Back again after a three day trip during which time WS and I talked couple of times a day. Conversation is great as long as it's not about "us". She came by Monday and we had dinner. She wanted to see my evidence (video)I asked why and she said that in order for us to go any further she would need to see it. I have been instructed by counselor to not show it under any circumstances. She said she is going to get an apt. and will need a bed, couch and the computer (for grad school)<BR>1. Should I give these things to her w/o a discussion?<BR>2. What about the video, does eveyone agree w/ my counselor?<BR>3. The fact that she is being so nice now and not really closing any doors, is that a signal that she is done with the A?<BR>4. Do I keep Plan Aing even though she left right after a confronted her about A and got in big fight (still deny's it)?<BR>5. Is OM (Doctor w/ W and 3 kids) putting pressure on her to get evidence b/c of the potential lawsuit against him?<P>Thanks,<P>GC<P>

oh yea, I forgot to say, I just sent His Needs Her Needs to WS today via mail with letter attached saying that I know I can't make you read but please consider it while your taking the time you need for you.

GC...<P>Right now, keep Plan Aing. If she is still denying A, if she is not willing to give up and write No Contact letter, then dont trust the A is over!!<P>You do not just *give* her those things w/out a discussion. If she is moving out and going to school and doesnt want your support or the M, why would you? If, this is something you agree with, and want, then the decision is yours. I know after my Dday, I deserved and expected nothing.<P>If she and her OM/Dr. are so damn concerned about the video, dub a copy, keep one for you, and let em have it. That way the evidence is irrefutable to BOTH of them. I believe he is putting pressure on her to make sure there is evidence and is scared to death his W will find out. (He may be dumping your W if he knows evidence exists that his W may see??)I am a chithead and would let her know that Drs. wife would love a copy too!! <P>If you have not read SAA, please do so. Your whole situation is so new, there is still a lot of anger and pure emotion attached to everything. Take a step back, breathe, and slow down. You are not gonna solve all these problems at once!! Take each thing one at a time, and realize you have to go slow.<P>*Go confidently in the direction of your dreams.*<P>Trueheart<BR>

I agree wholeheartedly with Trueheart. Give both W and Dr. a copy! I would not give in too easily about the other things she wants, if it will pose a hardship for you. Read SAA, then read it again. I plan to. Pray and breathe deeply. Good luck and God Bless you.<P>Kari

1. Are these things she wants from your home or new things? If new things she wants to buy, I say don't help her buy them. BTW, who's paying for the apartment? Not you, I hope. If these things are currently in your home, can you loan them out to her? If you have extras, it may be appropriate if she contributed significantly to their original purchase. In other words, are they shared property?<P>2. Yes. I bet the only reason she wants to see the video is to verify you actually have it.<P>3. No. Based on her desire to see the video, I'll bet the A is still in progress.<P>4. Yes. Just stop asking her about the A and stop arguing with her.<P>5. Could be. I'd put the video in a safe deposit box right after you make copies of it and send one to OM's wife.<P>WAT

One more thing. How big a fishing boat to you want? Find a picture of a really nice boat and send it along with a copy of the video to Dr. Slimy.<P>WAT

WAT,<P>The couch and bed she had prior to marriage, the computer is shared. That is the biggy. She is paying for everything on her own although I did give her a check for school. This really sucks, when your so torn.<P>I'm afraid if I send a copy of the video to Doc's wife, then that will really be a huge LB to her. The Doc has got to be sweating about what I have as evidence. Do you think because of this, that he may have backed off with the W? and that's why she is talking and coming around me more? <P>This is the most confusing thing I have ever dealt with. I never thought in a million years it would happen to me, especially the way it went down so quickly. Another thing that I haven't done is to just ask her if she wants to work it out. What do you think of that? <BR>Thanks,<BR>GDC

gdc:<P>Telling the OP's spouse can be a touchy subject on here, but IMO, the majority of us believe that they should be told. Yes, it is a mega LB, but only because the A's are based on secrecy and lies. When the secrecy part is taken away, so goes part of the fantasy.<P>I agree with WAT's answers to your initial questions.. but although I like the thought, I"m not sure if it's such a good idea to add a pic of the boat! LOL. If the Dr. is seriously concerned about a lawsuit, the video would be ample enough.<P>When H and I were splitting up our stuff, we were fortunate enough to have lots to do it with. However, the pc was something that caused HUGE arguments between us. Another thing, as trivial as it may sound, were videos. Just be prepared for the little things to cause big arguments. You'll look back on it and think how silly it was, but emotions run high, as you know, and they aren't always easy to control.<P>You should ask her if she wants to work things out. But more likely than not, your answer will be, "I don't know. I need some time to think about things". The 'I don't know' bit is true, she really doesn't know what she wants. But the time she'll claim to need to 'think' about things is mostly B.S.<P>Don't help her out with finding an apt. If she wants one so bad, she'll find one. However, if things between you start taking a turn for the worse, you may want to help out some. You don't want to allow ANY justification on her part for her actions.<P>In the meantime, plan A your heart out. You may not need to worry about who gets what if it works on her.<P>Keep us posted!<P>Karen<BR>

Thanks for your post Karen, it is so nice to get different responses to posts. She is actually coming over tonight to get our dog. Not sure what she'll talk about maybe nothing but she does surprise me ever now and then with something such as needing to see my evidence. I'm playing it cool on telling the OM's wife. I know secrecy breeds sickness and she should be told but I almost feel like I need to get an idea of what my W wants to do first b/c of the LB factor. The whole time thing just gets my nerves, I feel she knows what she wants but she has this huge wall built up and b/c she says our problems stemmed from my control issues she proably needs to feel like she is in control at all times even though she had the A. Do you believe that I should wait on telling the W? I have a session with Steve in the morning and have a list of questions to ask him, that should be interesting.<BR>Thanks again Karen,<BR>GDC

Oh.. you have an appt with Steve tomorrow. Then hold off on 'marriage' issues tonight if you can. Wait for his advice on how to go about things. If you need to talk about things, keep it to, "do you want to work things out between us?".. and be sure to let her know that you do, because you love her and want to make her happy.<P>In the meantime, enjoy your time together.. and just follow the rules of care (no disrespectful judgements, selfish demands, or angry outbursts). Let us know what happens, k?<P>Karen<BR>

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gdc:<BR>[B]The Doc has got to be sweating about what I have as evidence. Do you think because of this, that he may have backed off with the W?<P>Another thing that I haven't done is to just ask her if she wants to work it out. What do you think of that?[B]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>This could be why he backed off, if indeed he has. I'm not so quick to conclude that this is also the reason you wife is coming around you more. I think she's scared s***less that you have the video.<P>Absolutely ask her if she wants to work it out, but do it calmly and in a loving way. However, do not be too disappointed if you get mush for an answer. It's very likely she's still so fogged up that the moose brain worms are still spreading.<P>You, sir, are in the most powerful position I have ever read about on this forum. You have the equivalent of the Rodney King video, the Zapruder film, and OJ's DNA all wrapped up. Four aces. They are at your mercy. You can sit back and just watch if you want. So, no quick decisions. You have so much control that maybe you should seek Steve H.'s advice before your power results in nuclear winter.<P>WAT

I have a longer answer for you that I will post later, but for right now:<P>DO NOT GIVE HER THAT VIDEO. Listen to your lawyer. Nothing's going to happen if you don't give her the video, at least not right away. Don't do something you'll be unable to take back later. This is a bluff game. My W wanted PI's report on her - -I said no. I said if she doubted it's veracity and evidence, she would get her copy when she was being sued for divorce on grounds of adultery. (in a non-LB'ing way, of course...)<P>zen

Karen, thanks for the advice, I will wait until I speak with Steve. Hopefully he will lend some good insight as to my situation. I will keep everyone posted and see how it goes tonight. keep the faith!<BR>GC

Wat and zen,<P>Here is the kicker about the lawsuit. The law in my state that enables me to sue for Aleination of Affection and Criminal Conversation has just passed through the House and Senate, any day now the law could be abolished and I can't sue. Do I file and take back later. The whole process could cost me 20,000 or more with no guarantee that I win. I know this sounds vendictive and that God will have his vengence, but I'm in a pickle of a situation. I think the Doc got my letter telling him to get in touch w/ my attorney on June 27, one month ago and no contact from his lawyer. I think he is waiting out my bluff. I do however still have a couple of cards yet to play. The video itself (if needed) and telling his wife (if needed) I guess you are right WAT, I never really saw it as control but I guess both my W and the Doc are sweating. He had better back off that's all I have to say. I know I will tell his W if my W decides to not work it out. Secrets breeds sickness and his wife has a right to know, I just hate to put her through the pain I have endured over the last month. One last question, should I tell my W that I am going to tell his W if she can't make a decision or would that be a LB?<P>Thanks for everyone's response in advance!<P>GC

Make a copy of the tape, label it and date it. Put it in an ziplocked bag.. then inside an envelope... Fold over the excess paper and seal it with tape really good. Stick it in another envelope, put it in a safety deposit box.. or take to your parents to hold. If something happens to the original.. check that.. put the original in the sack/envelope/envelope.. <P>Keep the copy (marked COPY on the label) hidden in your house.. attic maybe under the insulation. <P>If she wants to see it.. remember she's being nice.. she'll take it out of the vcr.. as soon as she see's what she needs to and run with it.. destroy it or, gulp, give it to her lover. When she does this.. remind her that you have the original. Let it go. <P>I'd think about it before I mailed a copy to the OM/W. If you do.. with a note attached ... tell her that she needs a good friend to be there with her when she views it.. that way you don't have to worry about her mental state after her seeing it.<P>Make a copy and hide it.. Trust me on this.. Trust me.<P>------------------<BR>Husband2You<BR>*****<BR>Don't make me promises <BR>Baby you never did know how to keep them well <BR>I've had the rest of you <BR>Now I want the best of you <BR>It's time for show and tell<P>'All or Nothing' © 2001 O-Town

gdc - OK, do you want to be married or do you want to make Dr. Slimy pay and squirm? I'll guess your first choice is the former.<P>You know that if you send a copy to either OM or OM's wife, that your W will hear about it and immediately know you did it. Huge LB, but likely very effective at ending the affair.<P>On the other hand, if your wife realizes that what you have is legit, she'll be scared sh**less amd who knows what she'll do. Maybe the best way to use your power is to get several copies, give a copy to your wife, tell her you have other copies, and explain that you want to work on things - that you really don't want to have to send a copy to OM, that you'd rather put the whole thing behind you if she's willing to give him up. I don't know how you do it without it coming across as a threat or blackmail. <P>Or just tell her you know who OM is and let her figure out what you can do. If she has any brain matter free of moose brain worms, she ought to understand the fix she's in.<P>By all means, ask Steve, but I bet he's no where close to being as devious as we are. I have to admit, I'm living vicariously through your situation, because I came real close to having video as well, but only rated PG-13.<P>WAT

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by gdc:<BR><B>One last question, should I tell my W that I am going to tell his W if she can't make a decision or would that be a LB?<BR>GC</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Huge LB. You're threatening her. And you know what response you'll get? Probably something like, "Fine. Here's my decision. I want a D". (been there, done that, sigh!).<P>IMO, I think you should tell the OM's W irregardless. But if possible, do it in such a way that you can tell your W that you did that BEFORE she can hear it from the OM.<P>Take the advice given.. make copies of the tape (lots of copies). IMO, you should give your W a copy to view at her own leisure (I think it would be better if you weren't around when she saw it). Then sit back and wait for a few days.<P>Karen

Yep, no threats, enormous LB. Make copies of video, and give your wife one of them. Then step away and let her figure things out for herself.<P>The Plan A idea is to become a better YOU, a stronger you, while treating your wife with respect and honesty. IMHO, if you do anything threatening it will only fuel the fire under your W and OM to protect one another. The "Us against the World" scenario.<P>I know how hard this is, you want to show them you know everything, but how is that going to MAKE your W think being with you is a safe place to be. It'll backfire, guaranteed.<P>I know how much you hurt right now and you don't deserve this treatment. Please take good care and "think" before you react.<P>Lv,<BR>Jo<P>

DO NOT SHARE THAT VIDEO YET!! It gives you power, and that pisses them off. I have a video, too. H doesn't know about it yet (I'm still secretly photographing cars), and I don't plan on being alone with him when he does! We will be going to mediation soon, and this is my bargaining chip, so to speak. No, I don't blackmail. This will allow me to maneuver the custody and settlement issues better. If he knew about it now, he would pre-emptively plan counter measures to foil my pursuits. And when he does find out about the video, I don't plan on showing it to him right away, if at all. Hey, if he can have a secret affair, then I can have a secret video. <P>Lights, camera, action!<BR>Belle

Thanks WAT, Karen, Jo and Belle for your responses.<BR>Last night we met to take our dog to the breeder and we talked about 30 minutes about things. She never brought up the fact the she wanted to see my evidence again. She did talk about her counselor and that she was concetrating on "her" right now and what is best for her. She says that she is a very ammible person and has turned the other cheek for the past couple of years and finally decided not to do that anymore. She said that she is not sure if our marriage can be reconciled and she can't answer that right now. She said that her counselor is working to get her to a point that she will be able to make a decision. Is this all normal behavior? <P>I'm not sure but I think the Doc called while we were in the riding in the car. She was very quick to get off the phone and said she would call back. I told her that I have forgiven her for what she has done and I almost think that she had a tear in her eye but then she said for me to stop preaching to her when I talked about how God can forgive anyone regardless of the sin. I'm not sure about the whole video thing yet, I want to see what Steve recommends today during our session.<P>This is driving me crazy, how long will this waiting game take? It seems as though she could wait it out forever. <P>She said that she is going to the counselor once a week through Aug. then cut back to twice per month, so it looks like I have at least another month or more to go. Everytime I see her it seems I have a tough night or day or whatever. Talking on the phone is less emotional. Has anyone else found this to be true also.<P>Thanks for any responses!<P>GC