days, so that you can see the *commitment* to the M??? In that 5-10 days, you can do the EN Questionnaire, have WS compose the No Contact letter?? I think if I were the WS, and I wanted to come home and knew all I had to do was shed a tear or two or tell the BS I loved them and learned my lesson, it would not have near the effect as working my way back into my home.<P>As a coach, when an athlete is suspended (Plan B), there is a price to pay for their transgressions before being allowed back on the team. I do not see where this is much different in my mind?? Maybe I am all wet, and some see it as LBing. I see it as giving a little more credence to the WS being "allowed" to come home by earning that privilege. And it is a privilege to come back home, not a right!! (After what the WS has done, we lost most rights!)<P>Anyway, like I said, not an expert here, but just thought I would share what I had seen, and thought maybe I could help a bit.<P>*Go confidently in the direction of your dreams.*<P>Trueheart

Prissy - first, listen to motherhubbard.<P>Second, Plan B IS for you if you feel like you're at the end of your rope. It's all about insulating yourself from the kiss butt routine of Plan A. It's about removing the safety net you've been providing for your WS. It's about YOU taking control of a big piece of the situation. Instead of the WS separating themselves from the BS, now the BS is separating themselves from the WS. It is POWER! it sends a clear signal that you WILL NOT put up with their crap anymore. You're taking your ball and going home.<P>If you don't have an intermediary, that's OK. I don't have one. I set it up to communicate ONLY via voice mail and e-mail.<P>Yep, it might have a tendency to force the WS towards the OP. EXACTLY!! Now, the OP has to be everything!<P>Read the Plan B stuff on Just Found Out, the thread titled "Notable Posts/Threads."<P>WAT

Miss Priss,<BR><B>I'm just trying to figure out if Plan B is for me.</B><BR>If you are thinking of Plan B because it might bring him back, then no, you are ready for it. Stay in Plan A as long as possible.<P>You are ready when you cannot deal with him anymore because of the pain it is causing you and because you are doing lovebusters all the time.<P>Trueheart,<BR><B>I have a suggestion or two that may help. How about a cooling off period of 5-10 days, so that you can see the *commitment* to the M??? In that 5-10 days, you can do the EN Questionnaire, have WS compose the No Contact letter?? </B><P>If/when the wayward spouse decides they want to come home, there should be a few rules in place. If the WS cannot agree to them, then continue in Plan B.<P>Counseling, no contact, letting each other know EVERYWHERE you go and everyone you talk with & see, no contact letter.<P>These should be ironed out BEFORE you agree to “work on the marriage” again. If not, then the WS has no reason to follow through.<P><B>WS can be really goooooood at making you feel bad and sorry for them! "I have nowhere else to go" "I really want to work on things" "I promise, it is over"</B><BR>This is why it is essential to do the above. It’ll help the WS keep from waffling and it’ll also show the WS that you mean business and he can’t just “toy” with you.<P>Plan B is by no means easy (at least in the beginning), but it starts a healing process in you (BS) and shows the WS you’re tired of playing games (but is not used to “force” a decision.)<BR><P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Chris, <P>Thanks, I guess that was my point. I couldnt understand, how, after 24-36 hours he WS was coming back home when the BS werent convinced they were really ready. Go with your gut instincts!

wow! Thanks everyone! I was having some questions myself today about Plan B. This really helps!

"I'm just trying to figure out if Plan B is for me.<BR>If you are thinking of Plan B because it might bring him back, then no, you are ready for it. Stay in Plan A as long as possible."<P>I meant to say, "You AREN'T ready for Plan B" as in this is not the purpose of Plan B. Plan B is to protect your feelings for the WS and to protect them from your LB's.<P>Remember, Plan B is NOT used to force the issue. It is to let the WS know you still want the marriage but it is hurting you too much to be involved in his life. It also let's the WS know what life is like without you and they are forced to get all their needs from the OP (which <I>usually</I> doesn't happen.<P>------------------<BR>Prayers & God Bless!<BR>Chris<BR>For relationship info check out <A HREF="http://www.pcisys.net/~chriscal1/resources.html" TARGET=_blank>Marriage & Relationship Resources</A>

Just a addendum:<P>If a WS caves in after a "short" Plan B (less than a week), be <I>prepared</I> for trouble during reconciliation, and have a plan to go back to Plan B. <P>It doesn't always happen, but sometimes it does. Plan B shocks them, and they come back to "recommit" more as a reflex, as opposed to having had the affair truly burn out. One thing Plan B is used for is so that the WS and OP have unlimited access to one another---it can hasten the end of the affair. Once a WS ends the affair of their own free will---you've got a great shot at recovery. When a WS "ends" an affair due to Plan B pressure from a BS, the affair may not be truly ended (especially if it was serious).<P>Your milage may vary...

Miss Priss<P>Listen to these folks, I dont respond much here on this forum, I read cuz it helps me. But your situation really hurts my heart (I have told you this before). Your H is more than in a FOG he is emotionally abussive, and just plain MEAN. you are the mother of his children if anything. He chose to marry you and have a life. You are part responsible for the breakdown in your marriage, BUT you are NOT responsible for the immature way he is handling this. This is the only problem I have with the marriage builders concepts. No ONE, can maintain any self worth..if that ONE person whom they love is emtionally abuseing them...how can you???...As far as he joking with you, and that stuff...BIG DEAL ..he is stabbing you the next minute. People will treat you the way you allow them too. From everything I have read here. Plan B is to protect yourself???(not an expert). YOU NEED to protect yourself...dont let him shove you down anymore. As far as making him think you have accepted his choice for D, I think not..you can tell him why you are doing plan B. and still make him responsible for doing a D if he wants. It will protect you from hearing how he does not want to be with you, and all the other mean things he has said, he needs to grow up...sorry MBers...this guy is not very mature...FOG OR NO FOG..he has no heart ( for crying out loud, you are the mother of his children). I read your posts and I really hurt for you. I think that is why I post to you. It is time (in my opinion) to take care of YOU, become that independent person your H fell in love with again. Have fun becoming you again, and have a good time with your kids...quit allowing him to slam dunk you on a daily basis...((((huggs)))

If you've ever read any of my posts, you'd know that I myself have struggled with a feigned Plan B twice now. Stay true to Plan A. So many of the things going on with you are the exact same way in my life, like having no one as a go-between, or feeling as if your WS will run with the opportunity to live it up during Plan B, while you are miserable and alone.<P>Take care of yourself first, and concentrate on meeting those top Emotional Needs so he feels fulfilled in your marriage. He might not show it at first, but after a while he will realize how important you are by taking care of his important EN's. That's all we can do right now! I can't change my wife, but I can change myself, and that can affect her. Do the same, and you will have no regrets for trying.