First, a brief history. My D/D is 01/17/01 when my W, age 49 confessed to lustful Affairs with two guys, aged 32 & 36 that began on 07/20/00.<P>I have come to a point where I am focusing more on me & trying not to obsess about my W. This vent of sorts is intended more as entertainment value, cause I think I have a pretty good feel for the situation, but if you feel a need to comment I would I&#8217;m sure find it to be beneficial.<P>As you may know from prior post, my W considers herself quit the fashion plate & she tends to dress like Maria Carrie. With this in mind she takes great pride in seeing that I dress to suit her standards. Jeans & T-shirts and a favorite of hers. Since D/D I have lost 25 lbs. and although still not skinny, she is proud of me for that. Even after she chooses cloths I wear, she&#8217;ll make suggestion after we are out. For example to push my long sleeves up a bit or to button the top buttons on my shirt. As another example of this drive for perfection, w e ere at her parents 50th Anniversary party & I am wearing a sport shirt & blazer. She motions for me to take coat off. I felt comfortable with it on. It was easy for me to avoid her preference because she was in her meet the people mode and spent about a total of three minutes within touch range of me. As we are cleaning up after the party she again expressed her desire in a tone of disappointment, that she wanted me to take my coat off so as to show people how much weight I had lost. Do you get the impression that I&#8217;m considered a little pawn in her make believe world here or what? I continue to comply, cause it&#8217;s not a big deal & I don&#8217;t want to love bust! <P>Am I missing a big thing about the proper way to do laundry?<P>Now, I hear a new complaint. I often wash the clothes & bring them upstairs for her to fold &#8211; I think this is a fair thing for me to do & most W&#8217; who generally work 3 days a week (she has or will work 5 days this week), would be grateful, right? When she does Laundry she takes cloths out of our cloths shut from our garage & takes them inside our basement and divides dark & light before putting in washing machine. I on the other hand, turn & sort the cloths while they are in the shut & take Light in and wash, then come back for dark cloths. She tells me she does not like the way I do it & she would appreciate it I did it her way. I asked for clarification, and I said let me understand, I wash all the cloths in satisfactory manner & bring them up to you, but you&#8217;re upset at me because you don&#8217;t like the process I use to sort the cloths? She said Yes, you need to be more organized. Now I had to offer some resistance. I just have this feeling that I should not just do what ever, however she demands, like don&#8217;t I have any rights to do it my way?! <P>I told her it sounds like to me that she is being pretty controlling & that she wants me to submit to her every wimp. She said that she is definitely more organized around here & that she is just trying to help me. I said I think it may be a case of preference & that not everything has to be according to her defined way of doing things! [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <P>I know I&#8217;ve heard women are from Venous & men are from Mars, but what am I missing here??!<BR> [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img] [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img] <BR>I'm just chilling out.<BR>Love & prayers<BR>HH

Update: I am sure you have been sitting on the edge of your choir!<P>I just put the last load of cloths in the washing machine. My darling W never came down to check to see if I followed her suggested way of sorting the cloths before washing them.<BR>Do you suppose I should make a point to tell her that I drug the last couple loads in from the cloths shut in the garage & sorted them on the floor in front of machine, before loading? Do you think this would make it a more pleasing for her? Or, &#8230; perhaps I could stuff a sock down her throat & ask how it feels being washed her way instead mine? <P>I just had a thought. She was really upset at me earlier because I did not come as soon as she wanted me to rake the leaves. She asked if I could come home early, sey 4:00. I told her I could. I got home at 5:12 PM &#8211; I worked until 7:00 Raking leaves & bring in things for the cold weather we expecting. I came in & she said she had dinner, even though I did not deserve &#8211; I asked & she laid into me about how upset she was. I told her I was truly sorry & she kept it up &#8211; I finally said I hope I don&#8217;t disappoint you that much again. I guess the washing machine thing could be an extension of her annoyance with me in general?! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img]<P>Just a moment ago, she thanked me for bring cloths up. She is being nice now. I guess all is well that ends well. <BR> [img]images/icons/cool.gif" border="0[/img] <BR>HH

HH,<P>I can relate to both you and your W. When my W started working again last year I ended up doing almost all the housework and all the laundry. I think she did the laundry 4 or 5 times the entire year. I got into a routine that I liked (I never liked hers - still don't but never said anything because I didn't want to be ungrateful) and was pretty hurt when she talked about how nice it was now that she's not working to have the house and the laundry done. HUH??? I did a pretty damn good job! <BR>Anyways, it's just not worth fighting over. If she asks for help, I do it her way. If it's the weekend and she's running around I do it my way and put it away before she gets home. <BR>She might just be wanting to fight. Don't accept the invitation.<P>When your W stops complaining and stops trying to fix you is when she doesn't care anymore. Sorry ladies but it's true isn't it!?!<P><BR>who

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by whothehellisshe:<BR><STRONG>HH,<P>She might just be wanting to fight. Don't accept the invitation.<P>When your W stops complaining and stops trying to fix you is when she doesn't care anymore. Sorry ladies but it's true isn't it!?!<BR>who</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Good advice -- I did ask if she was trying to pick a fight & I did resit to get into full combat.<P>Fixing me? I understand, just would like to have right to fix her a little as well. I feel a double standard here. ...I'll quit.<BR>But I've got enough off my chest for now!<BR>Thanks!<BR>HH

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hurrian Hoosier:<BR><STRONG>Do you think this would make it a more pleasing for her? Or, &#8230; perhaps I could stuff a sock down her throat & ask how it feels being washed her way instead mine? <P><BR>HH</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P><BR>Hey HH! I vote for stuffing a sock down her throat and telling her to do the damn laundry herself! I think it's sweet that you help with the laundry and for her to question your method is the height of ingratitude. I would tell her to it do herself if she doesn't like your style! Thats what I tell my husband when he DARES to criticize my cooking. <P>Good to see you feeling chipper, HH, I always love reading your posts.<p>[ October 19, 2001: Message edited by: MelodyLane ]

Dana, you cracked me up!!! <P>HH, I have to say that you two have been married entirely too long to be lovebusting over how to get from point A to point B when the results will be the same!!! Whether it's clean clothes or making pancakes, the results are definitely more important! And you guys go head to head like bulls! My goodness!<P>All this nitpicking over little things when there is a bigger problem looming (how to recover from the A's). WHO CARES how the laundry is done as long as it gets done, right? Sheesh!<P>And I agree, it is beyond generous of you to do the laundry. I know, how about this, just skip the laundry and let her do it all the time? Then she can have it done her way, which apparently is "the right" way, yes????<P>I think most of us wives would be grateful if our husbands even looked at the laundry, let alone sorted it!!!!!! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img]

On a serious note, HH, you know, it just occurred to me that maybe the reasons why your wife tries to have everything (appearances) under control in her perfectly organized little way is to cover up for out-of-control behaviors in other (bigger, more important) ways... [img]images/icons/frown.gif" border="0[/img]<P>{{{{{HUGS & ATTABOYS FOR WORKING ON *YOU*}}}}}<P>Congratulations on losing 25 lbs.! Way to go! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img]

MelodyLane,<BR>Thanks for your reply. I try to make this entertaining to some degree, otherwise how can you cope!<P>BINthereDUNthat,<BR>"On a serious note, HH, you know, it just occurred to me that maybe the reasons why your wife tries to have everything (appearances) under control in her perfectly organized little way is to cover up for out-of-control behaviors in other (bigger, more important) ways... "<BR>Good observation -- I never thought of it in those terms, but I think you are right on.<P>To All,<BR>I think my Higher Power was somehow involved in last nights laundry episode. <BR>It turns out this morning when I brought the last load of dark cloths upsairs, I had one of my Darling W's hot "pink," GAP, V-neck pettete tops in with her hip hugger, tight jeans (which I put in dryer & this also upset her becasue it shrinks them a little, & God knows they cannot get any tighter! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] Well, I honestly thought "Pink" belonged in with the dark cloths! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <P>You guessed it. She was very upset, as you may know, nothing is more important than her young, provacative, "stylish" cloths! [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <P>I may be out of the laundry bussiness after all! [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] <BR>In all honesty, this was not intentional!!<P>Even with this fapoo, I think my DW will only be more diligent in her surpervison of MY Laundry chores. But it does definately give rise to the possibility of her motivation to do more of the laundry herself -- at least for a while. <BR>Just another day at the Zoo! [img]images/icons/tongue.gif" border="0[/img]<BR>Love & prayers,<BR>HH

HH,<P>I haven't laughed so hard in months! You are a riot.<P>My H has started doing the luandry too. I almost got down on my knees and praised him for it. I don't care if he does a HULA dance in the process, the fact is he is trying to help [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] By the same token, I have started dressing nicer etc which is something he said bothered him (I was also in a jeans and t-shirt rut). You can't have a marriage without compromise. Have you two read the Policy of Joint Agreement? No one is suppose to get their way all the time!<P>Keep up the GOOD job of working on you. I also have lost weight (45 lbs and 20 to go) and it will not only please your W, but will also make you feel better about yourself. Maybe if she sees other people checking you out she won't be so fast to criticize. My H nearly exploded the first time someone eyed me!<P>Jen

HH, an old saying comes to mind when reading your post. You may want to share it with your W....<P>"you can either tell me what to do or how to do it, but you can't tell me BOTH!"

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by FeelingSoAlone9:<BR><STRONG>HH,<P>I haven't laughed so hard in months! You are a riot.<P>Have you two read the Policy of Joint Agreement? No one is suppose to get their way all the time!<P>I also have lost weight (45 lbs and 20 to go) My H nearly exploded the first time someone eyed me!<BR>Jen</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Jen, <BR>Thanks & good for you as well!<BR>I have vented on here a lot. I try to do it here instead of lashing out at my Darling W! <BR>You see, not only has my Darling W not been affectionate & keeps me at arms length so to speak, she had PA's with two guys & she refuses to read or allow any meaningful discussions about recovery strategies. [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] Policy of "joint agreement" does not fit into her world -- it gives me too much power -- in her terms I want to be too controlling. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img]<BR>We are making some progress, an inch at a time, in joint counseling. One of my expressed needs, which I had talked about for years without the specific knowledge of MB was a need for conversation, specifically touching base during the day -- even on her days off, this was an annoyance to her.<BR>Our C suggested we reverse roles, for me to be more independent & for her to be more the pursurer. She was to call me everyday at noon. This happened for the first week. We saw our C a couple weeks ago & my W throws a minor temper tantrum about me wanting to do more with her, like take the dog on a walk -"Together", that she needed time to herself. The C suggested I give her some space & that she is supposed to think of things for us to do together.<BR>So, for the past two weeks now I don't call her during the day (I had eased up on that a lot anyway) & guess what, she doesn't call me until 5:30 or so to confirm dinner arrangments. The last two days she has not called at all!<BR>Oh, the C has attempted to get my DW to agree to allow me to discuss marriage enrichment ideas -- even an hour a week -- My W says it's just too much of a focus on her & her problems to handle at this time. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img]<BR>The C has also stated that dispite my W's misgivings, that for my recovery we need to talk about the A's, the why's, what was wrong in relationship & I empatically stressed I have responisibility there, but if we are to fix anything, we have to figure out what we're fixing. Nothing on that yet either.<BR>The C said she had a bood she could recommend on improving relationships -- my W rolled her eyes & said she did not know when she would have the time. The C said, sounds like you are "Booked Out" at this time & of course my W agreed --- <BR>In C my DW plays the role that all this is just too overwhelming for her to focus on at this time. She feels too much of a burden on herselve. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <BR>So, yes I am nice & of course when I don't bring up any of these outstanding issues, which is my assignment from C, she is nice to me. <BR>I know the plan A thing -- You can see -- Policy of Joint Agreement... why would she want that, she is real comfortable the way it is, why should she undergo any discomfort. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <P>Yes, I'm trying hard to focus on me. I'm having to deal with reality as well. I think my DW has some issues & she is not well. You may get a picture here, she is real good at getting her way, manipulation might be a good word -- Maybe it's just me, but it seems to me she is now controlling our activies from the joint counseling. But she is going to have to seek help, I can't force it, I've tried. AT least for the time being I'm hanging around & praying that somehow we'll get some recovery.<BR>One day, one hour at time.<BR>Sad, but true.<BR>Peace be with you,<BR>HH

The beat goes on!<BR>My DW (D=Darling!) now has blow ups with our D!!<BR>I don't pretend to try & understand what is happening in my DW's head, but I know she has been stressed. This whole thing is really strange because she was so looking forward to having our daughter visit. My DW is talking with our D as she gets close to our home & my DW insisted we have burgers on the grill & our Daughter, as she has been a vegitarian for about 8 years now & our D tried to tell her that she really doesn&#8217;t want that & my DW was aquisatory and said that our D has meat with her Italian food at her future in-laws & then hangs up on her! What is puzzling is that we know our daughter's preferences for food & this is what is so confusing & frustrating to our daughter, that her Mom was so inflexible on that point. ?? Our Daughter talked to me just after my DW, her mom, hung up & I said, no problem, we'll get some chicken breast for you.<BR>My DW stopped and got Pizza for that night, then the next day she was making an issues with our D about how she had the burger thing all planned & had to spend more money on Pizza. I have to believe that my DW understands that a little meat with Italian food is not the same as Burgers on the Grill?!<BR>I am a little concerned she is being tempted to act out again. ?? I have a strong sense that she is feeling pressure of inner demons -- she blew up at me the night before our D came, as I said initially, over me not getting home sooner to rack leaves & then later that evening she did not like how I sorted the cloths to do laundry -- I did all the laundry, she just took exception as to how I sorted. Yesterday she was very cranky & this morning, very distant & when I left, I had to return & when I started up the stairs to say good bye again, she started yelling at me that I come up the stairs too often!<BR>I did lose it & left swearing obsentaties & saying perhaps that is how she wants me to treat her! She left a message for me at my work apologizing. She did not call me on my cell phone as a traveled to work?<BR>We are normally intimate at least once a day & sometimes twice -- We've only been intimate once in last three days -- I'm trying to slow down pace, but she has turned me away. Perhaps she is coming to grips with her addiction & is trying to abstain. ??<P>Perhaps she is hitting bottom?<BR>I am trying to be patient!<BR>I know. I did not create problem, can't control it & can't cure it!<BR> -- In our 31 years of marriage it has normally been me that is doubling over backwards to make her happy(no surprise there, huh).<BR>She has taken no interest in marriage enrichment books or material I have offered. Our couples counselor had suggested we reverse roles -- I am to be more the independent type & her the pursuer. For years I have expressed a need to chat during the day (if just for a moment) & she has always rejected the idea. The C suggested she call me everyday at noon -- she did this for four days. We saw the C three weeks after this assignment -- C did not address the fact that she gave that up, but asked us to generally continue that role -- I was promoting the idea to take the dog on walks together, my DW said she needed time alone -- C said for me to give her more space & she is to think of things for us to do together. <P>I continue to not discuss marriage enrichment ideas &#8211; No MB stuff for at least past 6 &#8211; maybe 8 weeks now &#8211; You see, this creates Love Busts &#8211; DW says I&#8217;m too controlling with these ideas. Too much focus on her & her problems or what she does not want to do. Like show me respect & affection!<P>Our last Counseling session was three weeks ago. I HAVE CALLED HER DURING THE DAY MAYBE TWICE DURING THAT PERIOD OF TIME. She now only calls me around 5:30 TO ASK ABOUT DINNER PLANS. She did not call at all three or four days & last evening I was not coming home for dinner & she did not call. She has made a big deal saying that the other ladies at her work typically only talk to their Husbands when there is something specific, like to pick up the kids or something. I feel really dis-connected. Our finances are low & therefore we're not scheduled to see counselor. Should I continue to not call her & play the strong silent type?<BR>Thanks for any feedback you may feel up to!<BR>I'll continue to try & focus on me! I am starting to get used to the no talking thing during the day, but I must confess I still struggle & feel manipulated to a degree -- I mean how hard is it to pick up the phone & just say hey, HOW ARE YOU?! [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img] Take 30 seconds. ?? I hear stories from her about conversations with the ladies she works with, like how their kids are doing & the bosses husband's new job and such. My point is I know it is not exactly a sweat shop with heavy, hands on supervision -- hell, she comes and goes as she pleases -- she proved that in the six months she carried on with her two boy friends! Yes, I'm fighting a little resentment here! Sorry!<BR>I guess she has strong feeling that she would be giving in to me & that would give me some control over her. ??<BR>I'll just continue to Plan A ??<BR>I do feel we are lacking a little structure here. [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif" border="0[/img] <BR>THANKS FOR ALLOWING A GOOD VENT HERE!<BR>Peace be with you!<BR>Bob<p>[ October 23, 2001: Message edited by: Hurrian Hoosier ]

Hey Hurrian,<BR>Awwww, you big baby, you can make it through the day without a phone call! I'm kidding. I know how you feel, but my husband and I are very much in love and he has never called me during the workday to "just say hi." Never. It's not his style because of the intensity of his job and his focus is so on his work. He has the personality type of a beaver (a worker) and I have the personality type of a labrador (friendly, loyal, relationship-oriented), so you can see where we differ on something like this.<P>I have learned to accept no phone calls during the daytime and it's okay. It hasn't killed me. Sometimes I call him OR sometimes I put a nice card in his lunch to let him know I'm thinking of him.<P>I think your requesting a phone calls for years is definitely a Love Buster because it is a selfish demand. Why would you want her to be calling you if she really didn't want to and the sentiment wasn't from the heart anyways? Then it just turns into another one of you guys' power struggles.<P>I say nah, let her be. Find contentment inside of you. Plus we're here. Keep venting. Keep praying. You'll make it.

HH,<P>Months and months and you still focus on the clothes and the lack of contact during the day. Isn't it time to move on and let these particular issues die? Doesn't exactly sound like you're working on yourself. Still focusing on the trees, not the forest.

HH,<P>Months and months and you still focus on the clothes and the lack of contact during the day. Isn't it time to move on and let these particular issues die? Doesn't exactly sound like you're working on yourself. Still focusing on the trees, not the forest.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BINthereDUNthat:<BR><STRONG>Hey Hurrian,<BR>I think your requesting a phone calls for years is definitely a Love Buster because it is a selfish demand. Why would you want her to be calling you if she really didn't want to and the sentiment wasn't from the heart anyways? Then it just turns into another one of you guys' power struggles.<P>I say nah, let her be. Find contentment inside of you. Plus we're here. Keep venting. Keep praying. You'll make it.</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>BINthere,<P>She has busted my bricks for years about me calling her -- The idea of her calling me was a new one the Counselor came up with. I am to be the more independent type, she the pusurer of sorts.<BR>Like our C efforts to get my W to look into marriage enrichment ideas or talk about why the A's -- Nothing yet -- W is very stubborn -- it has to be her way!! She is very good at getting everyone to accommidate to her needs, she is used to it (that is her dad's way for sure), so if you can get away with it, why not!! I believe from her point of view, it takes too much energy to consider other peoples needs if they don't go along with her comfort level of acting, why exert the energy -- <BR>I am getting used to the lack of contact, I just feel it is one more sign that she does not want to put much effort into doing something for me -- anytime there is any remote issue about how she treats me, She'll even make saterical remarks, "Oh, that's right, this is supposed to be about you!" When she says this I believe, she is relating back to our Counselor's suggestions --role reversal, let her come up with things to do together, ect.<BR>-- I think my W may be hitting bottom, lot of outbursts of late, perhaps she is close to coming into reality that she may have some issues that she has to deal with ?? -- I'm not counting on it though.<BR>She did not ask about my support group meeting Monday evening -??<BR>She had asked about a support group for her last week, then a few days later said she was just talking.<BR>Perhaps she can see that I am trying to change my strategy & that has her confussed in how to deal with me?<P>Perhaps she is feeling left out?<P>Hope you are feeling better!!<P>Keep the prayers coming, I appreciate your support!<BR>Peace be with you,<BR>HH

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Managing:<BR><STRONG>HH,<P>Months and months and you still focus on the clothes and the lack of contact during the day. Isn't it time to move on and let these particular issues die? Doesn't exactly sound like you're working on yourself. Still focusing on the trees, not the forest.</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE><P>Sorree!<BR>I have not said anything to her about her cloths for months. The calling thing was our C's idea -- her to call me.<P>I am getting real used to not talking to her; In fact I may be coming to a point where our conversations could be about who gets what piece of furniture -- perhaps that is your point. <BR>I though a vent here was better than lashing out at her, but I understand, this gets to be sickening, even to me! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <P>Thanks for your input, I need a fresh splash of water now & then!<BR>Peace,<BR>HH

Well HH,
You just have to be patient. I'm sure things will work out. After all these years, you guys have a lot invested and if it wasn't worth it, you would have given up by now. It's worth it so hang on in there and just be patient with everything. The only way to get patience is to wait so you'll just have to hunker down... <<<<HUGS>>>>

BINthere,<p>You know me well enough that I am usually very patient. I just question myself sometimes if I'm too patient & it is intrepeted as a weakness for her to exploit.
Her most recent outburst are being atributed to PMS pre-menapausal things! [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img] <p>She is like a dr, jeckle & Mr. Hide -- My best friend who has know bith of us for years, just has a hard time believing all the things she does & how she treats me. He too is encouraging the patient approach.
Her family crises things have put a lot of focus on her feelings and bewilderment of what makes her do what she does -- IMHO -
Love & prayers,
HH

Here's a bump if you care for most recent historical update -- hesterical might be more appropiate!