I have been married 5 years and been with my wife for 9. We have two young children ages 2@4.
15 months ago i betrayed my wifes trust and our vows by sleeping with an old girlfriend. It happened once, it wasn't a long affair. My wife learned of the affair and confronted me. I told her I was sorry and never had contact with the other women again. I realized how much I hurt my wife and we talked about what had happened.
One of her questions was why it happened, and I couldn't tell her because I didn't know. I love my wife very much and i had never betrayed her before or since.
The affair started as just meeting for coffee and talking, she was in a bad marriage and talked about it quite a bit. I wasn't in a bad marriage, my wife is the most caring and beautiful person i know. I realize now that we didn't talk enough and that my wife made the marriage to easy for me, I didn't really have to work at it,she did all the emotional work.
I thought that everything was ok in our marriage and thought we were moving on, I realize now that i didn't change and we still didn't make time for each other, i was willfully blind and thought things were good.
About 3 months ago i noticed a differnce in my wife, she was going out with friends more, coming home late, going shopping more then usual. I talked to her about it and she said she had given up on the marriage, she said she wasn't in love with me anymore.
I checked out different things and learned that she had been meeting another man for the past three months. She claims they just talk and she finds comfort talking to him. Whether or not there sleeping together really isn't the issue. She was sneaking around. She has told me she ended the affair, I hope she has but i know i can't force her to do anything, ultimately it is the results of my actions.
I told her that i was not willing to quit on our marriage, she tells me she loves me but is not in love with me.
For the past month i have been trying to show her how much i love her, we are talking more but she says she is finished and doesn't want to give the marriage and me one more chance. She has convinced herself that she can not ever truely love me again.
These feelings started when she started seeing this other guy. I love her and my children more then anything and i'm not willing to quit this early..............anyone gone through or going through anything similar?
I have told her i will give her space and continue working on the marriage alone for now. She does not want to go to counseling, i am going alone for my first visit tonight.
Any replies would be appreciated.

Bruins,<p>welcome to MB, you'll find a lot of very useful information on this sire. Lots of tips to get you started on saving your marriage. Research Plan A first and look at the EN section - this is a very good place to start. I'd suggest getting the book His Needs Her Needs and Surving an Affair. Both will help you.<p>What would really help you now is if your wife agreed to fill out the questionaire on emotional needs. This would give you an idea of the areas you need to work on. Then she needs to let you try to fill those needs. However, because of the way she feels towards you right now this might be difficult - but it give it time. Never give up.<p>You also need to start making changes in you and your behaviour. To try to become a better person. Somebody who can love and care in a better way than you have.<p>good luck, and get reading [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] when you're ready start posting your Plan A questions. You'll probably have very many [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>take care,<p>- Freddy

Bruins, Freddy gave you some very good information. Also, I wanted to add that your wife's affair is NOT YOUR FAULT. It was her choice, just like you had a choice to have an affair years ago and you CHOOSE to stay in the marriage and try to work things out.<p>You probably just didn't have the tools available to figure out what it was you needed to do. She was not able to let go and move past your affair, and regardless of whether or not she tries to blame your affair for her actions, please be assured, IT COULD VERY WELL HAVE HAPPENED REGARDLESS.<p>Affairs happen to more people than you think and it is a product of many things happening.<p>Your wife can learn to love you again, BUT she has to be willing and she has to agree to stop all contact with OM first.<p>Those are some pretty big but's. [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] <p>You'll find alot of people here going through very similar situations. Some are just starting and some have been through this and know exactly what to expect.<p>Please read everything you can on this site. Understand the mind of the WS, and realize that just about everything they say is "fog-talk" and you cannot and must not believe a word of it if you are to keep your sanity.<p>Start your plan A, work on yourself and make the changes you need to make for you.<p>I wish you the best of luck. I am very happy you are finally going to a counselor. It will make a big difference I think.
HbH

Just to add - go to any posts from redhat and you will find links to all of the posts for newcomers. Actually almost everybody here is going through what you are going through so read read read and ask questions when you need to. Sorry that you have to go through this too. K

Thanks mylife ... yes Bruins4, your situation is not unique. Do not fool yourself ... A is still in full force. Just check the 50 sign. Learn MB fast if you want to save your M. I know it is very hard right now to keep focus but you have to. Learn LB, HNHN & plan A quick.

Thanks for the help, i'll keep reading all i can.

Hi, <p>Read, listen, talk and learn. Not just you but your W (if she can). Look into the phone counseling sessions with either Steve or Jennifer. Click on the concepts page below the logo and read up on the info there. The book his needs/her needs and surviving an affair would be good. <p>Sounds like your W had a revenge affair. Not good but since this happened only recently your chances of recovery are still looking good. <p>Both you and W need guidance. My H stepped out similar to what you are saying. Now H says if he only knew how much I loved him he never would have done that. That's all water under the bridge and he is becoming a smarter man but only afer inflicting the worse pain a mate can do. <p>In your case, it appears your W is giving you a taste of your own medicine and it is a bitter pill to swallow. Ok, but with that knowledge there are things you can do and you both can do together. Revenge A's rarely last. Why? Because she did love you even though she says she is not in love with you now. <p>Read up and get prepared. Bumpy road ahead. Often referred to as the 'roller coaster'. Many have been on this ride and an A ticket is not required. Being thrown on this ride against our will is how most of us ended up here at MB. But I am glad I came here because I have learned and am learning how to handle me and help my marriage. <p>Hope you stay here does the same for you. <p>Welcome to MB.
L.

Hey Bruins,
Well I feel for you man. I am in the same boat as you are. I have been with my wife for 8.5 years. Been married a 1.5 of those 8.5. We don't have any children. When I read you post it sounded as if I wrote it. My wife got involved with a guy from her work. The same thing your wife said to you about she loves you but no in love with you and never will again. Well I got the same line. This site has helped me but to be honest I haven't seen anything different in my wife yet. I keep hoping that with time she might see things differently or start to feel in love with me again. Everyone will tell you give it time. I know giving it time is real hard to do. Well hang in there and just to let you know I am going through the same b.s. that your wife dished out to you. Neither you or I did nothing wrong. They choose to do something in their own way without coming out and talking to their husbands....

Thanks for the replies, it helps to know others have gone through the same nightmare.
I've been reading as much as i can and it helps, I know it would help alot more if my wife would read as well, but she says she has no desire to.
Counseling went well but again the counselor said it would be better if my wife would come with me. She Won't. I'm going to keep going I found it helpful speaking about the whole situation.
I talk to my wife tonight and she admitted that she had been seeing the om more often then she initially led me to believe, she said she still has feelings for him, but won't say that this is effecting how she feels about me.
She said she hasn't contacted on the phone but the problem is we all work for the same police department, my wife is a dispatcher and the om is a uniform cop, thier shifts overlap at times and they can communicate over the terminals, she said she said hi and asked him how things were going over the terminals a few days ago. I work in the detective office at a different division (they are in the same building)
I want to believe her that it has ended but with her saying she still has feelings for him make it difficult. She said he has been saying that he is in a bad marriage and he doesn't know if he loves his own wife. She won't admit that thier relationship is effecting how they look at their marriages.
I told her that I was not going to stop trying to save our marriage, I told her i was continuing to grow as person everyday and that i hoped that she may one day fall in love with the man i am striving to become.
She won't say she wants to give our marriage another try, but i am continuing to show her how much i love her. We are communicating better about most things, she doesn't want to have serious talks continually and i am honoring her wishes, we still have some and the end result is she has given up on us. I believe this is due to the om.
I am trying to give her space and hope now my actions will speak for themselves. This is extremely painful but i'm not showing her the pain. This web site has been a wonderful source of strength and inspiration.
Again any advice would be greatly appreciated
confused guy...hang in there it's tough but don't quit, it you love her it's worth the fight.

W wants to separate, i'm not sure of her true reasoning, i don't know if its so she can see the om more easily or not. i said i'm not leaving yet but agreed to give her all the space she requires.There are many reasons why i won't leave now and the main one is the kids.
any suggestions how to be seperate but still living in the same house?

Had a feeling the ww was still meeting with the om even tough she said she wasn't, i had never met the om so called him and met him in person last night. i kept my cool and talked to him for 1/2 hr. he confirmed my suspicions that the were still talking. after explaining alot of things to him he agreed to stop contacting her. i let him call my ww and tell her to stop calling and he told her he wouldn't be contacting her.
my wife was mad when i got home, didn't want to talk about it and left the house to go to one of her girlfriends. she got home and slept on the couch. i woke her this morning to tell her she could go up to bed cause i was going to work. i asked if she wanted to talk for a few minutes she said no. did i do more damge by meeting the om? it was something i felt i had to do for my own good, i feel a bit better today (physically) but i think i have pushed her further away. i don't know what i should do next. should i just give her space and live apart even though we are in the same house? i would appreciate any suggestions.

Dear Bruins4,<p>It sounds like your wife had an affair to get revenge. She has probably been in a lot of pain for all this time and resentment building from your affair.<p>I don't think what you did will draw her closer to you, in fact, expect the opposite, because now she will probably sneak to see OM again? Just a guess. If they are coworkers, she should probably switch jobs. I know it sounds drastic, but all remnants of OPs should be removed from both of your lives if you are going to rebuild a solid marriage.<p>You definitely need to assess what each other's most important needs are. It sounds like your wife has a big need for conversation. You need to be the one filling that, which means, you are going to have to make more time for her, regardless of your schedule. Drink some coffee! [img]images/icons/smile.gif" border="0[/img] I'm sympathetic, don't get me wrong, but some things in life are more important than sleep! (kidding)<p>
Read this Q&A column on Escaping the Jaws of Infidelity. It helps me A LOT as I deal with temptation A LOT. I found out that if you are a horny single person, you will end up being a horny married person! We have to protect ourselves from our own weaknesses and stop blaming anyone for our own failures in our relationships.<p>Sure, you didn't "plan" to have an affair, but did you have a good "affair-proof plan" in place? If we don't set goals to succeed, then we plan to fail by default. Hope this information helps you as much as it helps me. Good luck! You can win your wife back with MB principles! GO FOR IT!<p>http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi5024b_qa.html<p>Harley says,
"...I give the following rules to avoid
temptation: 1) Spend all your recreational time either alone or with your spouse, 2) no meals alone with someone of the opposite sex, 3) no rides in cars alone with those of the opposite sex, 4) never tell someone of the opposite sex thay you find them attractive or that you like them and 5) if someone of the opposite sex ever tells you that they find you attractive, start talking about how much you love your spouse."

Wife won't admit that the fact she has lost all her feelings for me and the desire to work on the marriage is the om. I told her to leave and explore her feelings but she won't. She says she misses the om and might love him (when she said that I thought my heart was going to hit the floor). I know i've have to give her space but it's hard trying to make things work when she won't even think about trying. I know their is alot of damage in our marriage but i know together we can rebuild. Hope someone has gone through something similar and the end result was a marriage that continues to grow.

Bruins4,
You intefere with the A, it is a no no .... you have not done your reading !. You got grade F. Lucky that OM is stopping the A but for how long he could resists ?. You have to plan A'ng her your butt out. Giving space etc, etc is good and required but it is not enough. Do not ask her to leave, you will have more difficulty to work on your M. You will your chance in plan B. Right now she is not only blaming you on past A, blaming you on her A and now she is blaming you on "breaking" her fantasy. You are looked as the cause of all her unhappiness !!!!. If you want a happy marriage and fullfiling M, stop doing more damage to your M and go do your home work on MB concept.<p>Sorry the harsh word but work on MB it will get you there.<p>[ December 09, 2001: Message edited by: redhat ]</p>

alot has happened in the few days, wife says she has stop contact with the om, although the reasons for this are more of him ending it. We had a couple of bad days, she was mad at me and i think blaming me for the affair ending. i left for a night and returned the next day. when i got home she was speaking with her mother (who lives with us in a basement apartment)who is 100% in favour of us staying together. She came upstairs and hugged me for the first time in months, she was crying and said that she wanted to try and make the marriage work. We talked for a bit and both agreed we have a long road ahead of us. She wants to put everything on hold until after the holidays then look into ways to try and save our marriage. she even gave me a second hug later in the day and told me she loves me. We had an excellent couple days, nothing serious but alot of the stress was gone.
then she got a call from her girlfriend, this girlfriend was her alibi alot of the time during the affair and has alot of her own problems. later that day my wife said she was feeling stressed and under alot of pressure again, i hadn't done anything to cause the pressure as far as i know and she doesn't want to talk. today she said she was still feeling alot of stress, i'm pretty sure she talked to her girlfriend again. i asked her if she wanted to talk and she said no. i got home from work before her so i got the kids fed and took them upstairs so she could have some time alone. when she did come up to see us i didn't get a hello, thank you, nothing. i was upset but rather then have any heavy discussion i went outside, she came out about 20 minutes later and asked what was wrong. i didn't say much just that i was having a bad day, i mentioned maybe we should talk a little, she said she didn't want to. we talkied for a few minutes but i could tell she was getting annoyed so i didn't say much, she did denied saying she wanted to try and work things out in the new year, she said that she said she was going to try and get to the point were she will want to try. i'm getting mixed signals but it seems like when she talks to this one friend we take a step backwards. i know i can't say anything about this friend...any suggestions or comments?

Yes, yes, yes, a well-meaning friend who has all the answers - my WW has one of those too [img]images/icons/mad.gif" border="0[/img] <p>In my WW's case, her friend is divorced (surprised?!), has had 2 men "on the go" just recently, and is generally totally screwed up relationship-wise.<p>My WW also works with her OM. In my case, they work very closely - she's his "mentor". So again, don't feel alone.<p>Anyhow, WW sees her friend as her only source of validation right now, and there's not a lot I can say about it. If I do, it'd be a big LB. So I don't do anything. Sounds like I'm being a doormat? Well, in a way. But sometimes that's what Plan A can feel like, because of the need to avoid LB. Be happy in knowing that Plan A doesn't last forever - in fact, it shouldn't last very long (see redhat's link).<p>Sounds like you're playing it fairly cool - that's really good. The more happy and relaxed you appear, the less tension in the air, the less likelihood of LB'ing, the more of a positive environment for WW, the more calm you can be, etc., etc., etc.

Hi Bruins,<p>I'm going to ask you something, and please, please don't be offended .... but I'm wondering if you are sure there is an OM, I mean, could it maybe be your wife is involved with her GF? From your posts it sounds as tho she goes back into the FOG when she talks or sees her.<p>Just a thought.<p>Jo

I'm 100% sure of the om...met with him and he admitted to talking/meeting with ww.

Wow!!! Someone feeling the same exact things I'm going through. Man, I feel for you!!! I really do. I didn't have an affair, but I did betray wife's trust. We were arguing and I pushed her. I totally screwed up. I've done the begging and the pleading, hasn't worked. I could swear that some of the things your wife has told you are the same as my wife told me. It hurts to hear those things. She moved out this past Saturday, so I have to deal with that right now as well. She asked for space and time. I couldn't do it at first, but now I have to. I've started anger management counseling, but wife won't even think about marriage counseling right now. She thinks it's too late. I'm going to change for myself and my son. Hopefully wife will wake up and realize I'm human and I screwed up. But I truly, truly do love her. I won't give-up on this marriage, it means to much to me. I just need her to want it as well. So, I'll try to wait patiently. I'll continue to pray to god everyday. I too wonder if there is OM in wifes life right now. But she swears up and down that there is nobody else. She say's I made her feel this way by hurting her.

Yo Bruins et al--
OK, well, the fact that she is confused and does still have a spark of emotion for you is good. You can grow an oak from an acorn, ya know. But here's what--you're gonna have to suck it up and take some hits without getting moody. Infact, now is the time to be fun, suave, romantic, ok with everything, at all cost! No matter what she says or how it hurts. This is a plan A. Do some things on your own--like go to the gym or hang with some buds. Let her see you happy and vibrant, even though you feel like you have lead in your stomach.<p>Don't prod, push, or insinuate. Don't ask pointed questions. Don't get pissed and stomp around. These actions will make you unattractive to her, and right now, yu gotta be the leading man.