My H and I are having issues because he got laid off 3 weeks ago. His severance will be ending in Sept. and I want to create a budget to help us get prepared.<P>Background: We've always had separate bank accounts. We've been married 3 years and both have sloppy banking habits so we've just never merged. He NEVER records anything and I record but am so bad at math that I wasn't keeping careful balances. Now I balance my checkbook on a daily basis and keep track. He makes more money than me so he pays all the bills and I give him money from my check every 2 wks to go to bills too. However, he has free reign to go buy things when I struggle to survive on my paycheck. He is able to play vball 4 nights a week, stay out drinking with OW (EA), and buy things left & right.<P>With this new financial situation, I feel it's time to lay down the "law". I want to create a budget for BOTH of us to follow. Our credit card debts are HIGH! I was naive and just let him pay the bills without really checking. Granted, he wasn't using the credit cards to do his buying/partying, etc. but we racked up debts taking 2 vacations to Hawaii in the past 3 yrs. So, now I want to be an adult and put together a plan to follow to get our debts down and to track our spending.<P>My friend (that I've confided in with respect to my H's EA) is excellent at budget planning so I've asked her to help. My H is mad because he doesn't want her to know our financial problems as well as our marriage problems. So, I suggested that she and I work with a generic budget to I can see what a true budget looks like. He is STILL mad and finally said "Whatever. I don't care what you do." In a moment of clarity, I said that since he's not enthusiastically agreeing to this, then I won't meet with her. He still said "Whatever." So, he's mad no matter what I do.<P>Please help! I don't know what to do. He's mad because last week he told the OW he couldn't see her anymore, so no matter what I do he's going to be mad.

Whatever was a term my H used frequently after i found about his EA.<BR>what i gathered when he said it was this.......<BR>a)<BR> he wants to avoid the problem and the conflict it will cause because its something He doesnt want to deal with.<BR>b) <BR> he knows youre right but doesnt want to give you the satisfaction of admitting it<BR>c)<BR> hes so into his FOG that he really doesnt care what you do<P><BR>thats basically all the insight i can give for this one<BR>hope it helps

AARRRG.<P>"Whatever" is a term our 13 yo uses when we get after him about stuff. Basically it means he's shut down and isn't going to listen or respond anymore. He knows that it pushes our buttons, that's why he does it. We quit talking at that point and watch his actions (he usually chooses wisely). <P>But he's a 13 year old!!!!!!<P>--Jeffers

It's also annoying because it leaves me with no real choice. I can't win either way! IF I do seek outside help for getting our budget done he'll be angry-If I tell her I can't do it out of respect for H, he'll be mad because he thinks she'll be mad at HIM.<P>He's basically mad because I've confided in our friends (a married couple) and now I'm closer to them than he is. Since his EA with OW he never does anything with them and they're hurt by it too. He thinks our friends are going to take sides and hate him. They don't hate him-they are just disappointed in his actions. They see me hurt all the time and don't understand what he is doing. They've been friends with him for close to 10 years and don't know who he is either. I've grown closer to them since he started this EA. So, the fact that I asked them to help me with the budget is another "betrayal" towards him.<P>When I asked him what HE wanted me to do (meet with friends/tell them I can't) he said that if I don't meet with them now, then they'll be mad at HIM for not "letting me". He is in such a FOG that I don't know how to respond. He says that I'm the adult and I need to make the decision. When I said I'd cancel, he closed up and said "whatever." I just wanted help with the budget...that's ALL.<P>He's acting like a 2 year old...

deepbluesea...<P>So, treat him like a two year old. The funny thing about this reaction, (and the other posters are exactly right, by the way), is that when you make a decision, you are damned either way, but you are right either way! If you make a decision and it works out, he will come back at some time and tell you he is sorry, and you were right all along. If you make a decision and it is wrong, then you apologize to him and he gets to be right...(I know, backassward logic, huh?). The bottom line is that a decision needs to be made, and right now fogese has set in, so any decision he makes will be waffling, at best. You need to do whatever is in the best interests of the marriage and family situation. He is too caught up in his own *affairs* right now to be of much help. I have seen and been in a situation where the WS can literally run a family into financial ruin by simply not paying attention to bills and what is due by when, let alone the $$ that gets spent on OP. So, yes you may catch a little heck and it may be a LB in the short term, but the long term effects of your financial security outweigh the potential LB, right?<P>When he can peek out of the fog, he may be proud of you for what you did. He may feel like a heel for not helping. There could be other things, but you are thinking rationally right now...go with your gut instincts!<P>*Go confidently in the direction of your dreams.*<P>Trueheart

Thanks, Trueheart for the encouragement. I went to the library last night and found a bunch of good books for budgeting. I went home and started working on it-looking at bank statement, billing statements, etc.<P>I cancelled with my friend and she understood. Of course, when I told H-he was a little upset and wished I had come up with a better excuse so he wouldn't look like the "bad guy." Sighhhhhhh<P>I was APPALLED at how his spending has been out of control too. I am such a fool for not checking up on him earlier. He spent $1,000 in one MONTH on dining out/miscellaneous (a new shifter for his car-not because he needed it, but because it would make his mustang shift faster). ARGH! Most of that dining out is with HER or HER and other friends and not with us. Once I get this mess straightened out, we are both going on allowances. He's got to grow up-and that means controlling his spending.<P>The creditors have called/written twice because he's making late payments. A bill collector contacted us last week because we were $44 late on a phone bill! That's outrageous-he can't send in $44, but he can spend over a grand on volleyball/eating out???<P>The hardest part will be getting him to abide by this. We just started Plan A this week and he barely talks to me and his angry at me all the time. I'm contacting the counselor when she comes back from vacation to figure out how to approach THIS.

Somehow I missed the most important fact in your post -- your H broke up with OW last week!!!<P>He's in withdrawal right now. NOTHING you do is going to make him happy. He's going to fight about everything for a while. <P>Do the best you can to deal with the outstanding bills. You might have to try to limit his spending somehow (point out the facts of the budget) but, don't waste your time trying to get him to explain himself because you won't get a rational response.<P>Not sure your counselor will be able to help him but she might be able to help you. This is going to be a difficult couple of weeks. As people have pointed out, the fog is going to be real thick, try not to take anything personally for a while.<P>--Jeffers<BR>

DBS,<P>How ya hanging in there? I haven't heard from you lately and was wondering how you were doing? I'm not doing so hot tonight. Wondering why I'm even trying. Keep in touch.<P>Anna

I'm hanging in there. I realize he won't be happy with anything I do. <P>I'm working on the budget. I'm not sure how to approach H about it either-he needs to hand over the credit cards. I won't chop them up yet because of the lay-off but we can't use them at all. Since he's given up vball and the OW he's not spending money like crazy-but I want him to know how I feel about finding out how much money he did spend. It hurt me to see that I gave him $300 cash (since he had no money before he left) for his trip to WI and then he spent another $600 cash PLUS $500 for hotel (which he shared with HER). The fact that he spent $900 in a WEEK (plus hotel) just made me MAD.<P>The hardest thing is that it's the past (May) and I don't want to bring it up now but it still HURTS. My course of action is to just point out the facts and show him how bad things really are. State the FACTS and TRY not to get emotions involved.<P>The fog shows some signs of lifting-last night he actually talked to me about general things. He's been so pouty lately that this was great to see. He even thanked me for making him coffee in the morning and said he should have thanked me earlier in the week-but it meant a lot to him. And the other day he was out with his friend working on a car and he called home to tell me he'd be a little later than he thought and I thanked him for calling-especially since I hadn't asked him to do so. One of his EN's is to be acknowledged-so I am trying so hard and to be genuine about it.

I'm glad to see that you seem to be making progress. Way to go! If you need to talk anytime, I'm here.<P>Anna