I have only posted on here a few times, mostly because after I found out about WS A's, he seemed to pretty quickly be coming out of his fog, we were in counseling individually and he agreed to marriage counseling together. As you can imagine, I was so happy to see that much progress so quickly. Our major sticking point was that he had contact through the phone w/ the OW, due to business he said. <p>Yes, that is true, and he said that as soon as their other new partner got up to speed, he would be fielding the phone calls from this woman about business. So I believed him, although really w/ a wait and see attitude. So now that time as passed I can see that he has been lying to me about this. He continues to call her and she him. He has said that he thinks of her sometimes and wants to see what she is doing, Sometimes he erases his calls from his mobile, sometimes he leaves them and I find them.
He won't stop contacting her and I have found out froma third party that she is a real slut. She has a number of other boyfriends and my H knows nothing about them. I can't even tell him because he would never believe me and would be angry with me instead. There are other stories that I have been told about her but do not know what to do with this information. <p>I don't know what to do now. I have been plan A'ing for about 2 months now in hope that this will diminish, but it really hasn't, if anything, its gotten worse. I don't think he's making any real effort to break off contact w/ her like he said he would. He obviously has a great emotional attatchment but I don't see how he would ever get over it as long as he remains in contact. And of course I feel very hurt that he will not break off this contact, which makes it hard to do plan A wll all the time. Any words of advice? Is this worth doing a plan B over? And how long should I wait before I do this. Please I need help!

Hi Firefly,<p>I've lived your delimna. I'm sorry for what you've been thru, a life's experience we all could have done without. <p>If your H continues contact with OW and you are losing love for him and/or you are LBing non-stop with no chance to resume an effective Plan A, then I would suggest Plan B. <p>Do you think you're ready for Plan B? Are you starting to lose love for your H?<p>Lv,
Jo

Hi Resilient,<p> Boy, I wish I could be like that flexible reed. I am LB'ing him sometimes because although I know about how often the phone calls happen, I am able to suppress my hurt and anger for awhile but eventually it gets too much for me and I have to ask why they are still going on. I never do so in an angry or confrontational manner, I always do it in the form of an inquiry, very calm, etc. But he immediately gets defensive and angry so I know its an LB for him. <p> I do feel like I am beginning to lose love for him, because I don't see him trying to make changes, and never feel like he is sorry for his past A's. If he is sorry at all its more in a the way a person would feel sorry for someone who is the victim of a natural disaster, it has nothing to do with him. I have even begun to think that me and our kids would be better off not being part of a family that was built on such lies. He is unable to be honest with me and even says that he is a liar and cheat, so don't expect anything different. I know he has some psychological problems for which he takes prozac and wellbutrin, so I don't know if I am expecting too much from him. At the same time, he continues to make choices everyday that hurt me and our family, and I do hold him responsible for that.<p> He has threatened to leave today, and did not seem to like it too much when I just replied that he was responible for his decisions and if he felt that was best for him, then that was his choice to do so. Also that all choices have repercussions, good and bad and to remember that when he decides what to do. <p> I have finally come to the realization today, and I really mean I have internalized this: You cannot keep someone from making a mistake or decision that they are intent on making. I can't keep him here if he doesn't want to stay and I can't keep him from her if he wants to be with her. I have begged and pleaded in the past and he did not leave, I feel like he lost what little respect he had for me when I do that. So I will try not to do that anymore.

So now I am going to take my kids to the park, its a beautiful day, and hopefully we won't be here when he gets home from work.

My WS acted the same way when I said just about verbatim what you said. Haven't heard any threats since, but you know what? After 5 months of just about the same scenario only not just telephone contact, I so much want WS to find somewhere else to live. I don't think I love this person any more. I don't think the person I thought I married exists. WS needs counseling in the worst way. The fog is thick and denial is rampant, but the facts remain. We have not spoken to each other this entire weekend. We stay on separate floors of the house. What kind of life is this? Lawyer told me S should leave; not me. I agree, but this is crazy!! Hang in there, focus on your kids and yourself. We don't deserve this treatment!

When I reached the crux of lies and deceit from my H (former WS), I ended up kicking him out of the house. This was a few months before I knew of MB, and I certainly didn't do much of a plan A at that time. I was too angry, and showed it.<p>The betrayal had started with money. All sorts of money that would just 'disappear'. Sure, I'd find the receipts to things well after they were able to be returned, so I knew where it had gone. But the money was for the family, NOT H's whims (usually something electronic).<p>Not knowing how to react well to those situations (LBing all over the place), led to a lot more distrust and loss of love between H and I. He started spending more and more time on the computer - I found out after I kicked him out, he was involved in an EA (PA if you count kissing) and actively seeking other women to meet with online.<p>For us, there is NO WAY we would have had reconciled had we stayed together in the same house. Granted, our separation (for 4 months) also allowed him to get heavily involved in an EA/PA with a (now former) friend of mine. He also had 2 additional PA's in that time.<p>Ironically, it's because of the EA/PA with OW#1 that I learned of MB. If that didn't happen, I would never have found out how to deal with the whole mess, and how to fix it.<p>You're very fortunate to have found this site prior to a separation. It's allowing you time to do a great plan A. Unfortunately, your H like so many others on here, is enjoying his fence sitting with his cake.<p>How long can you take that stance of his?<p>In your answer to that question lies what it is you need to do. Are you ready for plan B? If you're severely losing love for your H, then the answer is yes. <p>There are many on here who think plan A is best when done on a long term basis (even over 1 yr). There are just as many (probably more), who believe plan A should last a MAXIMUM of the 6 month guideline suggested by the Harleys. Either way, you have to do what is best for you and your family.<p>Always keep in mind that plan A is about YOU. Continue improving yourself, and protecting yourself. If that means you need plan B, then do it. But you need to be sure of it before you act on it. Its concept doesn't work if you jump in and out of it. And in my opinion, it's near impossible to implement while living together.<p>Karen

I see no reason not to tell your H the truth about ow. It should be done in a calm matter of fact way, tell him it is his choice what to do with the information, but that you care and do not want it on your conscience. The truth is never really a LB IMO, it is more about how you tell the truth that makes something a LB. Any marriage that cannot stand truth is hardly worth saving anyways.

Thank all of you for your replies, I don't know where I would be if I didn't have other people going through the same thing as me to give me their advice. <p>Yesterday he finally told her that they could no longer have any contact, and that she was not to call him anymore, business or otherwise. All info that he needed for business was to go through the other partner to him. I hope this is true. I will have to wait and see. He is in a deep funk, and when we made love last night he wasn't able to c*me. This has been a problem for a short time, now I'm afraid it will be worse. It makes me feel very bad, because then I imagine he has no problem like this with her, and he remembers that,too. They have had no PA for almost 2 mo. (he says), just (!) EA with phone contact on a daily basis. So now I think is really the time where it all begins, in terms of the fog and my plan A. I hope and pray he is telling me the truth and that he will be able to not contact her. I don't have much confidence in that tho. <p>It makes me mad that he can't be sympathetic to my hurt and tears, but he feels bad for her, when she's really a snake in the grass, only he doesn't know it. It turns out that she slept with an instructor of a training session in Denver a few weeks ago in order to get answers to a test she had to take! And he just thinks she walks on water. I learned a lot of stuff about her from a coworker that my husband has no idea about. How to tell him w/o him hating the messenger and thinking I'm lying? I'm thinking of hiring aprivate investigator to get the truth, then I can decide if I want to tell him if he continues contact. How I will be able to pay I don't know, but it might be worth it to put it on a credit card if he can really see what she is. Any thoughts? Has anyone ever done that?

Thank all of you for your replies, I don't know where I would be if I didn't have other people going through the same thing as me to give me their advice. <p>Yesterday he finally told her that they could no longer have any contact, and that she was not to call him anymore, business or otherwise. All info that he needed for business was to go through the other partner to him. I hope this is true. I will have to wait and see. He is in a deep funk, and when we made love last night he wasn't able to c*me. This has been a problem for a short time, now I'm afraid it will be worse. It makes me feel very bad, because then I imagine he has no problem like this with her, and he remembers that,too. They have had no PA for almost 2 mo. (he says), just (!) EA with phone contact on a daily basis. So now I think is really the time where it all begins, in terms of the fog and my plan A. I hope and pray he is telling me the truth and that he will be able to not contact her. I don't have much confidence in that tho. <p>It makes me mad that he can't be sympathetic to my hurt and tears, but he feels bad for her, when she's really a snake in the grass, only he doesn't know it. It turns out that she slept with an instructor of a training session in Denver a few weeks ago in order to get answers to a test she had to take! And he just thinks she walks on water. I learned a lot of stuff about her from a coworker that my husband has no idea about. How to tell him w/o him hating the messenger and thinking I'm lying? I'm thinking of hiring aprivate investigator to get the truth, then I can decide if I want to tell him if he continues contact. How I will be able to pay I don't know, but it might be worth it to put it on a credit card if he can really see what she is. Any thoughts? Has anyone ever done that?

firefly,<p>I can understand why you do not want to tell him about the info you have on her. It's the old shoot the messenger problem. Using a PI to find info might be a very good idea. But it could be expensive.<p>Is there anyone you know who could tell him? Someone he would trust?<p>Perhaps you can tell him this information over time. Be sure to do it calmly with no LB'ing.<p>Z<p>[ November 12, 2001: Message edited by: zorweb ]</p>

I don't see why you'd want to spend so much time, effort, and money to give your H info on the OW.<p>She is not the cause of your marital problems. She is only a result of them. True, recovery cannot begin until she is out of the picture and there is no contact (on a personal level)... but making her look bad to your H will only make him want to believe how much she isn't what you say she is. (did that make sense? LOL). It could be too great of a love buster at this time.<p>I tried to tell H about what OW#1 was up to during their relationship. He doesn't remember me telling him anything now. He didn't let the info sink in until AFTER there was no contact. (He thought their relationship was special.. that he was special to her. Turns out, H was at least the 2nd EMA she's had in the last couple of years.. and within 2 to 3 months after no contact occurred, she was already heavily involved with yet ANOTHER MM!!!).<p>I do hope that your H really means to keep the no contact now, and not just saying that to appease you (I've been through that too.. sigh!). Just keep your eyes and ears open for the usual signs.<p>Karen

fire
How about the person who told you about these things? Couldn't that person tell your H about the OW? [img]images/icons/wink.gif" border="0[/img]

Fire
BTW, about prozac, this does affect sexual performance so his inability may not have anything to do with you. From one who knows. [img]images/icons/shocked.gif" border="0[/img]