I just feel I have so few people to talk to. I feel guilty about the affair... and I see the changes my husband has made (he used to have a temper and be very angry and I would walk on eggshells)... yet sometimes all of this recovery is just sooooo much!<P>He can see everything I type on the computer, which is OK with me. (Course, I cant see what he types) But, I suppose thats part of my punishment. He is able to talk to family members and they are on 'his side'. And at times, I even feel that the therapist is beating up on me.<P>H wants it ALL back. He wants the passion... the whole 9 yards. I am working on that, but sometimes I just wanna scream and just go back to the way things were 10 years ago.<P>Any thoughts from any WS??? Seems there is so much help out there for the BS, and I can understand why. But, sheeeeeeeeeesh, I just would like some support and answers as well.<P>Thanks for any help........<P>------------------<BR>..climbing the rainbow..

CM...<P>Keep climbin the rainbow!! Sounds like your H wants it "the way it was" and it's hard for you to see past yesterday. I know the feeling well. It is sort of like putting a band aid on a compound fracture!!<P>If, indeed H has made changes, then you two need to have some serious discussions on a plan of communication. Having expectations of when and how long recovery takes is like claiming a victory before the game is played. There are so many issues to be dealt with, feelings to be talked about, and before you can do any of that, you both need a little more time to grieve. You can't fix a leaky pipe in the house with duct tape and expect it to last forever. Sooner or later, the real problem will surface again and another leak will spring up, and then another, and so on!!<P>Have you two had counselling? Have you read Surviving an Affair? Have you, as a couple done the EN questionnaire? There are so many things to do, feel, say, and think before you bring back the passion, the routines (which got you in trouble to begin with). Remember, you can never go back to where you were...that would be saying neither of you has changed. You have to develop a new game plan for the both of you, that you can both be comfortable with, work on together and move forward as a couple.<P>Your feelings of guilt are understandable....you let yourself down, you let your H down, you let everyone down...and I bet you never *meant to* or ever *thought that would happen*. And your H can talk to anyone and everyone, since he is validated that you did the wrong.<P>If you need to understand that other WS know what you are going through, then take a little time to find the posts on here directed at WS...there are many here willing to help and have stories similar to yours.<BR>Here is my post in a letter to WS that may help you..<BR> <A HREF="http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum37/HTML/010715.html" TARGET=_blank>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/forum/Forum37/HTML/010715.html</A> <P>Don't expect instant solutions to long term problems..it ain't gonna happen...its a process! Keep in touch!<P>*Go confidently in the direction of your dreams.*<P>Trueheart<P>

What is your story? This isn't about bs vs ws ..though it seems that way sometimes, and I as the ws often feel that quite acutely as well, it is tough being pond scum. Fact is everyone is just as important as everyone else, and the ws doesn't "owe" anyone anything. Human beings are not property, and the ws should not be mistreated, abused, or treated with anything but care and love..... just like the bs. Guilt plays no useful role in conflict resolution, or reconcilliation...and no human being has any right whatsoever to judge another in any way. <P>If marital repair is going to occur, and be successful after an A, it has to be out of love, and because both parties enthusiastically want this. That means the bs has a lot of work to do too, they must also make the ws feel safe, cared about, protected, and nurtured. If that is not happening, then abuse is occuring, not reconcilliation..... and most DEFINITELY NOT punishment. If my w tried to punish me in any way, I would be gone so fast probably leave a sonic boom behind. Being "punished" is one of the main reasons ws leave marriages in the first place, if the bs does not purge that mindset from themself forever, they don't deserve you at all. Too often IMO bs take the affair, and think ah ha, now I got my spouse by the hair forever, I now have the ultimate control tool, the whole world condemns them, they can't blame me at all for using it....WRONG WRONG WRONG. This is the most important indicator a bs can give a ws that leaveing them was exactly the right thing to do, they are a controlling person who will never really care about you, only themself, and will only meet your needs insofar as it satisfies their agenda in structuring the marriage the way they want it, and are therefore not worthy of you. Harley makes note of this, and says categorically a bs (once the initial shock/recovery is over) is to never speak of it again to the ws (at least in terms of guilting, disrespectful behaviour), and if they do the ws should leave the marriage, it is totally unacceptable.<P>You gave very little to work on, maybe you have posted elsewhere, but his not letting you see what he writes violates rules of protection. You have the same rights he does, to every minute of his time, every cent of his money (as in where it is, what it is spent on), access to every email, voicemail....EVERYTHING, total disclosure...AND POJA, he doesn't take a breath without your enthusiastic agreement (hyperbole, but makes my point). He also makes (as do you) a serious goodfaith attempt to identify and meet ALL your EN's. It is good he has got rid of his controlling temper, but not so good if it has just morphed into something else. Why be angry if he can make you dance to his tune with guilt, do NOT feel guilty, you have nothing to feel guilty about, the A was not about him (the bs, never is), it was about you, and you have chosen to come back, he should be expressing his gratitude daily (as should you for being accepted back), and there is NO room for guilt in any of this. Guilt is a poor, weak, foundation to build a marriage on, don't do it that way. Be proactive (but fair and right) and make it clear this has to work for both of you, else you are gone. If you establish a pattern of dominance by your H based on your guilt for A, you will most likely never find the deep psychological connections a true marriage should have IMO.<P>"He wants it all back"..... a normal reaction, albeit the wrong one, cause what you had was obviously not worth it, and the problem is this is all about HIM, what about YOU. The bs who are successful are the ones who come to realize what they had was no good, and they let it go, tear it down, and start anew....yes everyone wants to go back in the sense of not having the pain or the hard work, but to want to go back as if the A (and it's reasons) never happened is all the more reason to leave the marriage. So what if the old marriage worked for him, it wasn't working for you, and He was to self-centered to see it, or maybe even to care if it was working for you too. IMO this is more of a problem with men in the first place, and IMO if they don't get it, they don't deserve a wife. Interestingly research on this subject shows that in general men are more content with their marriages than women, so that just means they have more work to do with the trainwreck hits.<P>Hope this helps, I am obviously not one who feels marriage at all cost is the goal, I am about marriage being the enthusiastic choice for both parties (as are the harley's pretty much), and you don't sound too enthusiastic at the moment (and it seems with good reason), I suggest you apply radical honesty and tell your H he is gonna have to work harder, and in what ways. Harley counselling is very helpful in getting reconcilliation on the proper track, anf protecting the ws from any vindictive behaviour be the bs. Ya know this stuff really does work both ways....the clock should be ticking (by the bs) for stopping an A (no contact) and ws coming "home". But the clock is also ticking for a bs to put aside their self-absorbed woe is me, this is so awful, how could you be such pond scum, I will never trust you, reactions too, and decide whether they really want a marriage with you.<P>Just for the record mom, I am not saying you shouldn't accept a certain amount of negative behaviour (afterall they had to take it from us too), but He should be working on stopping that, and apologizing. The past is past, the deed is done, IMO the success of reconcilliation depends in part on which way the parties are looking (forward or backward)...if He is running about making you look bad to his family, that is a big red flag to me as well, and if you don't like the therapist, get another one, don't allow yourself to be forced into anything that you are not comfortable with. ONe last disturbing thought, if you have not truly looked deep in your heart, and want this man, are only back out of duty, guilt, etc. he will know this (I think we all know stuff after the hypersensitivity unleashed in an A), and he may react to that as well. It is a confusing time mom, some of this just takes time...but whatever you do...don't just "settle" for the marriage, if you don't enthusiastically want to wake up in this man's arms for the next 30+ years, then at some point you will have to make peace with that....either leave, or try to make a sacrificial marriage work.<P>btw look up some of bramble rose posts, she has dealt a lot with bs attitudes, and mindsets.<p>[This message has been edited by sad_n_lonely (edited September 04, 2001).]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ConfusedMom:<BR><B><P>H wants it ALL back. He wants the passion... the whole 9 yards. I am working on that, but sometimes I just wanna scream and just go back to the way things were 10 years ago.<P></B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>CM: Just a thought from a BS male........ We DO want it ALL back! Know why?? Because, as a result of the A, and the thought of loosing our WS's, we are in PURSUIT OF YOU! What does that mean? <P>Remember when you were dating your H? He had to pursue you if he wanted you, YES? Or, maybe you pursued him. Remember your thoughts when you were "in love"? Weren't you scared of the possibility of loosing your H to another person during the "Infatuation" stage? <P>Well, during the pursuit of someone, we (Males and Females alike) fall IN LOVE! Remember??!! <P>We (as BS's) are (once again) infatuated w/ you! Think about it..... The very thought of loosing you makes us hold on tighter than ever before! Our pride has been hurt, we have been hurt, we feel un-loved; Therefore, we have this "intense need" to try to make you fall in love w/ us again. So, the pursuit begins! Make sense? <P>Think about how you felt about the OP. You had a LONGING, and an INFATUATION w/ him. Didn't you? That's what we are doing! It's an interesting concept to consider, but one that makes a lot of sense when you think about it.<P>My WS says that she is trying to "work on it" as well. This seems to be something all WS's say. But, what does "Work on it" mean? Have you ever thought that your H might eventually leave you? Have you ever thought that he may NEVER get over the hurt? It's possible! I can tell you that I (for one) have given serious thoughts about finding another woman who will love me the way that I want to be loved! I have never told my W this, but I have, and am still considering it! <P>Think about what you would do if your H left you for another woman......What would you do? Would you care? Would you be jealous? Would you pursue him? Would your pride be hurt? I'll bet the answers are 'YES', aren't they? Then, guess what? You would fall in love w/ your H, all over again! <P>Just something to think about. <P>Good luck, and God Bless!<P>HT <P>

<BR> The key to recovery is in each of you. Each of you knows that the A was wrong no matter what reason spaked the A it was still wrong in Gods eyes. The key from your wife is that she will love and support you in your pain and that you will do the same for her. A new life and a new marriage is in front of you. Do not let the past hurt the now. Use the past to learn how to talk to each other about all your needs. Do not hold pain alone share it with each other. Sometimes the pain can not be put into words; so just hold each other close and support each other. Tell him that you understand he needs to punish you, but that punishment can not rebuild a marrriage. Working together in support can rebuild. My wife had to swollow alot of junk in order to support me as we rebuild our marriage. Without her support our marriage<BR> would have ended. Instead; our marriage is getting stronger each day. If your h wants a strong marrige he must forget about punishment and focus on love and support. Please ask him to read this post. My wife the BS would be glad to converse with him. Thank You, Yesitcan work!<BR>

CM,<BR>I am the WS. My H wants it all back too. <P>Maybe you could ask him to just hold and love you. This helps when when I'm having a bad day(S).<P>I know that as soon as my H found out he wanted to take back whatever he thinks he may have lost. I know that since the truth came out, I can love my H on a whole nother level.<P>Try to give him what he needs, like love and support, and in return he should be able to do the same for you. It's amazing to me that both spouses need support from the other and of course they need to feel loved from the other. <P>We will want to know all the details ( i tried to fight this, but then I relized I'm failing my M by not sharing with my H)so make sure to tell him every detail no matter how gross. If it gets to be a little to unbearable, then tell your H to try at a later date b/c it can be over welming at times. Good luck. Sherry

I know you wanted to hear from WS, but I'm a BS.<P>HurtTired said it great.<P>Stop "working" at it. Want it like you wanted the OP.<P>My H gave more attention to the OW when he was telling her it was over than he did when he was confessing to me.<P>"Just get over it."<BR>Did any WS tell the OP that ?? I doubt it. You had to break it to the carefully, you needed to be alone with the OP, you didn't want to upset them.<P>Do you give your BS the same satisfaction ??<P>Yes, both parties have to want the relationship, but the WS has additional burdens..if you care You get over it & make your BS feel loved & truly wanted.<P>

Thanks to all who wrote. I am new here and sometimes you just need the support that "you aren't pond scum"... ha! I like the way that was put!<P>I will write more soon, but I'm going to bed to spend some time with my H. )<P>------------------<BR>..climbing the rainbow..