I haven't posted for a few weeks. It's seems like when I am down I come here to vent and sympathize with others. I have to say that we are progressing by the book! It is amazing to me how closely our timeline is following the ones in Dr. Harley&#8217;s books! Last contact was 9/11/01 and we are on our way to a real recovery! I know that we have a long way to go, but my WH is out of the fog and we are progressing! The best part is that he is finally happy! There were several weeks when he wanted to run back to her, but he was strong enough not to! He knew that he couldn&#8217;t if our relationship was going to work out. Such a funny thing because he didn&#8217;t want to be with me at all, but knew that he was obligated to try so he did. He still hasn&#8217;t expressed any remorse for his actions, but according to Dr. Harley that may come later, or maybe not at all.<p>Like I said, we still have allot to work on, but we moving forward and it&#8217;s a great feeling! Absolutely no contact is the key! He tried to work with her after D-day, but it wasn&#8217;t until we moved out of state that thing started getting better! He went through terrible withdrawal and at first would have left at any moment if I had told him &#8220;I give up.&#8221; I never gave up and he is telling me that he loves me, misses me when we are apart and intimacy has returned!<p>D-day was April 16 with him going back and forth between OW and me a few times. He returned home for good on June 19 and final contact was September 11. I hate to be optimistic because I&#8217;m so afraid of being hurt again, but I see the light!!!<p>Le

Dear Moving Forward...<p>Thanks for the update and keep up the good work. I would like to know alot more about your events since 9-11. My WS is trying to end it with the OM or rather he is trying to end it with her i think. The contact has dwindled to about once a week or so, but it is supposed to be over now..we will wait and see. I haven't seen real signs of withdrawal, so i am skeptical. How did you get him to agree to "No-Contact" with the OP ? What would he do if the OW contacted him ? Even if my wife didn't call him, he could certainly call her and she probably wouldn't hang-up on him. <p>How do you get to radical honesty when right now she won't even tell me that they talk unless i ask SPECIFIC questions about it and i HATE doing that. We are getting along really well together now, but she still can't/won't be totally honest about that part. I told her, "Hurt me with the truth, but don't lie to me !!".<p>She has tried to focus on me and seems to do a good job, but i am left wondering if it's all an act or if it is genuine....that's a sad thought.
Thanks for any tips on getting her to agree to no-contact....etc.

Sad Daddy,<p>The first 6 weeks after Sept. 11 were hell for me! He was gone (in Egypt w/ the Guard) for the first three, but when he got home the next 3 weeks were really bad! As far as the no contact, this was his decision. We have 2 kids (D-14yr & S-10yr) and he decided that he felt obligated to try to work on our relationship. He admitted that he didn't want to be with me and that if I told him to go, he would be delighted. You see, then it would be me being the bad guy and he could leave guilt free. I held strong and kept telling him how glad I was that he was home and how much I loved him. He didn't believe a word I was saying at the time.<p>Basically he was home because of the kids and had decided himself that if there was even a remote chance that our marriage could work out, he could never see the OW again. We even moved to another state. When they saw each other on Sept. 11, they cried, hugged, kissed, said their I love you's and then said goodbye. I guess they both meant it because she hasn't tried contacting him either.<p>The best thing we decided to do is set one day aside every week for kind of a "self counseling" session. During this time, I could ask anything I wanted and he promised to tell the truth in his answers. This was very hard for me because the truth hurt like he**!! For the first 3 weeks he basically stuck to the same story . . . I'm not 'in love' with you . . . we're not making love, it's just sex to me . . . she is my soul mate . . . I love her . . . I can't imagine life without her . . . blah blah blah!! I tried not to cry and did pretty good most of the time. I knew from reading Dr. Harley's books that these feelings were all normal. I just told him that I understood and kept telling him that I believed in us and that everything would work out. I did not LB a single time.<p>So anyway, exactly 3 weeks after he got home from Egypt, he finally told me that he loved me. I almost fell to the floor! It was like the fog had lifted over night. Then last week, I got my first French kiss in 7 months and there was actually some passion. We still have a long way to go, but he is at least feeling that there is hope now!<p>No contact is the key! It has to be the WS's idea or I don't think it would last!<p>Hang in there! It can work out! I am scared of being hurt again, but I know that will get better with time! <p>I would have to say that if you haven't seen any withdrawal symptoms or depression, that she is still in contact with the OM. My husband continued to work with the OW for 3 months and even though the PA had stopped, they were still attached emotionally. I didn't see any withdrawal until after we moved away and there was truly 'no contact'!<p>My prayers are with you!<p>Le

Moving Forward, <p>Thanks for the info. <p>She has gone through periods of withdrawal and then let go and they made contact again. There are days of commitment and passion towards me and our marriage. Then she has bad days...like yesterday. She had a VERY BAD day and was totally withdrawn from everything. We talked last night a little and she admits that this "A" has been all about her and her thinking only of her and she is sorry for that...but it still is. <p>She asked me which i thought was "odd" if i ever get tired of being the "good-guy". The one who is forgiving and learning and trying to hold our "M" together. I told her no...but that she wasn't the "bad-guy" either. She think that i want her to just forget about everything and be the perfect wife and mother and be in-love with me again. I simply want her to be happy. I know that will take time. <p>What is hard is we will have days where she seems totally committed to me and the "M", then days of totally the opposite. We have 3 kids and i ache for them if things don't turn out. <p>It's also very hard to see all the "things" that she has kept from their "A". The list of phones numbers in her purse. Myseterious rose petals in drawer. Tapes of music that i assume to be their songs. Cards he has sent her. The list goes on. <p>Heaven help me......
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Sad Daddy,<p>I really feel your pain! It is so hard to be strong and supportive when we are all hurting so bad! Just keep plan A-ing! It sounds like you're doing a great job! Have you read SAA? My husband and I are reading it together. He is doing it only because I want to, but I am hoping that some of it is sinking in! It is extremely important that she stops all contact with the OM!!! FOR EVER--FOR THE REST OF HER LIFE!! I have repeated the "for the rest of your life" over and over to my husband! I don't want him to think that in a few months he will be able to call her to see how she is doing! That would be a disaster!! <p>As far as the gift and stuff, I would think that she will need to get rid of them, but I don't know if I'd push it too hard because it would probably be a LB! Fortunately my husband doesn't have anything from the OW. I would think that seeing those items all the time would constantly trigger memories for you and your wife! Maybe when you&#8217;re truely in recovery, you could have a burning ceremony to symbolize your new beginning! I would think it could be a cleansing experience for both of you!<p>Good luck and I'll keep praying for you guys!<p>Le

Dear Moving Forward, <p>Thanks for the reply again. My WS and i talked again this weekend. She hates the weekends because she knows we might talk. She did open up somemore to me, but she has a hard time doing it. I don't know if i should totally believe her or not yet. <p>She told me that it is over with the OM, but that she still have all these feelings for him. She won't agree to a No-Contact with him...they left it that they could contact for things like a death or emergency....I know what that means. <p>She also told me something that hurt alot. She has a kind of resentment towards ME because i found out about their "A". I get cheated on, lied to, torn to shreads and she has resentment towards ME because i know. She blames everyone but herself. I told her this also...LB..probably..but it's the truth !! <p>She says that she loves and will even tell me that, but she can't look at me when she talks about it. She says that she doesn't know what she wants. She doesn't know if she wants to be married. But she also says that if she were to step away and look at it like everyone else does...that she would think she is crazy for what she has done and is doing. <p>I am not sure how to go on. I think she wants to seperate to see how she feels about me. She wants to know that she would miss me. We haven't done this because i wanted to protect our 3 kids (10-6-3). I told her i was thinking of moving out which floored her, because she assumed that it would be HER that would be asked to go. She didn't cry or anything.....i am not sure what our or my future is at this point and that is driving me crazy. <p>She says she won't go back to talk to the "C" that she and I were both going to individually. I am still going. She is the one with issues.....yet won't get help. <p>I hope and pray we can get through this in-love. <p> [img]images/icons/confused.gif" border="0[/img]