Everyone,<p> I am trying to get all of this mess off of my mind. I am trying to see that yes life can be happy again. It is time that I get myself together. You have all been here for me at my darkest hours. I will be forever in your debt.<p> This Saturday I am going to start getting the things together that was in our agreement. I haven't figured out how I will get them to her. Here is a question that I have asked before, but I am going to ask it in a different way this time. If I were to take those things out to the OM house and give them to her wouldn't that show that I am letting her go and that she is free to make her own choice? If I am not mistaken Dr. James Dobson said that didn't he? I know that I am in plan B, but won't this show acceptance of the situation?<p>Indy<p>[ November 29, 2001: Message edited by: INDY_357 ]</p>

Indy,<p>I am glad to see that you are starting do better. This is a hard thing to go through but you are making it, one day at a time.<p>As far as your taking her stuff to the OM's house... Are you afraid/concerned that it might show acceptance? And you don't want to show acceptance? Or is that you are wanting to show acceptance?<p>Yes, taking her things there does show acceptance on some level. Perhaps not acceptance of her relationship with OM, but acceptance of the legal agreement to giving her the stuff. <p>Why would you take it to his house? Why not just pack it up and put it on the poarch. You could make an arrangement with her, through your parents, to put it on the poarch at a time when she can come get it. Then you and the kids could go out so that you do not see her.<p>Don't get me wrong. Your taking the stuff to OM's house is an act of kindness. But it is also filling an EN for her.. you are taking care of her by doing this. You are making it easy for her. <p>Just a thought<p>Z

Indy,
GOod morning!<p>Yes, I agree with z. I think you can show "acceptance" - or "letting go" - by getting the stuff ready and letting her know she can pick it up. "Holding on" would be pitching a fit and saying no she can't have it, or begging or something. I wouldn't take it to her.<p>JMO. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>You're doin great! Hang in there!

As far as your taking her stuff to the OM's house... Are you afraid/concerned that it might show acceptance? And you don't want to show acceptance? Or is that you are wanting to show acceptance?<p> I am not concerned about it, but won't that change of direction make her think? Shouldn't I show acceptance.<p>Why would you take it to his house? Why not just pack it up and put it on the poarch. You could make an arrangement with her, through your parents, to put it on the poarch at a time when she can come get it.<p> Won't doing that show her that the kids and I are moving on? I want to show her that I am strong. Won't that show her that?<p>Don't get me wrong. Your taking the stuff to OM's house is an act of kindness. But it is also filling an EN for her.. you are taking care of her by doing this. <p> Let me ask this. How is taking these things to her filling an EN? <p>Indy

Taking the stuff to her is a form of affection and caring. You are making it easy for her. Taking some of the strain off of her relationship with OM. See if they had to find a truck, drive over there, arrange a particular time, then they are having to deal with reality. If you take it there then you are buffering her and taking care of her. That fills an EN.<p>If you pack it up and put it on the porch and give her the opportunity to pick it up AND are respectful about it, you are still showing acceptance and strength. You are still showing that you and the kids are moving on.<p>Either way is ok. It's up to you Indy. <p>z

Z and Faith,<p> Thanks for the quick replys. I would like to talk about again later today. I really have to get some work done. I will post later.<p>Indy

Z and Faith,<p> I put this in my last post last night, but I will let both of you know about it. The lawyer's office called me on Tuesday. It is hard to believe that it has been a month since I saw him last. Anyway, they want to schedule a time to talk to them about sending her a settlement offer. I haven't called back on that one yet. I asked them about the granishment from her wages for her support. Her lawyer was suppose to do it back in Oct. Well, her lawyer dropped her and it was never done. My lawyer did. It will be about three weeks and it will start coming out of her check. I don't know what reaction that will get. She tried to talk to me on Monday night. Needless to say I didn't. She hasn't called since. Is she tring to test my resolve? <p>Indy

bump.

Hi, Indy,
It's soooo frustrating trying to figure out what our WS's are thinking and doing. My H was in such a rush to get the D. Right before Thanksgiving, he told me he wanted to meet this past Monday to "negotiate" the settlement. I said ok, but decided I wasn't going to meet with him anyway... but I still haven't heard from him. Is he having second thoughts? Is he just busy and D is not a priority? Has he filed and keeping quiet about it until I'm served? I dunnooooo..... I try not to drive myself crazy wondering what's in his brain. It's mostly fog [img]images/icons/grin.gif" border="0[/img] . <p>i think you are doing everything you need to be, IMO. I don't think you should send over your settlement offer. It wouldn't hurt for you to talk with your lawyer and gather your ideas together, but I still wouldn't push the D forward - let your W do it. As far as the garnishment goes, let the lawyers handle all that also. You are only doing what you need to do to protect yourself financially, and for her to be responsible for her children.<p>Perhaps she hasn't called back because the harsh reality is slapping her in the face, and she is hiding from it.<p>just some thoughts.... I dunno if they help at all. <p>Faith1

Faith,<p> Perhaps she hasn't called back because the harsh reality is slapping her in the face, and she is hiding from it.<p> I wish that was the case. I think that she is finally happy that I am gone. I don't know either.<p> Also, she doesn't have a lawyer anymore. She was caught in a lie and on top of that she couldn't pay her.<p>
Indy<p>[ November 29, 2001: Message edited by: INDY_357 ]</p>

Everyone,<p> My WS said something to the kids earlier in the week about getting them today. I haven't heard from her all week. This is the first week that she has not tried to call the office, my cell, or the house. I wonder if she is just going to pop in and say that oh I would like to see the kids today. I guess I will have to wait and see.<p>Indy

Everyone,<p> She didn't get the kids today after all. I guess the OM and the friends are more important than them. How can any parent treat their children this way?<p>Indy

Indy, <p>The whole week? Sad but true. You are the better parent and your children deserve no less. <p>How unfortunate that a mother would treat their children as such. You though Indy, be there for them and in turn they will be there for you. You have a strength/bond with them that is growing stronger everyday. It does not mean that you will never disagree, nope far from it but the bond of family and love between you and your children will help you all withstand the enormous pain of seeing their mother and your W act so foolishly. Kind of feeling ashamed that a family member could go out there an be sooo different (putting it mildly) but that is what some of us have to live with. A wise man once said, a smart person learns from their mistakes but a wise person learns from the mistakes of others and doesn't repeat it. <p>Take Care,
L.

Indy,<p>I'm not surprised that she has not been around to see the kids. It's a fairly typical WS thing to do. STL's ex went weeks at a time not seeing the kids. Then she's show up and expect them to fuss all over her. The problem is that the kids want her love so badly that they do fuss over her. They also say that she is the best and STL and I are mean. She continually tells the kids that the reason she does not have them and that she does not see them much is because STL will not let her. It's such a crock but the kids want to believe it because they do not want to believe that their mom could just walk away from them. STL and I know that the kids express their anger at us because it is safe. We are not going anywhere. We will not abandon them no matter how mad they get. On the other hand it is NOT SAFE to be mad at their mother.. she already left them. If they express their true feelings for her and their hurt they may loose her 100%.<p>You may find yourself having to deal with the same issues. Be strong.. you are their rock. <p>I know that the last few months have been very hard for you but it sounds like you are starting to come through it all. <p>Z

Orchid and Z,<p> It is sad isn't it. I don't know what to tell you. Well, I was going to take the kids out to breakfast today, but they were just terrible today. I didn't react very well. I have calmed down and I hope that the rest of the day will be a little bit better. The kids asked today why mom hasn't come and gotten them for awhile. I told them that I don't know why she doesn't. It just seems like I and those kids were mistakes for her. I know that you can't answer this, but how does a mother go from being a real mom and wife to being nothing for the kids? <p>Indy

Hello all,<p> Well, things didn't work out yesterday for me to get that stuff together. I planned on doing it today, but my son has strep throat. That will keep me here today. While at the doctors office he saw other children with both of their parents there. He started to tear up. I asked him what was wrong and he wouldn't tell me. I even asked if it was because mom wasn't there. He still said no. I just needed to tell someone. It didn't help that was the place that we took our yongest to when she was ill. Thanks for listening to me.<p>Indy

Orchid,<p> I saw that you are out there tonight. How are you and the family doing today?<p>Indy

Indy,<p>Sorry to hear that your little one is not feeling well. Take good care of him.<p>One thing I note is that you're assuming that your son was tearing up because there were families there with both parents. He did not tell you that was why so becareful of jumping to conclusions. You may find that your children's concerns are not that closely alligned with yours. I read about a study that was done where children were asked what their worst fears were. The people doing the study assumed that "parents divorcing" would be in the to 5 of the concerns. Well it turned out that the kids' top fear was that they would set their pants in school and be humiliated. The next four or so concerns were also things that had to do with being a kid. Divorce and related issues were closer to #10. This was true even for the kids whose families were having trouble or already broken up.<p>Becareful about the "my poor kids, their mom left them" trap. If kids get wind that they are supposed to be upset about something, they will use it as an excuse and a crutch for as long as they can get away with it. It's just the nature of kids. Think of all the blackmale points they can get.... My mom/dad left, I'm so torn up, so I can not go to school today. I used to hear that one all the time. That one a at least a dozen more.<p>What I've told my kids over and over is that yep, it's tough to have a parent leave, just like it's tough to have a spouse leave. But life goes on. We have to find a way to put it in perspective so that it does not disroy our lives. Enough harm has been caused. It stops here and now. Then after listening to their feelings validating them, and giving them a pep talk. I make them get up and go to school.<p>You see, if they did not have the divorce to make parents feel bad, then they would have some misterious decease. My son's favorite before school decease was "my arms won't work decease". He'd actually lay there, grunting, trying to hard to move his arms. But they just would not work. Poor kid. I felt really bad for him because I, his mom had not sympathy. I'd dress him and make him go to school with arms that did not work. Of course by the time class started his arms were misteriously cured.. after all a kid needs arms to climb the monkey bars.<p>So hang in there dude. You're doing a crack up job.<p>Z

Z,<p> Thanks for the kind words. She just called about an hour ago. Here is what was said.<p>Me: Hello.
WS: Is XXXX there. (son)
Me: Yes, he is but he can't talk right now.
WS: Ok, is XXXXX there. (daughter)
Me: Yes, she is but we are getting ready to walk out the door.
WS: Ok, when is a good time? I am getting ready for work.
Me: I said that I am sorry but we need to go.<p>I then hung up the phone. I was very calm and not loving but nice. I was having a terrible day. It was very busy at work today. The strange thing was that upon hearing her voice it felt like all of it melted away. I don't understand that.<p>Indy

Dear Indy, <p>Forgive me for not posting in a while. How are you doing today? Is your son feeling better? <p>I wish I had the answer as to why any parent would be so neglectful in the fog. Just goes to show though that the A thing is not healthy for any family. NO matter what an OP or WS may say to justify it. <p>Reality is that there is no excuse. Therefore what the WS is doing out there with whoever, is inexcusable. The fact that the BS is willing to work and keep the family together in the interim is good and can last only as long as the BS can hold out and if the WS returns within that time. <p>Now the timetable varies and no one knows which one will outlast the other. That is the million $$ answer. <p>For right now, we can only be there for ourselves and our families. At MB we get the opportunity to be there for each other and I would like to take this opportunity to thank you for being there for me. <p>Mahalo,
L.