I have been where many of you are at now. I have snooped, lost a lot of weight, stayed up all night for weeks on end, I couldn't eat, I didn't want to do much of anything. I felt hurt, anger - more like rage, THEN anger, depression, anxiety, and somehow, an incredible amount of love for my H.<P>I got the fog talk regularly. I was told that we never should have married, he was forced into it by his parents (whatever!), he wasn't "in love" with me, and he even tried to convince me that there was no one else (in the meantime, there were MANY others... including 2 PA's and 1 EA/PA). All of this within weeks of me kicking him out of the house.<P>All of this (which I know is all too familiar), and having to look after 3 young boys (the twins were born 11 days after I kicked H out). So throw some post partum stuff, and recovering from a c-section in there, and you got pure hell, to say the least. <P>One month after kicking H out, I learned about this site. When I was ready, I read through much of it. I stayed up for HOURS just reading more and more. Why not? I was up all night anyways, right? After about a week of constant reading, I started posting. I haven't stopped since (grin).<P>What did I learn? I got one heck of a slap in the face, that's for sure! Here was my H, who undoubtedly hurt me deeper than most any other hurt I'd experienced before (the only thing surpassing it, being the passing of our almost 4 yr old son Andrew). I was so ready to blame him for all of this pain and suffering. What did I do to deserve it? Well, nothing. But I did do things that helped to create the marriage environment that we got to.<P>I slowly but surely, was able to see MY part in the whole mess. Continuous slaps in the face. But much needed as well (what a way to discover them though.. sigh!). I learned that part of plan A was to fix those things that helped create the mess. That was HARD work. No doubt about it. But it gets easier and easier every day.<P>So I plan A'd. Well, I tried to anyways. I did a heck of a lot of LBing along the way. I lasted 3 months. I couldn't take it anymore. More importantly, I was finally ready to move to plan B. H wanted his space all along, and I could finally give it to him.<P>That didn't last long. That very same day I started my plan B, things turned around majorly. He wanted to come home.<P>It was rather trying at first. Neither of us trusted the other, and for good reason (I was still snooping, and he was still in contact with OW#1 - the EA/PA, who had also been a friend of mine for over 2 yrs). We were experiencing a different kind of hell. We needed to build up the trust again. And IMO, that was harder than my initial plan A.<P>I continued to get the fogtalk. It turns out, that was b/c he was still in contact with OW#1. But once he was discovered, that changed. Contact ceased immediately. And within 3 weeks, the H I had fallen in love with years before was coming back.<P>Day by day, we got through it. He kept his apartment for 1 1/2 months during this 'trial' time. But eventually, we had to make the decision to get rid of it. Logically, it was a waste of money to keep it while he was living here all the time anyways.<P>The uncertainty of it all was still prevailent. The grass is always greener, so they say. But we had made our choice, and we were going to make it work.<P>I had so... many questions. He despised hearing them, and had a difficult time answering them. But gradually, he opened up more. And now, we're at the point where he'll share things with me, without my asking!<P>Neither of us knows where the major turn around took place. All we know is that it was a gradual process. And most importantly, and all that matters to us, is that we are in recovery now.<P>I continue to plan A him, for the same reasons as it should have been done all along... because I love him and I want to do these things for him and me. And now, he's doing it in return to me.<P>We talk more. We ask each other questions more. We show that we care about what the other thinks and says and does more. And we're learning everyday.<P>Again, we don't know where the changes actually took place, but I can tell you, things are still getting better and better everyday. I now get told "I love you" all the time. I even get massages for no reason, except for the fact that I looked stressed (that was tonight while I was doing the dishes).<P>What is my point in this all too long post? I'm hoping that it might give someone out here in MB land some encouragement to keep on with their plan A or plan B. Just to keep on having the hope that things can and will turn around. Of course, every situation is different. But you never know what could be, unless you give it your best shot.<P>I wish you all the best!<P>Karen<P>

Topie,<BR>I am glad it has worked out for you, but I feel I must point out that in other cases attempts to do everything possible to save one's marriage, while possibly leaving one with the satisfaction of knowing she did her best, have led to hugely negative impacts.<P>Had I immediately filed for divorce and hurried it through I could have at least partially secured my children's financial well-being. Had I not cared about making sure my kids could still spend time with their father, I could have immediately moved to a cheaper area. I could have avoided having them go to new schools twice in two years. <P>I wish I loved my H so little that I could have "dumped the jerk" and still been able to live with myself. <P>In the long run, what really matters in many cases is whether the lifestyle of the WS will be better at home or with the OW. When they OW has money, there is little hope.

Hi Topie. I'm so happy for you and your H. It's success stories like yours that keep me going even when I'm ready to pack it in. I'm not sure where my M is headed. Somedays things look like they're getting better and other days I'm sure we're destine for D. Last weekend was our anniversary and we spent time with the kids and then we had time for us. Things were going pretty good and until Wed. I just freaked out on him. If you've read any of my posts earlier this week there has been alot going on. Today we went to N.Y. to visit my father in the hospital we spent all day together. I just don't get him. One thing you said was that when your H was caught that's when things started to turn around. I really think this may be the only way my H will come clean about everything and come to his senses when I have real proof. I just don't know. I am so happy that you are in recovery and things are going well. Continued success in your M.<BR>cybil

Thank you, Karen. It is definitely for stories like this that I can keep going. Otherwise, it just seems easier to give it up sometimes. thank you thank you

Thankyou from me as well. I hope someday I can post a similar happy ending.

I know your story well. I did that during his last 5 affairs. I loved him, I showed him I loved him, I forgave him. <P>And now he has done it again...and this time filed for divorce. Now, he says the same old WS S***. How could he possibly do that?<P>My H has always found justifications for his affairs---and they have always been my fault. I have had to take a long hard look at myself....I guess I believed his crap. I guess I felt like I failed our marriage. <P>I have tried so hard...and he continues to abuse my love. Tonight he called for the first time in a long time. He tried to sound like his old concerned self. Then he started in on why he is doing what he is doing. That I had an awful way of showing that I loved him. He started spinning up when I asked him for specifics on how I had ever hurt him....he couldn't answer. Then he just started blaming me again. At that point, I told him I couldn't listen anymore--he still kept on. So, I hung up. He called back a few minutes later and said..."Did you hang up on me?" He sounded shocked. <P>He wants to be friends. Yea Right! Why would I want a friend like that? He still has no understanding of the pain and hurt he has caused. I don't know why I still love him. My heart feels like it is breaking in two. <P>I have kind of gone on a tangent here. What I meant to say was, it is good you are in recovery. I am very, very happy for you. But I went through a recovery with Jim every time he came back to me after an affair. It was hard and very painful. But I continually forgave and rededicated my love and life to him.<P>And he did it again, and again and again. Please make sure you get counseling and possibly join church groups or some kind of support group to help guide your marriage to a better place.<P>We didn't do that and just continued with our busy, hectic lives. And it didn't work. There was no true fundamental changes in the way we interacted. And now he has left me for good...and I am heartbroken. <P>To start over is wonderful and feels so good. I would do it again if I knew he wanted to be with me and was committed this time to me and to our kids. But to just go back and relive the way we used to interact would just cause more heartache. If you are not committed to your marriage and feel entitled to go outside your marriage...it won't work. <P>I wish you the best...and hope this wasn't too negative of a post. I am just trying to understand what happened to my marriage. Take Care Patty

Karen, thank you for this post. All the way into work this morning I was thinking of posting something to you and Knewjie. You should see something soon.<P>I too have alot of questions about the way I am feeling right now and it would be nice to know if others have felt the same way...<P>HbH

Thanks you for the great post !!! It was truly what I needed to read today. I really feel that my WH & I made great strides this weekend and just might be headed for recovery. I know that he is still in withdrawal at this time, but again this weekend he kept his commitment to "no contact" even though OW is continuing to call him (our home & cell phone) to try to talk with him. <P>We have tried two other times for "no contact" between them, but she has always called him after a couple of days and he wasn't strong enough to not talk to her or tell her not to call, so he fell right back. Though he hasn't seen her in about 6 weeks even just a phone call but him right back under her spell.<P>Well it has now been 2 weeks today since he last spoke with her and told her not to call. This weekend was great, between us and between us with our child. I so felt like he is much further out of the "fog" than he ever has been before and it is through Plan A that we have gotten there.<P>This site and others, like you, have so helped me keep the strength to continue on Plan A and LB as little as possible. I am not going to kid myself that we are out of the woods yet and he may still give in and pick the phone up someday and we will be right back to where we started. But for today I am happy and feel that I am closer to the relationship that you and your H are experiencing.<P>I started not to even come to the MB site today...I was afraid I would read something that would make me doubt my H actions this weekend. But NO,,,,your post was the 1st I read and I am so glad that I did. You have given me the strength, through this post, to believe in my H and that our relationship will continue to build until our M is as happy as it once was.<P>Thank you from the bottom of my heart for a wonderful post and such encouraging words !!!!