You have posted quite a bit about how certain you were you were done with your marriage, wasn't working, but changed your mind (rather quickly) over a few weeks time (the holidays?). You blame your feelings on fog, and infatuation with om, that seems a little simplistic to me. It is hard to fathom how you could really be in-love with your H, then decide you weren't, then in a short period decide again......that sounds more like someone who was more along the lines of angry at their spouse, and had an affair as a punishment rather than a true bonding with op. If your H was that good a fit for you, and you loved him, how is it you came to love om? And then apparently dumped the om rather quickly, how can anyone be sure you are able to love at all, as opposed to loving whoever gives you what you want the most? I am not trying to be disrespectful of you, the experiences of other ws do help me try to understand myself, but frankly, you kinda puzzle me. Was the om not a worthy person, was using you or something, and you came to realize that? Were you using the om, didn't really love him, he was just convienient to meet your needs at some point? Did you make committments to the om then break them? If so, why should you be trusted (emotionally, by anyone?). It shocks me some to hear (and I am not sure of what your relationship with om was, or how it ended) some ws (who may have gone so far as to make committments with op), turn on them and treat them so poorly. Sometimes (maybe often) a ws will realize they were weak and preyed on by op, fair enuf, wake up and respond aggressively....but what about ones who believe you, and alter their lives for you, then you just dump em, what does that make you (one who does this, not necessarily you debbie).

debbie, if you missed this I am still curious, if you just would rather not respond that's ok, maybe just a short acknowledgement of that.

SnL wrote:<BR>To dnl: "Did you make committments to the OM then break them? If so, why should you be trusted (emotionally, by anyone?)."<P>Dang it SnL .... I could use your sentence (your words) yet use different parties as the players. Players from your situation.<P>To SnL: Did you make commitments to your W (Thinker), then break them? If so, why should you be trusted (emotionally, by OW?).<P>SnL, please forgive me for crashing your thread to dlm. My intentions are not to offer disrespectful judgements yet I really think you are so lost. I think your wife is your touch stone in life and I believe if you lose her, you will regret it the rest of your life. Please give her the openess, the time, the benefit of patience you would offer the OW. <P>Jo<p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited September 23, 2001).]

Is ok jo, crashing is allowed, and yes I am well aware it can be turned around (jeez, would have to turn in my intellectual card otherwise). And it is another piece of this murky puzzle I agonize over. <P>Likewise my w asks how could I love or trust a cheater, and how do I feel about her choosing me, then leaveing me....this is a bit murky, cause we both agreed we had to stop (but it does hurt, both of us I think), we were both weak, and had a number of failed efforts to do so, but someone had to be finally resolved, and it was her, but I don't feel like she broke any committments exactly...we just ended up in an impossible place..... in love with one person, and married to another, and no clear path to reconcille these facts..... maybe we should have just said the heck with it and ran away together, primal survival.... but we are both well indoctrinated (to Christian social standards), ethical people..... and a lot of very strong male/female psychology came into play as well....so we caved, and took a safer (and hopefully) more responsible route, let each other freely go..... only time will tell if this was the best choice, or we may never really know. <P>Tell me jo, if your H had not divorced you so coldly, but instead make a good faith effort to determine what the marriage really was, and how you each fitted (and wanted) to be in it..... would you have accepted at some point he just didn't want to be married (radical honesty), let him peacably go, remained friends, and moved on in your life without any bitterness? It confuses me when bs say they love someone but will not have anything to do with them after a divorce...supposedly cause it is too painful....but how can that be? If you love someone don't you want them to be happy, even if it means not with you? Bs who feel that way reallllllyyy trouble me, it does not sound a bit like love, but either a love of the picture (which breaks obviously, so love is gone) or they feel their spouse cheated them on the contract, and so are now angry. I really don't get where anger has any place in love. Not the occassional flareup temp anger, but the deep abiding cold anger.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by sad_n_lonely:<BR><B>Tell me jo, if your H had not divorced you so coldly, but instead make a good faith effort to determine what the marriage really was, and how you each fitted (and wanted) to be in it..... would you have accepted at some point he just didn't want to be married (radical honesty), let him peacably go, remained friends, and moved on in your life without any bitterness? It confuses me when bs say they love someone but will not have anything to do with them after a divorce...supposedly cause it is too painful....but how can that be? If you love someone don't you want them to be happy, even if it means not with you? Bs who feel that way reallllllyyy trouble me, it does not sound a bit like love, but either a love of the picture (which breaks obviously, so love is gone) or they feel their spouse cheated them on the contract, and so are now angry. I really don't get where anger has any place in love. Not the occassional flareup temp anger, but the deep abiding cold anger.</B><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Yes, SnL, if my H would have made a true effort at exploring and trying to recover our marriage and ended the A but still wanted out of the marriage after that I would like to think I would let him go BUT, as far as being his friend, I really don't think so. You see SnL, not only would it hurt too much to try and be only his friend but he would be sharing with OW what he had promised only to me for the rest of our lives, that's excrutiatingly painful to accept and be reminded of everytime I would see him as only my friend.<P>In addition, my situation is a bit diff than yours, this is my H's second A and fathering children oustside the marriage and leaving me AGAIN for someone else is just a bit much to take for one person and then expect them (me)to continue being his friend. <P>How would you feel if when you were young, your mom and dad abandoned you and adopted another son. Even tho you still loved them, would you still want to be friends with them.<P>Wouldn't it hurt really bad every time you saw them with their adopted son, knowing you had expected to be their son for your enitire life?<P>They call it "Betrayal" for a reason, SnL. <P>I still love my H, SnL. But I have started to hate him also. He made solemn promises to me twice in our marriage, he was adamant and convinced me he would NOT do this again. He begged and pleaded and I trusted him. Just because I love him doesn't mean I have to be his friend, he has not been my friend, he would have let me die if I would have depended on him for help, while he was so blinded by having sex with another. IS THAT A FRIEND?<P>I can love him from afar, VERY afar. <P>Jo<BR><p>[This message has been edited by Resilient (edited September 23, 2001).]